29 December 2009

29/12/09


Thomas à Becket was murdered in Canterbury Cathedral in 1170.  Nearly 300 Oglala and Lakota Sioux were killed in the Wounded Knee Massacre in 1890.  Ireland became fully sovereign in 1937 when its current constitution went into effect and the 36 year civil war in Guatemala came to an end in 1996.

Born today:  Madame de Pompadour (1721-1764), William Gladstone (1809-1898), Pablo Casals (1876-1973), Jon Voight (1938), Rick Danko (1942-1999), Marianne Faithfull (1946), Alan Rusbridger (1953), Brenda Wildhack (1968), Jude Law (1972) and Kieron Dyer (1978).

It is, not altogether unsurprisingly, the feast day of St. Thomas à Becket.

289 comments:

  1. Good morning.

    Waddup, deano! Grey & miserable looking in my part of Yorkshire today, snow has mostly gone.

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  2. Thank you miss lovely

    I feel about the Wolds like the smallness of a fine woman's back.

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  3. 'Morning all.
    Bloody raining again.

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  4. putaputpautasplutter.....puttututatatatatarhmmrhmmmrmmmmmm...we're off!

    Just got the diesel generated internet connection up and running here in Arisaig in the North West Highlands.

    Nice to see everyone has had a great christmas. Me and the Wife have been visiting our teuchter (highlander) friends and family and will be up here for New Year, not that we have any choice, the roads are virtually impassable at the moment.

    The silver sands of Morar and views of Eigg are the perfect antidote to any CiF Chinese execution thread I can tell you.

    Anyway, Hogmanay at the village hall with a ceilidh, chunky jumpers, heart rending ballads about missing Scotland even though you are still there and uisghe bheatha flowing like the niagara falls.

    Have a good New Year all!

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  5. HNY to you too, Duke!

    I see you're close to Muck and Rum.

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  6. Morning all, Very bright and sunny over Central Europe +10C and only last week we had -10C.

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  7. Morning all! Happy Hogmanay and a Guid New Year to the Duke in case you can't get the diesel intarwebz to work again before then. Very jealous of your location. Sounds bliss.

    What is everyone else up to for NYE? I am off to a wee family party.

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  8. Medve

    Morning - can you send some of it our way please? :o)

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  9. BB

    Assuming you are to the (North) West that will be hard, given that the weather tends to follow the Jet Stream from West to East. Tell you what, I'll send it the long way round. Second thoughts, won't help, Siberia and and the North American cold bits are in the way

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  10. Off to the market for a bit of food shopping, as if we didn't have enough already. I'll check in again later.

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  11. Ah well, it's the thought that counts Medve! Thanks anyway :o)

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  12. Sounds good, Duke. Been offline-ish myself thanks to beardie Branson's empire letting me down.Ceilidhs bring me my out in cold sweats though, as I can never get my head around the complicated intricacies of the moves:freestyle's more my method of dancing.

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  13. Not one for the Gay Gordons then Alasdair? :o)

    I did a lot of scottish dancing when I was a nipper but I am not sure I can remember it much now. Last time I did any was my cousin's wedding about 10 years ago. Still, after a few drams, who cares if they make a complete eejit of themselves? :o)

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  14. Oh, I'll fight to the death for others' right to get Gay with the Gordons, Strip their Willows for all their worth, and indulge in Eightsomes that leave them Reeling, it's just not for me.I guess it's performance anxiety...

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  15. Deano:

    "not me"

    Spot on.

    Performance anxiety - heheheh

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  16. Oh lordy lord - the boy has just discovered that there is Spongebob Squarepants on the cartoon channel non-stop til 5.00pm.....

    ARGH!

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  17. Morning all

    Your Grace - how lucky you are to be in Arisaig and to be snowed up too...bliss.

    MsC

    I heard Hockney on the Today programme this morning (he was guest editor) - great to hear someone having a rant about the authoritarianism running rampant these days.

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  18. Having said that, he has the attention span of a small goldfish and has just decided that guitar-playing is more important that watching Spongebob! Woohoo! \o/

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  19. On the subject of authoritarianism and general buggering-up of things, this piece in today's Times is rather good...

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  20. ooh, hello all, the tinternet seems to be working! hurrah hurrah. well, it's raining in London so that's neither festive nor cheerful. hope other weather is better. am currently keeping everything crossed that my passport photos pass muster with IPS (can't think why they didn't call is the Passport and Immigration Service, heh heh) as I kept my glasses on AS THE BOOKLET SAID I COULD. They're thin framed, not tinted, and the frames don't impede seeing my eyes. AS THE BOOKLET SAYS IS OK. But apparently I stand only a 50/50 chance of getting through the scanner system. And if I don't, I have to try to get another appointment before I fly home Thursday...

    I was genuinely trying to be helpful. I'm a full-time glasses wearer and if the scanned photo is used also to ID people in crowds, then it showing me as I am is surely best? Quite apart from me not wanting to have to take them off fourteen times as I go through airport security, as I would no doubt drop or break them...

    Grrr.

    OK, rant over. Am looking forward to the Triffid denouement ce soir, and growling about not being here to watch the last of DT's Dr Who. Would anybody like to youtube that for me? ahem.

