21 December 2009


Most of you probably realise that today marks the 21st anniversary of the Lockerbie air disaster.  I'm always unsure of how to handle dates like today's.  To casually include something like Lockerbie alongside inanities like the premier of Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs seems to trivialise it, but I sometimes worry that devoting the daily thread to the memory of a single event is excessively morbid.  After all, life goes on, even for the families.  How long does it take before something like the Lockerbie disaster gets relegated to the status of just something horrible that happened years ago?  Does it loom larger in my mind than it otherwise would because of the release of Al-Megrahi?  Probably, but it would be no less tragic.  It isn't practical for me to list all the victims, but these are the names of the children who should be young adults today:

Joanne Flannigan (10) Lockerbie
Bryony Owen (1) Bristol
Laura Owens (8) Cherry Hill, New Jersey
Anmol Rattan (2) Warren, Michigan
Suruchi Rattan (3) Warren, Michigan
Edina Roller (5) Hungary
Lyndsey Somerville (10) Lockerbie
Paul Somerville (13) Lockerbie
Hannah Stevenson (10) Surrey
Rachael Stevenson (8) Surrey
Stacey Stinnett (9) Duncanville, Texas
Jonathan Thomas (2 months) Southfield, Michigan
Brittany Williams (2 months) Crown Point, New York
Stephanie Williams (1) Crown Point, New York
Chelsea Woods (1) Willingboro, New Jersey
Joe Woods (2) Willingboro, New Jersey


  1. I think it is entirely appropriate to commemorate Lockerbie in the way you have so movingly done, by remembering the young lives lost who would be now young adults.

    Peace to their families.

  2. I suppose while those who sufered the loss are still alive it will continue to be significant.

    Will we ever grow up as a species and stop slaughtering each other? In the last hundred years it seems to have got got worse.

  3. On another topic altogether the greed and hypocracy doesn't get any better either, asThis article in today's Guardian shows.

    Trouble is I am no longer surprised or shocked by this those who rule us are just beneath contempt!

  4. Following on from Anne, I am sure most of you know about the wonderful Alliance quote generator but for those who do not -


    Montana, andy showed me how to do the proper url thingy to get a direct ref, but I have forgotten how it's done.

  5. Just read that list of names again...

    Nine of them were under five

    Still makes me weep.

  6. A sensitive start to the day Montana

    As annetan says - will we ever stop slaughtering others futures?

    Peace on Earth is sadly likely to remain more elusive whilst ever she continues to spin to a capitalist tune.

    Still tramps necessarily travel in hope - so it's happy winter solstice to one and all. The days grow longer from the 'morrow.

    This day is already showing promise too - that fegging Gloria Honeyford advert hasn't been on my radio for the last three hours!! That's a kinda peace on earth I suppose, perhaps a little selfish though...

  7. My way of giving praise to Odin for the silence of the Honeyford.......an advert of my own

    "The RSPB is warning that cooked turkey fat is extremely dangerous to birds.

    Many people put the leftover contents of Christmas dinner roasting tins outside, wrongly believing that it is as beneficial to birds as other fats like lard and suet.

    They pour the fat onto bird tables or mix it with seed thinking it will give birds energy and nutrients. But the wildlife charity is warning that it could actually kill them.

    Cooked turkey fat is completely unsuitable for birds for several reasons.

    It remains soft even when cooled, meaning it could smear onto birds’ feathers and ruin their water-proofing and insulating qualities.

    Birds need clean, dry feathers to survive the cold and a layer of grease would make this virtually impossible.

    The softness of turkey fat once cooked also means it is impractical to make popular ‘bird cake’ where you mix fawith bird seeds, as it will not harden enough to hold its shape.

    The fat in roasting tins cannot be separated from other leftover elements such as meat juices. This concoction can go rancid very quickly, especially if left in a warm kitchen for a while before being put outside, and form an ideal breeding ground for salmonella and other food poisoning bacteria.

    Birds are prone to bacterial infections at this time of year as their defenses are low and their energy levels depleted with the cold."

  8. On a more cheerful note - read Charlie Brooker on RATM!

    Feel better now!

  9. Let me also give praise for a public service which I have only just found about, namely the on-line reference services that I can now access via my local authority public library ticket.

    I have only just found out that I can gain free access to all the Oxford press reference works on-line for free. (Including the OED - a subscription I was about to buy for Mungo for Christmas.)

    Montana I will, as my Christmas present to you and your son, send you the details of my library ticket to see if you too can use it and get these wonderful and very extensive reference works for free. You name it the Oxford press publishes an authoritative reference work on it and they are, as you probably know, class!

    They are usually an expensive premium service. I don't know if it will work from a US based computer but if it does you and yours may have more resources than the Cowpat Junction Library is able provide (unless they too give you access). After all now you are a published writer you really ought to have access to at least the complete OED (all 20+ volumes)- the worlds greatest reference work.

    Look what I found in the Oxford Irish dictionary:

    ábhalmhór (adj enormous, gigantic, huge.)

    The very word I was looking for to describe that anglo/mick Honeyford woman.

    Any UK UT friend who wants more info let me know and I'll tell you how it works in my area - it seems most UK public library services do something very similar if not the same..

    I really am a come-lately to all this wonderful tinternet stuff but its great. The best news is that now I have found all these wonderful books for the reading I will now be spending less time here boring folk with my tedious rants.

    By the way - today three years ago was the day I first set eyes on Mungo and he then came to live with me. I took him back to the dogs home the other day (I like to give them a donation at Christmas) he could hear the dogs in the kennels barking so he let out a long smug wolf like howl in reply .

    Mungo really can be a self satisfied, arrogant and embarrassing bastard!


  10. This comment has been removed by the author.

  11. Go on then Deano, how does it work?

  12. Thanks for the turkey update Deano. Who knew lard was a type of fat ?!

    By the way I still have a copy of the Paul Foot Private Eye special on Lokerbie from 2001. 30 odd pages of very well researched material, if anyone wants something closer to the "truth". It's a pdf file, drop me a line at hardbjorn@googlemail.com if anyone wants a copy.

    Thanks also for the heads up. "Simon Cowell: Shit for Ears". That'll do nicely !

  13. Montana et al - a sample to wet your lips... The Oxford reference list covers:

    English Dictionaries & Reference
    English Dictionaries & Thesauruses
    English Language Reference
    Bilingual Dictionaries
    Maps & Illustrations
    Subject Reference
    Art & Architecture
    Biological Sciences
    Earth & Environmental Sciences
    Economics & Business
    Food & Drink
    Military History
    Mythology & Folklore
    Names & Places
    Natural History
    Performing Arts
    Physical Sciences & Mathematics
    Politics & Social Sciences
    Religion & Philosophy

    and here is the listing for history by way of an example:

    The Oxford Companion to American Military History
    The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Archaeology
    The Oxford Companion to Archaeology
    The Oxford Companion to Australian History
    The Oxford Companion to Australian Military History
    The Oxford Companion to Black British History
    A Dictionary of British History
    The Oxford Companion to British History
    The Oxford Companion to Canadian History
    A Dictionary of Contemporary World History
    A Guide to Countries of the World
    Dynasties of the World
    The Oxford Companion to Irish History
    The Oxford Companion to Scottish History
    The Kings and Queens of Britain
    The Oxford Companion to Local and Family History
    The Oxford Dictionary of Local and Family History
    The Oxford Companion to Military History
    The Oxford Companion to the History of Modern Science
    Oxford Dictionary of the Classical World
    The Oxford Encyclopedia of Maritime History
    A Dictionary of Political Biography
    The Oxford Dictionary of Popes
    An Oxford Companion to the Romantic Age
    The Oxford Dictionary of Saints
    The Oxford Companion to Ships and the Sea
    Who's Who in the Twentieth Century
    The Oxford Guide to the United States Government
    The Oxford Companion to United States History
    The Oxford Essential Dictionary of the U.S. Military
    A Dictionary of World History

    Amazing stuff from this internet thing

  14. Deano,

    Don't suppose you could list biological sciences, please?

  15. Deano,
    Thanks for tip on turkey fat.

  16. Dott - I can't remember if your overseas, and as I've indicated to Montana I don't yet know if works from abroad (but in effect you are getting access via a uk local authority website so it may thauma probably knows more about this???) and I don't know if your UK/family local authority is signed up to the service (phone your library and ask?) but this is how it works for me:

    Deano's Local Authority Portal to the Oxfords

    The above is simply a webage within the library division of East Riding Council's website. Therein you will see what I can access by simply putting my local authority password and library ticket number into the portal entry point.

    Once your into say the Oxford reference service you have access to search/browse all the books a sample of which is listed above. They also have links to other important sites (leading Institutes Uni's etc)

    It's fegging grand - a superb public service of which we should be proud.

    I know that a very large number of other local authorities have similar provisons if you can find out how to access them

    I hope you can get in from your local authority - if not complain.

  17. This comment has been removed by the author.

  18. Dott -

    Biological Sciences

    A Dictionary of Animal Behaviour
    Oxford Dictionary of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology
    A Dictionary of Biology
    The Oxford Companion to the Body
    A Dictionary of Ecology
    The Encyclopedia of Underwater Life
    A Dictionary of Genetics
    The New Encyclopedia of Birds
    A Dictionary of Plant Sciences
    A Dictionary of Scientists
    A Dictionary of Zoology

    Good luck and my best wishes and seasonal greetings to you and yours.

    Since you have been cagey about your gender I'm keeping my mistletoe in my pocket - nothing personal I trust you will understand...


  19. PS - when you link to the East Riding page above I should have indicated that you need to scan the page down to see the entry points to the different services provided. The Oxford reference is part way down..

  20. Deano,
    Not so much cagey as unsure.

  21. God my brain is suffering from alcohol shortage - for "scan the page down" read scroll the page down!

    Only three days till I get off the wagon and then my brain will have an excuse for its tardy performance.

    Dog walking in the sunshine calls.

  22. Edwin Moore

    This is a link which gives you the code to use:

    How to make a link

    You start with this type of bracket:


    and inside this you put:

    a href=""

    then you close it with:


    Within the inverted commas you put the full address of your link. In my case that was:


    You then write the text you want to use as your link:

    This is my link

    You then put another:


    inside which you put:


    and close the bracket:


    That's it!

    Obviously, I cannot write it as it should look because then it just becomes a link.

  23. Sounds promising from abroad - I just phoned me friendly local reference librarian, and fibbed that I sometimes work abroad, and enquired if the service would be available from "..say a cyber cafe". She said she thought it would and reminded me to pack my library ticket next time I travel!

    She had a very, very nice voice and I found myself wondering if she would like to come rowing with me or would like to join me on a lunchtime walk in the snow where we could perform a useful public service together..

    We would I am sure be together able to generate a combined heat source that would allow the Rescue helicopters to test their thermal cameras in the snow...

    Oh to be public spirited now that xmas is upon us.

    I think I'm going to ask her for some help in my research on Frederick Furnivall.

    I do so like lass with an interesting grammar, she could learn me lots and amuse me too. I think the most erotic yarn I know is where the old man hires a 'lish lady to read to him...

    I wonder if she wants a part time job?

  24. This comment has been removed by the author.

  25. Cheers Deano, will check it out, and absolutely no offence taken!

    Stoaty, I am sure, I'm just cagey! Did you paint your profile pic yourself?

  26. I've been accessing the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography with my library card number for a while now - it's great. I'll have to see what else it can get me into.

    And it looks like I'm off pre-mod! My second comment last night eventually went up, and my posts today have posted straight away.