    Anyway, in case everything crashes again (I'm staying at a mate's flat, they're not here, things keep switching themselves off) HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!

    Enjoy.

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  21. Welcome back to those who've been absent for the festive fun.

    sheff

    I listened to Hockney on Today as well, respect to the man for speaking out!

    On the Highland Fling - me neither.

    Right, I'll take a look at that link to the Times now.

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  22. Stoaty



    I wish I had your discipline.

    Glad your back safe Sheff.


    Montana - have you actually seen the Northern Lights?

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  23. "At least I didn't touch the Bailys."


    god knows why it got missed out of the above .

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  24. Chin I liked your old picture better than this three legged China bit of a pot.

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  25. I've been pissed non stop since boxing day, cum the new year I'm going to grow up. I am.

    There is one thing that will save me - I have for the last decade been sober on new years eve..

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  26. I am so bloody sick of reading some of the threads these days. They are populated with NIMBYs, racists, morons and fascists. It really does make me feel physically sick today.

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  27. BB

    Same here.

    deano

    Why haven't you commented on Montana's article yet? Must have been one helluva session ..

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  28. BB you is a very fine lady don't let the bastards.......

    x.

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  29. That wonderful lass don't need my support - she's class.

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  30. annetan - my lovely I hope you are on top of the asthma today.

    x.

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  31. Hello and welcome Medve it's always a pleasure to greet more Untrusted.

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  32. deano, I've been tanked up since boxing day as well - on my way t'pub now.

    Scherfig, cheers for an excellent song last night.

    Oh and last thing, I made a comment on Montana's article, but it got deleted. Some lame joke about the type of prick required to burst a bubble. (I think the moderation was more to do with a failure of comedy than non-compliance.)

    Good health to all.

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  33. you have a promising future in front of you

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  34. @ BB. That thread on the bastard Borders Agency is turning quite vile. There I was, convinced a sign of a civilized country was that it offers refuge to those from overseas in fear for thier lives from oppressive,illiberal and disgusting regimes, but apparently this country is no longer at all decent to go by the hateful comments on there.

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  35. It's a confession not a boast

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  36. Was Hockney banging on about the smoking ban again? If so, fair play to him.

    Anyone been following the cricket? The Notts boys have done us proud.

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  37. No he was talking about the quality of the falling light

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  38. It's no good complainng about me Scorpio I would not have been here had it not been for you

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  39. I meant it when I said I wouldn't go back to that thread because they generally sicken me, to be honest, alasdair. They are full of hatred, innacuracy and misrepresentation - and I don't think I was over-reacting when I said that reading those kind of threads makes me understand how it is that Hitler and his like can actually be voted into power. Makes me shudder.

    Glad to see the comment from Toom calling me a leech and generally being personally vile to me has been removed though. Twat.

    SamWidges, on the other hand, clearly doesn't have a scooby about what a barristers' Chambers is or how it works if he would have me "removed". Also a twat.

    Another person wanting me to lose my job because he doesn't agree with my posts. How very open-minded of them...

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  40. hank

    Oh yes, Hockney covered the smoking ban in the Today prog.

    Alisdair

    That thread is very vile, and the mod's are already at work there.

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  41. "Hitler and his like can actually be voted into power."

    Your neighbours do that for you

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  42. Rain on the roof - time for sleep. Night all.

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  43. "It's no good complaining about me Scorpio I would not have been here had it not been for you"

    No truth in that rumour, deano. Your mother and I were just good friends.

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  44. BB Have you checked out the wankers posting on the Clive Stafford Smith article? I've posted a couple of things there. It's like being happy slapped by a gang of angry midgets with young conservative badges. Utter wankers.

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  45. Night deano.

    Think I'll pop out & do some shopping. The other half needs something roughly equivalent to a thermal vest and I'm determined that it will be something more chic than Damart. I couldn't possibly let him peg a Damart vest out on the washing line - the shame!

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  46. Oh Bitterweed before I fall asleep - thank you for that compliment I was right made up, "Blues in the Night" that man played a wild horn.....Night friends

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  47. Afternoon all - have done fuck all today - woohoo! \o/

    Can't even be arsed to log on to Cif.

    Am reading the new, post-Rebus Ian Rankin. Which ties in nicely with the Duke's comment: heart rending ballads about missing Scotland even though you are still there.

    Brill. We have that in Ireland too, although obviously about missing the Auld Sod instead....

    Dammit, it's only 20 past 3 and I'm going to have to turn on the lamp to read. Miserable day. Glad I'm inside with fire on!

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  48. thauma - wake up it's plainly 22 minutes past three.

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  49. Oh fuck it - I've had nothing to eat since boxing day I'm gonna have some pork sausage with red onion marmalade sandwiches and the I'm off to sleep

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  50. Shame on you, Deano - have the bloody food! But where're the veggies?

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  51. Hi all! seems like everyone has survived!

    I just about survived the "Italian" christmas of pannetone (dry old cake) and fish... plus one sister in law who is on a mission to wipe out corruption (she's bipolar and in a manic phase!), friend still in intensive care with 2 punctured lungs and various broken ribs...so all in all a right ripping time, infact it's my first xmas here (and predict my last) in 10 years and now I know why :)))

    Thaum also my dog has a claw prob but silly bugger won't let me near it and I ain't arguing with a 35kilo hound!