  27. This comment has been removed by the author.

  28. Dot.
    Yeah, I'm too thick to pinch one off internet.
    Did it quickly in acrylic yesterday.

  29. Thanks for the instructions Atomboy, just linked for the first time! *blushes*

  30. Stoaty

    "I'm too thick to pinch one off internet."

    LOL That's liking cooking a gourmet meal from scratch because you don't know how the queuing system in McDonalds works!

  31. That was an agreeable walk. Still and crisp and the overnight wind had sculpted the snow into the kind of ripples you get on the sea shore.

    The talk yesterday of Tom Courtney (we spell him like he is pronounced in his home town) made me wish Imogen posted here more often. I would have appreciated an actors insight into the delicate realtionships with the Director.

    If I'd have been Tom in Zhivago I would have to had negotiated my role with David Lean to include some home leave for Strelnikov.

    I loved the idea of Tom, scar faced, as Strelnikov dashing around Russia on an armoured train to fight the White reactionary rearguards but that didn't seem to leave any time to get home to shag Julie Christie. I'm sure Pasternak would have been sympathetic in the circumstances. And so I thought Tom was a bit slow there.

    Annetan42 found me mistletoe. Holds it up (It was in my outdoor trousers - you never know who you'll meet on a winters day) close your eyes... xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx seasons warmest affection young miss.

    Sorry that your daughter has to work and won't be with you on Christmas day this year. First time in 35? years will seem odd. One of my sons was absent for the first time last year and his younger brother the year before so I know how you will feel on the day.

    I'll post a note here on UT on Mungo's Christmas presents before I leave for my Christmas dinner and a few jars. Not the same I know but it might be a smiling matter for a brief moment.

    Paddy Hello friend - glad to read your out of purgatory. Your library ticket probably works like something mine, which council are you by the way?

  32. Hello Shaz - Atomboy's was the best step by step explanation I've seen here on UT how to make a dynamic link.

    I still hate that Blair bastard though.

  33. A fitting tribute Montana - and well handled I would say.

    Anne - I saw that article and it made my blood boil.

    Deano - Mwah xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx back at ya. And as for this from the other day: "The news that the "Arbeit Macht Frei" (work sets you free) sign stolen from Auschwitz is being looked for at Atos Healthcare and the Department for Work & Pensions is not a cruel joke.

    Nor is the rumour that the theft is the nocturnal work of the uber creep Mandelson's mate James Mark Dakin Purnell, (aka little shit), Member of Parliament, for Stalybridge and Hyde"

    I did indeed make a similar comment on the thread re the stealing of this sign. Although I didn't mention Shitdribble Purnell as when I do all reason leaves me and I get banned. To be fair I do say some bad stuff about him but the man is evil incarnate.

    I had some good news yesterday. Hospital called on Friday and they wanted me to go for a scan yesterday (which I guess was the 'urgent' bit my doc was talking about rather than the Feb appointment with gastro). A doctor did the scan and had a good look and all the organs are fine! Which is the main thing. Thank god my liver is okay. I am going to treat it better from now on. Although at the minute cant drink anyway due to the horror acid.

    So that is very good news - the bad news is still cannot eat much and it is beginning to piss me off. The doc who did the scan says symptoms sound like an ulcer but she cant say for def and they will need to do the dreaded down throat thingy to see if it is indeed that. Which wont be till Feb - by which time I might resemble someone like Victoria Beckham. All skin and bone (but without the weird fake half orange breasts).

  34. shazthewombat

    You are certainly on the slippery slope now.

    Before you know it you will be getting into PHP and CSS and then you will be well and truly hooked.

    Just watch it if anyone invites you to a "coding party".

    It may not turn out to be quite what you think.

  35. princesschipchops

    Thanks for reminding us that Purnell's actual name - for which Arbeit macht Frei is frequently substituted - is actually Shitdribble.

    PS Copyright SirDaphne, actually.

  36. Sheff Before I leave to take my new librarian friend a nit comb for Christmas and ask her wise advice on how to research the history of the nitcomb. I ought to urge caution on you my dear young miss as you gayly promenade around Constantinople.

    (There is, by the way, nothing finer than a buxom lady librarian leaning over one's shoulder to explain how a computer works....I adore dedicated public servants but that can wait till I have posted here for you cos you is a dedicated public servant too)

    You be careful now Sheff them bubbling pipes can be heady tha 'nos, some of them Turkey boys have strange passions once aroused.

    I think it appropriate to offer the advice I posted here for PB the other day whilst you were not around - this really amounted to a variation on the wisdom .." If you cant be careful at least have fun.."

    In all other cases:-

    I know you are a proper brought up lass and learn'd too so I'm not over worried about you - but here's a checklist just in case you've misplaced yours:

    i) make sure you have some clean knickers in your pocket;

    ii) make sure you have some sterilising wipes;

    (There are some right odd folk drink in London bars and smoke bubble pipes in Constantinople. It's not just the toilet seats you have to watch out for, give the rim of the glass/stem of the pie a quick once over too.)

    iii) mistletoe with strangers (and cafes in side streets)) is to be avoided - it's a sure fire recipe for regrettable liaisons;

    iv) if the mistletoe/ pipe can't be avoided give your kissing/smoking partners mouth and sexual organs a quick wipe round too;

    iv) avoid alleged Belgian beer and pretend Champagne and free baccy - all that sparkles and smoulders is not the real McCoy;

    v) memorise the following script:

    "Sir - we know you have you have spent a lot of time with debauched geeks in your civilisation but:

    If I am drugged and end up in a pornographic film or am traded to some far flung corner of a house of ill repute in Beligium...or sordid Lancashire whorehouse ..or am sold to an Arab

    I want you to be clear that deano30 (who is descended from a Viking chieftan) and Stoaty ( who is descended from Attila the Hun) and all my other mates over on UT will be around here in fucking Blackpool on the The Bosphorus or((Greek: Βόσπορος), also known as the Istanbul Strait (Turkish: İstanbul Boğazı)) , you will held responsible and they will shake the shit out you until you tell them where I have been sent..." pause " These friends of mine have passports issued by Her Britannic Madge - these guys are no anzacs as you will so learn"

    vi) just to be on the safe side - make a written copy of the above translated into Turkishand carry it in your knockers

    It sounded great in your last post but better safe than sorry so don't forget the translation and have a good time. I'll let you know about Mungo's pressies on the day.


  37. "The news that the "Arbeit Macht Frei" (work sets you free) sign stolen from Auschwitz is being looked for at Atos Healthcare and the Department for Work & Pensions is not a cruel joke."

    Everytime i come across this incident i cant stop chuckling at a comment from about a year ago, when modding took a turn for the worse, and someone suggested a name change to "Comment Macht Frei". Childish, i know...

  38. PCC - really glad to read your good news our lass. x.

    Right I'm off down the library to chance me charms.

  39. Yes Atomboy - it was Sir Daphne indeed. What a brilliant post that was. One of the best on Cif ever. I wonder where Sir Daphers is not seen them about for a long time. I used to enjoy their posts.

  40. princesschipchops

    I tend not to even look out for people over there any more. I just assume that everyone will leave in due course.

    It's a bit like Simon Cowell. His ideas of being the global media mogul ne plus ultra will now slowly spiral into oblivion and extinction.

    In about three or four years, people will laugh and say, "Oh, yeah, do you remember when we used to watch that divvy X-Factor? What a load of rubbish!"

    As for the little plastic and excrement messiah, Tony Blair, this about sums him up:

    “You get to a position where the criticism you get, you just have to live with. It’s the way it is. When you are someone like me, you create a lot of controversy one way or another. You just decide to do what you are going to do and let that speak for itself.”

    Another delusional shitdribble.

    Waiver: Links to Rupert Murdoch's publications may not work as intended due to his attempts to steal the internets.

  41. Fucking cunt thinks he's John Wayne.

  42. Afternoon UTers!

    Thank you so much for commemorating Lockerbie, Montana. It is particularly close to my heart as my Mum was from that area and I still have a lot of family round there. I was on my way home from France for a surprise Christmas visit and had left very early on the morning of the 22nd and didn't hear the news until my Bro told me when we arrived at Gatwick. It was so awful. A neighbour of my Aunt's had a body suspended in a tree in her garden for two days until forensics came and did their bit. It devastated the entire community and surrounding villages, but in true Scottish fashion, everyone rallied round and did their bit to help where they could.

    The memorial garden is worth a visit to anyone who is in that area. But also a very sad, haunting place.

    In memory of all who lost their lives.

    One a lighter note, looks like I will be skiving tomorrow, although working Wednesday, as the court have just called to say it has been adjourned due to witnesses not being able to get there! w00t! I can actually finish my shopping without it being a last minute panic! (Assuming I can get the car out of the drive with all the snow.)

  43. Glad to hear your good news, PCC and hope the ability to eat etc returns.
    BB, have you seen the latest Henry Porter thread on the further iniquities of that shitdribble Jack Straw(another one to go with that utter fucktard Purnell). As you're still in practice, wonder what you think?

  44. PCC - fab news! Glad things are OK.

    Alasdair - not seen it yet, no. Will take a look.

    As for Tony "Everybody Loves Me Really" Blair - BWAHAHAHAHAHA!

  45. Ah the Legal Aid cuts! Yep. We are kind of pissed off about it all because more money is wasted in people not being represented than if they were. And the court system wastes humungous amounts of money too.

    a) unrepresented crims don't know how to conduct a trial, don't know what the procedures are, will turn up on the day completely unprepared and are likely to require more adjournments
    b) if they are unrepresented but need to cross-examine a victim, the case will be adjourned while a legal aid brief is appointed just for cross-examination purposes.
    c)the other day I was sat in the Mags court - as prosecutor - for an hour and a half doing nothing while we waited for the Duty Solicitor to finish with other clients. Because fees are so tight, whereas before they would have briefed Counsel to do a couple of First Appearances while they dealt with the overnight stuff, now they try and do it all, resulting in time wasted.

    Those are a few things off the top of my head before I even read the article, which seems to be about potential miscarriages of justice - which is also bound to be the case.

  46. Well, when you have read it, your blood will be boiling more furiously...

  47. Had my little rant, which is a bit of a "told you so", because we have been complaining about this for nigh-on 3 years now, only to be told that we are only interested in our own fees.

  48. Can't speak about criminal Legal Aid, and I haven't read the article, but civil Legal Aid is a racket that needs serious reform. I work for a public authority that's the target of a lot of claims, and the difference between legally-aided and non-legally aided claims is blindingly obvious.

    In non-legally-aided claims, the solicitor promptly gives you everything you need to know to enable you to decide on liability and, if necessary, make an offer. In legally-aied claims they'll spin it out for as long as is humanly possible, witholding information, failing to show up for site inspections and being incredibly unhelpful when they do. They instruct their clients not to tell us anything at site inspections - just stand and point to where they had their accident.

    Then, at the last possible moment, they'll issue legal proceedings, which allows them to spin it out even longer, and they'll issue them against parties they know have no involvement, presumably because it's more they can charge for, and a brother solictor gets work who canscratch their back in return down the line.

    Even if we win the case, we're lumbered with thousands in legal fees that we can't claim back off the claimant because they're legally aided, and we can't get back off their solicitor, even if they knew they couldn't win a case against us and had completely misrepresented the medical evidence, because solicitors are apparently completely unaccountable to anybody.

    A solicitor who knows the client is paying the bill will do their best to represent them well, so they'll use them again and recommend them to others. When the client is legally aided, it's just about how much money they can con the government out of and the client can go hang.