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  52. Talking of CiF, some fuckwit (copyright MW) is slagging off MW as 550th comment with little evidence of having comprehended the piece, let alone having trawled through the comments. I'll go over and check out Clive Stafford Smith's article which I have avoided until now out of sadness. Duty calls.

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  53. Gandolfo, that sounds awful - what happened to your friend, if you don't mind my asking?

    My dog's the same size as yours but she's very good about that sort of thing. The claw's come off now, leaving a little nub. Must be sore, but she seems OK barring being rather lethargic.

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  54. BW - I did look at the Clive Stafford Smith threads and decided not to bother. That is what started me off in a bad mood. Then the UK Bollocks Agency one made me even crosser so I said my piece and I am leaving it alone even though the majority of the posters as usual don't have a bloody clue what they are talking about and adopt the "Deport all immigrants!!" stance from the offset. As well as calling me a leech for working in the field.

    Medve - I also saw the last few posts on Montana's thread and was appalled by them. Some people just seem to think being nasty on the intawebz is an intelligent pastime. I don't usually report abuse, but I did report one guy on there who said if Montana was him mum he would kill himself. What a cretinous thing to say.

    I wonder about the ages of some of these eejits, frankly, because that is the kind of comment you would expect on YouTube

    Deano - eat something!

    Thaum and gandolpho - hope the doggies are better soon. I quite like pannetone though, with butter or thick cream on it. Yum.

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  55. And gandolpho - sorry, forgot to pass on my best wishes to your mate in hospital. Hope he is ok.

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  56. HI Thaum!
    Yes darlin' of course you can ask! this friend of mine had an accident on xmas eve on his motorbike there are these stupid things that they have to define traffic lanes in rome that are like huge round cat's eyes but without the reflective bit so you can't see them, loads of people have been killed on bikes but they are still there. Well he didn't see them, no street lights, and hit one full on and landed full pelt into a wall....he's lucky to be alive, the accident happened close to one of the big hospitals here so I reckon that saved him...but he's out of danger now :)

    As for dog mine is a wimp, today he went out at 6am to pee and refuses to leave the house because it's raining wont even get his lardy arse out of bed and he's only 4 yrs old! He also got 2 dew claws on his back legs...didn't realise they were rare.
    He's also a great actor talk about hamming it up should of called him Dickie Attenborough........

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  57. Hi BB! and thanks!

    I quite like pannetone though, with butter or thick cream on it. Yum.
    They'd have you 'ere for that! But I'll try it got another one to get through!! arghhhhh

    The CSS thread is so depressing but the fact that the majority of posters are one off basket cases reassures me...god that poor poor man and his family must be desperate..
    boycott is what I say... fucking disgrace their HR record no one should be doing business with that country until it stops killing...1,700 (min) cases last year

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  58. Oh fuck - I didn't get on Montana's thred before it closed..................



    Montana .................I don't suppose you would like my babies.......................................................................... I quite understand..

    Sleep can't be that far away...

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  59. As I've been out of the Cif loop for a few days, did either BB or annetan also have an article published in the same series as Montana's?

    I've steeled myself with a couple of glasses of red so am just off to read MW's piece and the resulting carnage...

    @BW - you've got mail, matey.

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  60. Hi Gandolfo, oh, what bad luck for your friend. Glad to hear he's on the mend.

    I think our dogs must be related - mine hates the rain too and is very hard to shift off the bed.

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  61. I am so sorry to be a boring and painful tit - today I just cannot find the comma that leads me into sleep

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  62. Bitterweed, under which handle did you post? couldn't find any Bitterweed, but there were plenty of wankers as you said. perhaps CiF stands for Compassion is Fucked.

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  63. Very worrying, deano. I should get your colon checked out if I were you.

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  64. Hah! My one and only comment on the UKBA thread is mentioned in "You said it" though. Good.

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  65. That fucking bastard Mungo just stuck his tongue up my nose - I am not going to die Mungo.I'm not.

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  66. BB yes, and some other actually suggested the child should shoot his mother. I'll go off and report it for incitement to murder .. back soon.

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  67. Deano Asthma much better today thanks!

    Alisdair - disagreed with a lot of the times article but agreed totally about box ticking!

    Everyone - the weather is wet and miserable hear in S wales but I am having a wonderful restful time veging out with books internet and tele when I can find something worth watching!

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  68. Oh dear! miserable here. My spelling is awful sometimes!

    Just heard buyers have withdrawn their offer! So back to drawing board and have lost that lovely flat probably! Hey Ho ! Not the only flat in the area I am sure!

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  69. Yeah, I forgot. It had already been deleted, but a reply quoting it by pakichick had not. So I've reported that instead. pakichick also added some nastyness of her own.

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  70. Anne - that sucks!

    Still, it obviously wasn't the right time. I am sure you will find an even better flat in the New Year! :o)

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  71. annetan - glad to hear your well - I just need to get to the end of the sentence and trhen sleep.