    Anyway, that's my rant about the legal system. Don't know much about barristers because I don't have any direct dealings with them other than paying their bills. I have noticed though that, in spite of the so-called cab-rank principle our solicitors always seem to use the same handful of barristers - even in smalls claims court cases.

  49. BW

    Who knew lard was a type of fat ?!

    Wine. Nose. Thanks for that.

    Deano - haven't checked out your link yet, but it will be possible for them to detect foreign IP addresses, although probably not UK ones from the 'wrong' area. Whether they choose to do so is another matter, and quite likely they'll just rely on the username/pw.

  50. Paddy - you are right about civil legal aid. I don't do much civil, but I am on one at the moment where the claimant is legally aided and my guy isn't. The claimant has no case to speak of, really, but she has already managed to spin it out, knowing full well that my guy will only get his costs if he wins and can show that he will be in financial difficulties if costs aren't paid to him from the public purse. It is a bloody scam, right enough.

  51. Hello.

    Escaped from work early but my elation was short-lived - that bloody Tony Blair article made me fume. We elected him, personally, in those general elections, not the Labour Party - the arrogant warmongering greedy smug self-righteous fucking c*nt.

    And don't get me started on Legal Aid ..

    On a lighter note, I put seeds out on a low wall in my garden for the birds during bad weather, especially the pair of blackbirds who nest in my garden. This morning I spotted a tiny mouse emerge from under the honeysuckle draping one end of the wall, carefully checking out for predators. Then it ran along the snow, paused to look round again, grabbed a seed and ran back. I put a some seeds closer to where it came from, and under the honeysuckle, so it could gather them safely, which it has. It's always the small things in life which make my day.

  52. Mschin - that was a lovely post Reads like 'the natural History of Selbourne' Read it here

  53. Thanks, folks!

    Lovely link, anne - cheers.

  54. Neat, MsChin. I love watching the way rodents use their front paws to eat. I sit watching my ratties for ages sometimes.

    Thanks for the Selbourne link, Anne. My husband's aunt and cousins live in Selbourne. I wonder if we could get hold of a copy of that book for them.

  55. Just read MAM's acceptance speech on the Ciffies blog. Fair play to him/her/them, it was humble and gracious.

    Looking forward to their ATL debut.

    "Comment macht frei" - made me laugh, Jay..

  56. Oh, and happy winter solstice everyone!

  57. Happy winter solstice from me, too.

    I won't be partying 'til dawn unfortunately, but come the summer solstice, I will.

  58. MsChin - I'm a world-renowned lightweight, but I shall probably be *up* before dawn.... But not at the summer solstice!

  59. Deano
    I am being outrageously flattered by all kinds of dishy and otherwise young men - but its mainly to do with getting my business into their various establishments - cafes, carpet shops etc. They really are very good at it I have to say, and so charming, especially when they kiss your hand and guess your age with 20 years knocked off. Fortunately I still possess the odd 'realism' gene so am not taken in, much as I might like to be....

    On another note, I bought a Guardian Weekly today and found this snippet (forgive me if you've already seen it, we're a bit behind here)

    Hospital cleaners are worth more to society than bankers, according to a report by the New Economics Foundation. It said a study of the social impacts of several jobs revealed city workers, advertising executives and tax advisers destroyed value, while hospital cleaners, child care workers and staff in the waste-recycling industry gave much more to the country than they took out

    who'd a thought it...

  60. Indeed, Sheff. Nicely spotted.

  61. Yes! Happy Winter Solstice one and all. Isn't it Saturnalia soon? :o)

  62. I just thought I'd check whether my old library card from Richmond, long expired and unusable since I moved down here, still works to log into the online reference stuff. And it does!

    There seems to be no checking at all apart from the barcode number on the card; I just entered that after getting to the login page from the Richmond council site and all was well.

    So, well worth a try from anywhere I'd say. Just reading the DNB for a bit...

  63. sheff

    Glad to hear you're enjoying yourself!

    And thanks for the snippet - I always knew my mom was worth more than any one of those w/bankers!

  64. I'm off out shopping for a while, then have family calling in later. I'm less than thrilled about the shopping trip and the late visit from a talkative relly when I've got to be up early & have a long day tomorrow 'cos of work Xmas do ..


  65. BB you can probably buy it in Selbourne. Gilbert White's vicarage is now a museum. part of the house is also dedicated to Lawrence Oates who died in 1911 on Scott's failed expedition to the S Pole.

    He was the one who famously said 'I am just going outside and may be some time.'

    He also had links with the house. My link to the house here

  66. Coo. And now it seems I have full access to the Times archive too...

    Thanks for the reminder of the library login thing, Deano...

  67. Point of order, annetan, Oates died in 1912, the expedition started in 1911...



  68. Oh, and BB; Gilbert White's book is still in print - I have an old copy somewhere. If you'd like a nice old edition there are plenty on abebooks.co.uk from my quick look over there just now.

    Fans of Gilbert might like Francis Kilvert's diaries too. And while I'm book recommending,this is wonderful.

  69. thaumaturge, yesterday you said...


    "Let's just hope you can refrain from the misogynistic attacks on the female posters here."

    Evidence of misogyny?

    Unless you're really saying that females on the UT are exempt from criticism, in which case you'd better petition Montana to remove the slogan from her banner head.

    As for your suggestion that "no-one's going to stop you", did you not know that I'm in that tiny band who's had a post deleted from here?

  70. Oh FFS, "Job", how else would you describe falsely attacking women for being bad mothers because they happen to post on the internet, when you have never, ever, attacked a father for the same reason? And then making up lies about their children, and inputing that it's down to their being bad mothers - when, again, you have never done any such thing to a father?

    I've no knowledge of your having had a post deleted from here, but if it was along the lines of the ones I'm complaining about (ie libellous), then that's fair enough. Perhaps you should contemplate the "tiny band" part.

  71. @BTH - "unless you're really saying that females on the UT are exempt from criticism..."

    Well, clearly they're not. Ask Bru about the misogynists on here who have been so caustic about her empty-headed celebration of the consumer lifestyle.

    What some of us find unacceptable is those who lurk on this site, like modern day Peeping Toms, archiving comments which are often made in a jocular manner since we assume that we're amongst friends, only to find that what's said on here is used in evidence against us in a creepy and wholly unprincipled way over on Cif.

    I've never been entirely sure why you chose to single out BB and MW for your bile over there. I guess it must be that they never quite fitted your rigid definition of feminism. That might be, of course, because they are real people and not idealised archetypes straight from the pages of Betty Friedan.

    It's a shame in a way that you were banned rather than taking MAM's crown. I would have been fascinated to read your own blog about what feminism really means to you, and how every woman you've ever met has failed to meet the standards your dusty academic knowledge of the subject has led you to expect.

    How about you set up a new site - cifrefugeesrefugees - for you, Bru and rex.

  72. No-one on this blogg is exempt from criticism and no-one is forced to accept that criticism.

    There is something called agreeing to differ and moving on? Again such an action is entirely voluntary, its just that constant repetion of the same points get boring.

    We don't all have the patience of Job however. :-)

  73. "Perhaps you should contemplate the 'tiny band' part."

    Bang on, thauma. Takes a lot to get a post deleted on here. God knows I've tried.

  74. Hank, nice one.

    I've never been entirely sure why you chose to single out BB and MW for your bile over there.

    I can only guess that it is because they are both mothers of adolescent boys. Damn good ones, from what I can tell, but Bitey seems to have issues there.

  75. I deleted his first post on here, Thaum. It was a copy of the post that was deleted on CiF - the one accusing me of being a drunk and suggesting my son had run away from home. Oh, and how much of a better upbringing young BiteTheHand had had as a result of not being allowed to watch tv.

    It was written by his "Mum". All very Norman Bates.

    Nobody else is to blame for that deletion but me. I took a decision and emailed Montana to tell her what I had done after the fact.

    I shan't be replying to Job any more though. Trolls piss me off at the best of times. Faux-feminist homophobic religious freaks with mother issues piss me off even more.

  76. HankScorpio, writing yesterday you said:

    "You lost whatever shreds of moral authority you might have had when you chose to attack Montana over there for child neglect simply because she spent some of her time online."

    "You don't have any idea of what Montana's relationship is with her son, nor of what she was doing with him when she wasn't online."

    You're welcome to your opinion, but I'm not sure I've ever claimed any moral authority, so shall we pass that one by at present?

    As for Montana's relationship with her son, about which I wouldn't claim to know much, she, along with Anne Tan, BeautifulBurnout and SheffPixie have all been quite open about their offspring, both here and in the case of BeautifulBurnout, earlier this month on CiF when she had at least three posts, one of them very long, about the appalling way her copper-red haired son has been treated.

    However while I have already agreed that my post about Montana's son was deliberately constructed so as to be interpreted in at least two ways, the same of course might be said about the following:

    "Ah well - I am finishing off a bottle of Fitou from last night - drinking in the afternoon is allowed when it's a bank holiday, right? Where's Montana's sprog? I need to know if I am in breach of the code..."

    And since I made the point about Montana's son, she has subsequently written extensively on CiF about small town Iowa and it doesn't sound like the most exciting place for an adult, yet alone a ten year old boy. Or is that observation also an indication of my moral turpitude?

  77. Montana thanks for the sensitive memorial for the children that died, a good friend of mine's uncle and aunt died in Lockerbie..such a violent world...

    ..deano thanks for the link about OED looked into it if you're outside the UK without library card you have to pay so shall get onto me dad and get his number!!

    ..princess glad to hear the test went well and no doubt you are relieved at the results..good news!

    ..sheff so you're charming them in Istanbul good on you! Enjoy!

    see the prince of comebacks is thinking of a return to democratic elections as london mayor, never underestimate the london electorate they did vote for blubbering boris...two shitdribblers of vintage quality....

  78. I'm in that tiny band who's had a post deleted from here

    Such self-importance and martyrdom again. Perhaps you should examine the possible reasons for that deletion, and explain why you posted here under another name, and if I recall the incident correctly, why you were clumsily trying to pose as a Cif moderator. Do you miss Cif so much that you feel compelled to post on a blog that you have criticised and reviled so consistently on Cif for months? Have you conveniently forgotten your personal (and libellous) attacks on Montana and BB? You really are a sad needy fucker.

  79. It's just pure trolling for attention ("LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT ME!) and I'm not going to respond to it any more.

  80. MsChin, yesterday you said...


    "Oh the delicious irony" to have been forced by your banning to turn to the "united ranks of the untrusted refugees".

    No force involved MsChin. You made a pleasant comment about my avatar on the "thread of the year" thread and I quite enjoy reading your posts on CiF, even though I feel you tend too much towards the "what about the men" point of view on certain subjects.

  81. @BTH - "You're welcome to your opinion..." - too fucking right I am, and I don't need the green light from a morally degenerate tosser who defends child abuse before doing so.

    Let's get this cleared up as quickly as possible so you can either stick around or clear the fuck off:

    What exactly is it you're looking for here? Are you seeking to apologise to some on here for what you've said about them? Or seeking to excuse yourself? Are you looking for understanding, empathy? Are you looking for forgiveness for past transgressions and for acceptance into the fold? Or are you just trolling?

    Genuinely interested in your response. If you want to post on here in a measured and sincere way, without being swamped in abuse just because of what you've done in the past, then we're quite a forgiving lot generally.

    If you're just looking to stir up trouble, you're just not bright enough to do so.

    So, over to you...