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  72. Shit babe I sorry I am slow at the reading annetan

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  73. @ annetan42, I'm saying that Times piece is brilliant, but I do think a moratorium on grand projects, an end to trying to control every last bit of this unpredicatble thing called existence would be no bad thing, at least for a period. Not forever, but simply until everything settles down a bit. Too much acting in haste ('something must be done'), and buggering all repenting going on, especially with New labour (and the Tories will be as bad).What'd be good would be a low-key 2010, no great excitement, allowing for some contemplation, some deeper thought than seems to happen in Govt and Whitehall, and some consolidation/retrenchment rather than more and more alleged progress with the flimsiest of foundations, little supporting evidence resulting in dreadful (presumably) unintended consequences.

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  74. I am sorry to be crass on a day when you have had bad news annetan -but your wiser than most

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  75. Sheffpixie said...

    "I couldn't care less what bitey thinks of my parenting" and you're quite right to as I've said nothing about it or indeed you until you decided to intervene on your return from Turkey with the opening gambit - "Am beating myself up for my appalling parenting over the years." And while I quoted this in my response, it was about your work that I commented, not about your parenting, of which I know nothing.

    You on the other hand have taken it on yourself to act as the Bitethehand monitor for The Untrusted, a job you seem to do quite well, with your "Bitey alerts" every now and then. You did ask me on one occasion about a national day for young men between 16 and 25, to which my reply was "Great idea; let's have a 16 -25 year old stay at home for a day doing washing up, cleaning, making beds, cooking meals." Interesting given the criticism made of me recently that I never comment about men and their parenting / housekeeping skills.

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  76. Oh lordy.

    The creature from the black archive is back. Cue for me to go and watch some telly.

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  77. @Bitey - you referred the other day to your "agenda", which precluded any chance of you joining this little community.

    Care to explain what precisely that "agenda" is?

    As for having ideas about young men between 16 and 25, wouldn't they be a little withered for your tastes?

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  78. Hahaha! Excellent!

    My lad has got the perils of advertising spot on!

    The new "Virgin" add shows a Dita von Teese lookalike doing a pretend burlesque thingy and me laddo says:

    "Hahah! I'm going to buy that now! There's a chance of nudity!"

    Still, most of the posters on Montana's thread will accuse me of metaphorically castrating him for his being aware of rampant sexism when it is forced in front of his nose...

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  79. BB - nice one from your son, and just ignore old Gollum. No doubt his 'agenda' is to goad one or more of us into something he can post all over the internet.

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  80. Hank

    The agenda is kind of self-perpetuating really. He is trolling - and I use the word advisedly - back through everything anyone has ever written about him and replying to it, on the basis that we will then reply to that, which then gives him more grist for his sicko mill, and so ad infinitum.

    Still, it is more entertaining that what is on telly at the moment. Wallace and Gromit are on in 20 mins though...

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  81. Thaum - yeah. Although it would seem that it was his propensity for doing that which ultimately led to him being banned from CiF in the first place. So one presumes that if he starts that game again, the mods will spot it and banzor him again under his new nick too.

    I think he should just set up an "Untrusted Watch" with his own blog so he can post all the "mean" things people say about him. If he hasn't already...

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  82. Good morning/evening, everyone! Lazy morning for me -- up late last night with the boy, playing games. I could kiss my sister right now -- she gave him a Wii Fit board for Xmas, as my parents were going to give him a game for his Wii that required it (the Wii was his one present from both the grandparents and me last year). I absofreakinglutely love the thing!

    Haven't been back to my thread to see how it all ended. I just can't believe how effing stupid some of the people commenting on it were. And I'm also perplexed as to why my rather innocuous article attracted more of the numpties than Bindel's article admitting that she'd managed to meet three gay men who aren't total shitbags.

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  83. When I was little, my grandmother told me that sores would go away faster if I didn't pick at them.

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  84. I admire him, BB, but I don't understand him. If you were really into masochism, as his efforts on here would suggest, why would you choose to be flogged by little Thai boys?

    If he was consistent and hardcore, he'd get himself banged up in a Scottish prison. He'd get all the attention he craves there.

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  85. Montana, did Bindel really post that article? Ha ha! The only one I've read since breaking up is yours.

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  86. Hey Montana

    Don't mention Wii fit. Makes me feel guilty as I look at ours and do nothing about it... :p

    And yes, if you pick it, it will never get better!

    Hank - True. True.

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  87. HankScorpio
    "Very worrying, deano. I should get your colon checked out if I were you."
    Ha ha!
    Deano - I think you should forget about sleep - and caesura the day! That was a terrible "joke" (I blame my parentheses).

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  88. AlisdairCameron
    "What'd be good would be a low-key 2010, no great excitement, allowing for some contemplation, some deeper thought..."

    Next glass I raise will be to that thought. I suspect 2010 might have other ideas - years seem more unkind as they build up.

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  89. Timothy Spall. Net curtains. Vest & Pants. Stains. Notebook.

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  90. BW

    I have told you before. DO NOT write things like that when I have a drink in my hand! :o)

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  91. Heyhabib

    I think it is time you put a full stop to that, matey. Dash it all.

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  92. annetan42,
    if your looking for something on BBC iplayer that passes some time, my niece and her son had Bridge to Terabithia on over the weekend. Don't know if you've seen it, but it moved this cynical old soul. It's not a "Narnia" or "Lord OTR" fantasy that it's advertised as.

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  93. BB - there's a joke about backslash, but i fear it would be inappropriate.
    :-)

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  94. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  95. Hank
    Got that message BTW. Reply in post me old mucker.

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  96. heyhabib

    Sounds pervy. Tell me!

    BW - pah!

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  97. annetan42
    Here's slightly premature best wishes for a better New Year.

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  98. I've changed my mind about train-spotters

    They make excellent stalkers

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  99. Hank! I'm half white??? That explains a lot of things. Well two things - my inability to dance and my dazzling good looks. Jeez I hope my dad could dance.

    Loved Hinge and Bracket since I was a kid.

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  100. Thauma -- Bindel's change of mind. Essentially, she says that she's made friends with three men (Shaun, Gian and Paul) and that they're not rapists or wife-beaters and she actually kind of enjoys being around them. They are, one gathers from what she wrote, all gay -- so one assumes that Julie still thinks het men are evil.

    BB -- get the Wii Fit Plus disc. The new/extra games on there are really fun. My favourite is a Kung Fu thing where you keep a rhythm and do the kung fu moves that the other Miis do.

    Annetan -- sorry about the house sale falling through. Hopefully a new buyer will show up soon!

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  101. "Hank! I'm half white??? That explains a lot of things. Well two things - my inability to dance and my dazzling good looks.

    ROFLMAO!

    Monkeyfish

    Trainspotters, did you say?

    Choose life...

    (Car alarm snake's arse warning for BW though)

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  102. @thauma - songforHank? Wrong track from Hunky Dory, surely should have been this one...

    queenbitch

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  103. What a sweet, beautiful video, Thauma. I'm all verklempt now.

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  104. LOL Hank - noticed you posted Life on Mars yesterday (?) and thought I'd pick my next fave ... and I thought I was the Queen Bitch around here, eh?

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  105. @Montana - finally made it through to the end of your thread. Have to say that I could understand some of the criticism from the knee-jerkers who only manage to read the first para before posting.

    I hate the whole Guardianista thing about buying boys an Action Man with no weapons other than a white flag and a pasta cookbook.

    Never been a pacifist. There's a role for the military, and violence is sometimes the answer. Often the answer in fact, if you grew up in council estates and comprehensive schools.

    And I'd still rather give Fred Goodwin, Dave Cameron and Matt Seaton a good kicking rather than expose them to the full fury of the legal system, given the choice.

    However...

    ...having said that, I thought the second half of your piece was really moving.

    And your posts down-thread were brilliant, and gave the lie to your pacifist pretensions!

    Just make sure the bastards pay you before they run out of money.

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  106. Montana, it's gorgeous, isn't it? Just stumbled on it.

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  107. Hank - I think the label is the problem and not the reality of 'gender-neutral' toys. When you think of it, what are they? Presumably stuffed animals, board games, books, colouring books, lego, etc.

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  108. Violence was never the answer to a question, just a response that created more questions. On the world stage, or on a council estate, it generally just made your enemy recoil and think about a better way to beat you.

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  109. "Stuffed animals", thauma? Let's not encourage Bitey.

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  110. When I came out as a lesbian, in 1978, there was a vibrant women's liberation movement in the UK.

    I met Gian, a radical psychiatrist


    Well, you couldn't make it up, could you? Luckily we don't have to. Thx Julie.

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  111. heyheyhabib - don't agree, mate. In fact I violently disagree.

    Nothing worthwhile was ever won without violence.

    I think that's why the Cif/Guardian worldview gets right up my fucking nose.

    "Everything would be so much better if we were all a little bit nicer, a bit more polite, and asked nicely for some concessions."

    Why would the powerful make concessions to the less powerful unless they were threatened? And given that they have all the economic power, how else can they be threatened than by attacks on their personal security?

    It's bollocks, as anyone with a passing knowledge of history will tell you.

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  112. Good god, Hank. No wait, that's nearly as bad an expression as 'stuffed animals'. Let's go for 'soft toys', shall we?

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  113. Oh wait, that has its problems too....

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  114. I'm with Hank here. Regrettably, violence is often the only efective answer. Whether it's on a personal level like a reaction to playground bullying or on a political level like the Vietnam war, sometimes violence is necessary. Sad but true. 'Politeness' is much overrrated.

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  115. Evening all...
    Well of all the articles that I've got through of the "I've changed my mind...." series the most *disappointing* was allyf's. It really is a sign of the times when basically someone is advocating local protest over mass protest as the means to get results. To me it was another demonstration of nimbyism or rather i only get off my arse if it directly affects my life attitude...maybe i wrongly interpreted it but it pissed me off....
    and for bitey a song you need to listen and contemplate in a kind of buddisty way ...

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  116. I don't see the Rothschilds of this world being disturbed by my sentences

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  117. On a personal level I trie to avoid violence...but for sure in certain circumstances there is no alternative.....never seen a peaceful revolution........

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  118. I'm a Buddhist, ergo a pacifist. I am looking forward to the day where war is considered with the same disgust that slavery is.

    But that's just me.