  82. Job in the nicest possible way put a sock in it you're trolling and frankly it's quite boring

  83. PeterJ - Glad it worked for you too.

    annetan - I was never that keen on the Scott story and 'Titus' Oates could also be seen as a quarrelsome Eton schoolboy who could afford to buy his way onto the expedition.
    Trying that journey with ponies was a nonsense to start with and Oates should have known that they were doomed before they set off.

    Best Antarctica expedition yarn inmho is that of Shackleton
    Ernest Shackleton - Heroic Mick or Madman

    BB/Montana - If you are looking for a hero's yarn for older boy/young man then the Shackleton Story takes some beating.

    It was well told in "The Lost Men - Kelly Tyler-Lewis:Bloomsbury paperbacks"

    The journey from Elephant Island to South Georgia across the Southern Ocean in an open boat in winter is still regarded as one of the most extraordinary tales of seamanship and heroism ever told. A journey aimed at securing rescue for his men who had lost all but their lives on an ill-fated Antarctica expedition.

    A journey with a happy ending that resulted in the saving of all the lives of the men Shackleton had necessarily had to leave behind when things went wrong almost from the start.

    A tale which is good as the story of the Titanic for learning why British management was always fegging usless...

  84. "I was never that keen on the Scott story..."

    Hey, deano, I can only deal with one troll at a time(-;

  85. ("LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT ME!) and I'm not going to respond to it any more.

    Me neither, thauma, BB. Everybody should look at MEEEE! instead. If you do, I'll very publically buy everyone wine and champagne and jewelry and shoes!

    Here's a farewell song for Bitey:

    I Need You

  86. HankScorpio, you have got into your head that I post from Thailand, despite the efforts of your fellow UTs to persuade you otherwise. Now it's true that I've spent a couple of weeks in that
    country since CiF came into being, but I've never posted from there. I have spent the best part of three out of the past six years in China where I have a business interest, about which I have written from time to time on CiF. So When you say I'm "a bit too ready to defend Gary Glitter and the life choices of other sad middle aged losers who post from Thailand", it simply isn't true. In fact I don't know any "sad middle aged losers" period. Nor have I posted about Paul Gadd / Gary Glitter, and certainly not to defend his perverted behaviour or his music which is almost as bad.

    Having said that there were several articles in The Guardian about the Channel 4 production which ended in Gadd being hanged, including one by Clive Stafford Smith, one of the current darlings of the libertarians, who ended his article - "It is a shame that C4 failed to observe her golden rule: hate the sin, but try to understand the sinner, or the world will remain a dangerous place for our children."

  87. deano, you might like 'Barrow's Boys' by Fergus Fleming.


  88. "...in fact I don't know any 'sad middle aged losers' period."

    Know thyself, BTH. The first step on the path to enlightenment.

    Now, I've given you an opportunity to explain your agenda on here - would you like to take that opportunity, or should I go along with the consensus and ignore any future posts from you?

  89. Hi All

    BB-- For you and others searching ' The Way '

    A Buddhist walks in to a hamburger joint and says to the waiter; "Make me one with everything"
    The waiter says " I'll do my best within my limited world view. That will be $6.25 please."
    The Buddhist hands him a 10 dollar bill, which the waiter puts in the till. He takes the remaining $3.75 and pockets it.
    The Buddhist says " What about my change?"
    The waiter says " You, of all people, should know that change comes from within."

    Bitey, lighten up please.

    Bye for now.

  90. The Heresiarch has a very good post on Harman's "Equalities" Bill and the work it will generate for lawyers...

    And the Daily Mash has another take on why hospital cleaners are more valuable than bankers...

  91. ----<----a---- href----=----"----web---- link----"---->----link---- name----<----/----a----

    Anyone still having a problem with links.

    1) Copy & Paste the above into word/notepad.

    2) Find & Replace (Ctrl H) - (dash) with (blank)

    3) Save it and the use as a template

    But you have probably all worked it out already.

    Happy Solstice - the days start getting longer from now on - Rar!

  92. And here's my song for Bitey (may have posted it before but it's a goody...

  93. Nice one, Boudican. Although the moral I'm drawing from your tale is that Buddha wouldn't have been such a fat bastard if only he'd skipped a few Big Macs.

    Was in Sainsburys earlier and they had a KFC bucket thing in the freezer - £4 for two million calories of reconstituted animal parts. I was genuinely tempted.

  94. This guy from Port Glasgow was one of the real heroes on The Shackleton/Endurance expedition.

    Harry McNish - Carpenter extraordinary

    True to the class riddled structure of these expeditions Harry was one of a small number of the the heroes not awarded a medal because he had been insubordinate towards Shackleton.

    The fact that everybody would have perished without his skills and effort and bravery being irrelevant in the greater scheme of things.

    For those of you fortunate bastards not on the wagon - I give a toast "...to Chippy McNish and all insubordinate men/women everywhere - fuck the bastards"

  95. Thanks for the lead to Shackleton's story, deano.

    And cheers! I have my evening can of beer to hand :o)

  96. BB - 'I love watching the way rodents use their front paws to eat. I sit watching my ratties for ages sometimes.'

    I'm often guilty of feeding our chinchilla far too many banana chips, just to watch him carefully pick the one he wants & eat it...

  97. Hank--Everyone knows that far more deep contemplation goes into 'Wendy's'. (-: Big Macs are crap.

    deano30--You certainly lighten up this place, looking forward to the unexpurgated 'Tales of Mungo'

  98. BeautifulBurnout writing as the defence barrister you said:

    "I was explaining why the police could do no different, dork."

    Does it really do your professional reputation as a wonderful barrister, which I'm sure you are, any good, to refer to your fellow poster as a "dork"?

    What you wrote about the police and the CPS was:

    "The police and CPS were faced with a dilemma; breaching police bail conditions on its own is not an offence, yet they still had insufficient evidence with which to charge him. They had no alternative but to release him on police bail again. They acted properly within the law. Nevertheless, within four days of his release, Mannan brutally attacked and killed his wife."