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  119. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  120. All right, it's official: the Untrusted/Cif Midlands drinkypoos is taking place at the Rose and CrownM in Warwick on Saturday the 9th of January starting at 1:00 pm. Identification will be by way of wild rolling eyes, or alternatively there might be a Guardian on the table.

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  121. I'm a would be Quaker I'm looking forward to the day when slavery is considered with the same disgust

    But I'm still very fond of you BB

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  122. Oooh!

    Warwick is actually only just up the M40 innit? I would have to stick to diet coke, but I will check with Im Indoors to see what the plans are.

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  123. George Orwell got shot in the throat in Spain, fighting fascists. He put his money where his mouth was. Who else would you like to protect your freedoms, BB? (Since you won't do it yourself on pacifist grounds.)

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  124. Sells Black Sheep - sounds promising.

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  125. HankScorpio,
    personally, I've won plenty of worthwhile things without violence, but I know that's not what you meant.

    The powerful do not generally make concessions to the less powerful, I agree, but getting violent with them can result in being "bombed into a new stone age", while the peaceful work of The Obvious Pacifists and latterly the enlightened activists of the ANC and IRA have yielded great results.

    scherfig
    I've got to stand firm and say violence is often a consequence but never an answer.

    Gandalfo, Václav Havel came to lead a peaceful "velvet" revolution twenty years ago, to this day.

    I've also got to hold my hypocritical hand up and say I have been in pointless fights.

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  126. Scherfig, good man, Orwell, but Spain was fascist until 1976.

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  127. scherf

    You are making the assumption that armed conflict is the only way, because it has been the only way thus far.

    300 years or more ago, slavery was the only way for capitalism to work, wasn't it? Because that was the way it had always worked.

    Co-operation and negotiation has to be a better way than conflict. But I am not expecting to see that change in my lifetime - just working towards the day in which it will; the day in which everybody will find violence abhorrent as any form of solution.

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  128. Deano

    I have a reet soft spot for you too, my love xx

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  129. BB - I very much hope our northern and southern friends will join in! Yes, it's just off the M40. Would love to see you there.

    Hank - haven't listened to your links yet but I'm pretty sure I know what the first two are and love them. May the road rise with you.

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  130. Hehehe

    That choon always reminds me of the film Rush Hour, Hank. Hilarious scene with Jackie Chan trying to sing it. :o)

    I love this one too, though...

    Tell me why, tell me why, tell me why?

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  131. Too right, Hank. But we've got Cif now, who needs petrol bombs?

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  132. Co-operation and negotiation has to be a better way than conflict. But I am not expecting to see that change in my lifetime

    i have seen it,,i look in the mirror and there it is,,

    think global act local be the change

    you cant control any thing except yourself

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  133. everybody will find violence abhorrent as any form of solution.

    BB, I think most people find violence abhorrent (as do I) but that doesn't mean that it doesn't work. And forget the slavery/capitalism argument, that's just nonsense. Try cooperating and negotiating with the playground bully or Pol Pot. Good luck!

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  134. Oh, Hank, how could you? I mean, the vid to PiL was great (hadn't seen it before), but how could you not put this one as your reference for the last? (I think the original version?)

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  135. I promise you BB I would shoot over your head

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  136. "latterly the enlightened activists of the ANC and the IRA have yielded great results..."

    ...because they were offering a ceasefire, because the violence the militant wings of the ANC and the IRA resulted in the other side being dragged to the table in the first place.

    You are trolling on this argument, habib, surely?!

    Did you never hear about Sharpeville or Bloody Sunday?

    Do you know nothing at all about the Boer War, the Potato Famine, the bloody history of the British Empire and all the working class kids on either side slaughtered in the pursuit of plunder for the Churchill/Blenheim/Marlborough families?

    You're supposed to be a scouser, habib. Surely you know about the history of slavery, and how Liverpool's wealth was built on the corpses of the exploited.

    That's dead people, habib. Real people who were worked to death to enrich people who believed in violence in its basest and most cowardly form.

    Jeez, did you get all your political knowledge from the Daily Mail's History of the World for Impressionable Kids?

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  137. Thank you for the tune Hank - my eyes are blue

    Your understanding of the history is mine too

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  138. I would really, really, like to think that the ANC and the IRA could have found a solution with violence. Especially as I was very nearly a victim of one of them - no prizes for guessing which.

    The demographics in Northern Ireland would suggest that political change would have taken place through the ballot box, violence or no, since there was a democratic voting system in place. (Although I'm not saying that the
    IRA campaign didn't highlight the very real prejudice against Catholics in work, housing, etc.)

    Not qualified to comment on SA. But I can't stand their rugby team, especially Bakkies Botha. Thug.

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  139. Hi habib

    depends what your pov is on the velvet revolution is... for sure it was peaceful but why...? many saw it as being orchestrated by the KGB in order to establish themselves within power structures....
    and also do you think that had the demonstrators been attacked by the police and armed forces they would have laid back and taken it? Personally i doubt it..

    Personally I don't advocate violence but having lived in south and central america and seen how the police and military slaughtered people, tortured and disappeared them I would think twice about retaliating and if that meant a gun in my hand I'd do it....

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  140. Gah! Of course I meant *without* in my first sentence....

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  141. last para "I wouldn't think twice" oops!

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  142. Oh Miss Diesel dog makes such wonderful noises when I feed her......pure simple purring pleasure

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  143. thaum SNAP!!! think it's cabin fever....!! dog finally moved his lardy arse and went for a pee only after 15 hours chance of a world record???

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  144. I knew you meant without and I knew you wouldn't think twice

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  145. Hank - have to say I'm with you on this one. I am, I hope, a non-violent man, but I also hope I'd be prepared to give that up where necessary.

    There's an SF alternate history story where the Germans and Japanese take over India at the end of WW2, and General Model is faced with street protests led by Gandhi and Nehru. He has them both shot in the neck in the back yard, and then tells an aide that he couldn't understand why the British had problems.

    Maybe that's Godwin's Law, and maybe that's sad, but fighting will be necessary pending some unforeseeable circumstances and changes in humanity.

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  146. You win, Gandolfo, had to physically chuck the lazy bitch out after on about 14 hrs.... :-)

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  147. andysays said...

    “First Montana, then BeautifulBurnout and now sheffpixie. As far as I can see, all these three have done to incur your displeasure is to be ordinary* women who have found ways of coping with combining the roles of mother and breadwinner in what is still a patriarchal society.”

    Patriarchal?

    I’m afraid you’re letting your imagination run away with you andy as apart from quoting her own tongue in cheek words, I’ve never said anything about sheffpixie and know even less. I've made known my views on Montana’s sterling work as a single mother and as an internet pioneer. As for
    BeautifulBurnout, she has chosen to announce to the world things about her son’s personal life, which I suggest any 14 year old would find embarrassing in the extreme. She has defended her actions and put her trust in her anonymity. But not long ago she was expressing her delight, along with many of us at the leaked BNP membership list. How long will it be before someone at The Guardian, possibly a disgruntled employee, leaks the identities of those who post anonymously, or who hacks into the server that contains the google blog information?

    You continue:

    “I’ve already mentioned in the past that I have a daughter who lives with her mother rather than me, and now I’ve revealed that I’ve chosen to move from London to Cornwall, thus “abandoning”
    my daughter.”

    You might have mentioned it but I wasn’t aware and without far more details of your personal situation and the agreement you have with both your daughter and her mother how am I or anyone expected to comment, if in fact that’s what you’re aiming for?

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  148. In the 80's I found myself in the strange philosophical position of 'condoning' ANC violence in South Africa while 'condemning' IRA violence in N. Ireland. In retrospect, and being totally honest about it, I wonder if the perceived 'righteousness' of the ANC cause (very trendy in London at that time) took precedence over the more uncomfortable fact that the kids who were blown up at a bus-stop in Johannesburg were much less close to home than the kids who were blown up at a bus-stop in Enniskillen. Life is messy and violence is ugly, but I have no time for bleeding heart liberals who just say ' let's be friends' and don't have to face the brutal reality of the world we live in.

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  149. Hi deano! How's things?
    Just informed lardy Thaum...he raised his eyebrows and winked and then resumed normal service.....

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  150. Scherfig - I know exactly what you mean.

    Gandolfo - my current task is to persuade the lazy bitch to go outside before we retire for the night. Wish me luck.

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  151. Scherfig - I know what you mean. I was very peripherally involved with expatriate ANC/Umkhonto we Sizwe supporters at the beginning of the 1990s, as well as with Irish republicans from the 1970s onwards. (Where 'involved' means knowing well and arguing with.)

    The equivalence between things like Enniskillen and the Church Street bombing in Pretoria seemed clear to me; not so much to the fully committed.

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  152. The time-honoured words "time to go out before bed" didn't even have the effect of an ear-twitch, but some slightly more forceful language has done the trick.

    Speak to yous all later...!

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  153. gandolfo - things are fine. I have no more booze and am starting to drink water in preparation for being sober at new year.

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  154. I've never not condoned violence, physically or virtually. I love a fight and have the nose to prove it. Which is why I would love to meet Bitey and certain other loudmouth fuckers face to face and toe to toe.

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  155. Bah.

    Just because something is doesn't mean it always has to be.

    Violence begets violence. Until the cycle is broken, that will always be.

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  156. BB - 'violence begets violence', but sadly non-violence doesn't beget non-violence. At least not necessarily.

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  157. @Bitey - c'mon, little man, I've done my best to wind you up, to incite a response. Surely you've got something to throw back at me....

    ...C'mon, bitey, let's me and you fucking dance to the death, paedo....xxxx

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  158. Thaum well done harsh words that or a biscuit trail! :)
    Deano I drink to you health for you on NYEve!!;)

    BB Buddist also use violence as a last resort :)

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  159. Re: violence. It is precisely the fact that I have come to realise of late that violence will probably be the only way to take our respective countries from the greedy shite who have stolen them away from us and who are steadily taking away our civil liberties and the gains that were made in the late 19th/early 20th C. by trade unionists who were not afraid to lose their lives to make those gains on our behalf. That we have so carelessly allowed as much of those gains to be snatched away from us as already have been is to our great shame and a huge dishonour of the brave men and women who fought on our behalf.

    I wish I could still believe in non-violence, but I don't. When I say that I'd like to be there at the barricades, I mean it. Sadly, I don't hold out any hope of it happening here -- certainly not in my lifetime. I have more hope for Britain, however. Geography alone will help you and you have a stronger tradition of nationalisation and a better picture of what could be.

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  160. You won't be able to fight with me cos I will run away! :o)

    Reminds me of the old buddhist tale where someone is questioning a buddhist monk about his non-violent stance.

    "But imagine you walk around a corner and there is a gang of youths who want to attack you and rob you? What would you do then?"

    "I wouldn't walk round that corner..."

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  161. Oh crap. Sentence too long -- turned into a fragment.

    "It is precisely the fact..." should have ended, "that I was referring to on my thread when I referred to my changed views on violence."

    Actually, it should have been more than one sentence, but you're all smart folk. You'll be able to figure out what I was on about.

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  162. Violence begets violence.

    Bullshit. Injustice and lack of empowerment begets violence. Poverty, hunger, misery begets violence. And violence is not always an inappropriate response.

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  163. Well said, montana. I still think that the UK is more tied to political activism than it is to Buddhism and paedophilia.

    Which might explain why the Guardian only sells half a dozen copies every day...

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  164. Your experience and mine are completely different, Scherf, so I am not gonna argue with you on that point. Fair dos.

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  165. BB I love you to bits - but you need to understand that the likes of Mr Frank Fisher would destroy my grandchildren so that his daughter's pony could have hay.

    What do you think MAM would do to us if herm had the chance.

    These people appear to believe in Eugenics - I do not.

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  166. I have more hope for Britain

    You can forget that delusion, montana. The British have never gone in for revolution, they're sheep. When the proletariat in every other European country was kicking against the traces, England came up with Cromwell and Milton.

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  167. A song for BB :0) Heavy, maaaan!

    war

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  168. I dunno, scherf, I think that's a bit unfair. The British have just been out of step. Kicking off the Reformation without civil war, having two revolutions with a regal execution and a military dictatorship along with a parliamentary coup run by foreign mercenaries who went native, and doing just enough to palm off the Chartists in 1848 while harbouring Marx and the Russian and Polish romantics... Not too bad, really?

    Oh, OK, Milton was a bureaucratic fascist. Who wrote poetry. Could have been worse.

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  169. Scherf

    That video was harsh and un-called for when I have offered you the olive branch. I will twat you for that when I see you, you bastard! :o)

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  170. scherfig hi I'd agree with you on this
    Peterj hi the british have never been *in step* as far as I can see in the modern world

    class innit...*the British* firstly aren't a united force, the English are too occupied with social division and now it's even more split than ever, The Scots are more likely to pull it off, the Welsh..no idea

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  171. Agree with you there, gandolfo; I used 'British' cause scherfig did. The Civil War was often England v Scotland v Ireland v Cornwall v The North as far as it was Parliament v The King. A new English revolution would be unpleasant for lots of us here; a new Scottish one after an independence vote would be a drawn-out farce. Not sure where any of this leaves us now, though.

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  172. PeterJ, Cromwell was an authoritarian religious fanatic. Milton was an apologist for the 'read your bible, you'll get your reward in the next life' brigade. And the monarchy was restored a few years after Cromwell's death. Keep tugging those forelocks, peasants. The English don't do 'revolution'. Empire and subjugation of the darkies is more their style (sadly a bit out of date now, so foreign adventures in Irag and Afghanistan are the current substitute.) And just to stress that this is not an anti-English rant, I'll throw in the imperialism of the Spanish, French, Portugese, Belgians, Germans etc etc. Terribly bad chaps, all of them.

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  173. HankScorpio
    "You are trolling on this argument, habib, surely?!"
    "Jeez, did you get all your political knowledge from the Daily Mail's History of the World for Impressionable Kids?"

    Well, cuz, forgive me for missing the troll, but you're used to people dead against you or dead for you, as you are a non-pacifist, so I'll let that go...

    "because they were offering a ceasefire, because the violence the militant wings of the ANC and the IRA resulted in the other side being dragged to the table in the first place."
    I don't think that one side was dragged to the table any more than the other. Maybe they all came to realise that violence was self-defeating.

    That supports your argument that violence wins things, because it's shown not to. Nice for the planners, not so good for the victims.

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  174. Steady on, BB, I think you have misinterpreted. If a gay icon can't stand up for pacifism, who can? It's a shame that he got convicted for violently abusing a rent-boy, but it's still a great song (imho). How about this instead?

    somebody to love

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  175. Hey habib - that was a classic case of Ernie Bevin's maxim about walking naked to the negotiating table.

    I like you, habib, but I think I'm a better dancer(-;

    yeh!!

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  176. Scherfig - well, it could be argued that the Restoration was a popular revolution against Cromwell's militaristic dictatorship (though probably not by me) after his death.

    And Milton wasn't just a God-botherer; he thought Cromwell was a backslider and would have preferred a perpetual dictatorship of the politically republican and righteous.

    He would probably have both hated and loved this:

    Calvary

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  177. Just for fun, if anyone is taking drugs, this works. And if your not taking drugs (Bitey!), it still works.

    white rabbit

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  178. scherfig

    Oo, snap! I was just linking to the same thing for the very same reason.

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