    But on 6th March, more than two months before you wrote your article, a Manchester Evening News journalist reported:

    "The CPS has thoroughly investigated the matter and we accept that the wrong decision was made not to charge Mannan at an earlier stage. "The CPS treats incidents of domestic violence extremely seriously and we will work hard to bring offenders to justice. We accept that we did not meet the expected standards in the earlier handling of this case. We have taken steps to prevent this happening again." One Manchester legal expert said if charged Mannan `almost certainly' would have been remanded into custody because of his history of violence. He said: "She could still have been alive today."

    Ms Akhtar's family said "..when the killer was released without charge it took police four days to contact Ms Akhtar.."

    But heaven forbid that the police might do things differently.

  99. "I don't know any "sad middle aged losers" period."

    What the fuck is this place then ? Facebook ?



  100. deano30--What fucking wagon? I am a Scot, and I have never seen it. Probably would'nt like the rest of the passengers anyway. Excepting yourself of course.

  101. Hey BB, Hank, everybody, have spent the last two nights uploading about eighty cds on Mrs Weed's Ipod (present)

    Have got the thing coming through a great big JBL docking port on shuffle and it's effing ACE! Everything from Gram to Mozart piano, Senegalese-cuban stars Orchestra Baobab to Richard Thompson. Stunning.

    Will be visiting some of my (re)discoveries on you lot soon when I get a free night (well after all this christmas bollocks is out of the way anyway)

    In other news, I may be getting out of Pre mod soon... but I'm not holding my breath... it's only been three months... arf


  102. BW

    Welcome back! Where ya been hiding?

    Nice pressie for the missus, although I am not an iPod woman myself. My beloved works for a company who is a subsidiary of a competitor and thus we get our mp3s and other nice stuff cheaper.

    BTH - I am not going to argue about something that was flogged to death on a thread in May of this year. I don't give a monkey's what you think about it, to be honest.

  103. shaz

    I feed my ratties little nibble sticks - they are like the kind of hard pastry people used to make tree decorations out of, but in little coloured sticks for them to gnaw. Good for their teeth too. I love watching them sit with them in their paws and chew away at them.

  104. Good post, deano, and well said. The medals, promotions, the glory always go to the higher ranks. War isn't democratic.

    I watched a doc the other day about Marlborough's brilliance as a strategist in the Napoleonic Wars, as a result of which he was rewarded with most of Wiltshire, Blenheim Palace, and a peerage.

    Of course, Marlborough never put his neck on the line, but the guys he owed his wealth and status to left orphans behind at home. Those orphans left kids of their own to be used as cannon fodder in the wars that Marlborough's privileged brainfucked spoonfed wankbrat descendant Winston prosecuted so heroically in the Veldt and the trenches of the Somme.

    Churchill of course showed his gratitude to those who'd done so much for Empire when he ordered the troops to use necessary force to deal with the General Strike.

    And when he described the Labour Party as a Gestapo in the 1945 election.

    What a fucking wanker Churchill was. A spoiled little tosser who was happy to bask in the glory of those who'd sacrificed something or everything, a privileged mummy's boy who never knew sacrifice, or gratitude.

    I treasure the memory of my dear old Nan telling me that when Churchill toured Shoreditch during the Blitz, he was booed and pelted with eggs by those who knew in their bones that they were working class and that he was not much less of an enemy than the Nazis.

    I fucking hate Churchill more than Thatcher.

  105. hey, bitterweed, got this one? Churchy organ chords and an optimistic outlook? It'll never fly here.

    we can work it out

  106. What Gram's going on the ipod, BW? So many to choose from, Codeine and Grievous Angel above all, but this is mighty fine...


  107. Boudican - you recently asked me about the breed of me dogs and I rudely didn't get around to an answer. Sorry for my dilatory response - I am a retired person so I tend to take a leisured approach to posting and in truth to everything else as well.

    Miss Diesel is about 95% bearded collie from a mum of the same identity crossed with a collie who could do a high jump over a seven foot fence to get at her mum (now departed and buried in a copse in the field in which I live) who was with me for 12 years. She in turn had come from the dogs home.

    Mungo, who I got three years ago today, was also from the dogs home. He's what is called a '57' dog after the Heinz label - a cross of all sorts so to speak.

    He's got a lot of hound in him, more than his fair share of lunacy and somewhere along the line an affair with something like an Otter. hound - he just loves water.

    Show him a river/lake/ocean and he's in. Breast stroke, crawl and then just to show off an imitation back crawl a dog that loves to swim and takes ages to get out of the water once he is in.

    When he arrived three years ago he didn't have a beard. Miss Diesel did, and I have for all my adult life had a full face beard so the bastard grew one to fit in - and then he grew his fringe hair so it hangs over his eyes like Diesel and me.

    I'll get around to posting his /her photos one day but don't hold your breath my friend.

  108. @deano
    your mungo sounds in temperament like my hound: scorpio i hasten to add nothing to do with you Hank! He looked like a border collie when he was a pup but has turned into a monster of a hound 57er! He has caused me grief, money (due to an active adolescence stealing bags with mobile phones in and then doing olympic style dives with the contents into ponds, I think he was actually waving at me when he did that!) and lots of pleasure!

  109. Evenin' all. A friend in San Diego emailed me this about Hewlett Packard and racism. It made me giggle. If it's real, it's even funnier.

  110. BW - this?


    Clive Langer's version doesn't seem to be on YouTube.

    deano - thanks for the canine info, was going to ask earlier but didn't get round to it. Sounds as though Mungo has his paw firmly on the reins! Am bringing the family up to the East Riding for Christmas with my mum, who lives in Hessle but was born in Withernsea.

  111. Hoping the relationship with Mungo is a mutually rewarding one, deano. I'm thinking particularly of the Jasper Carrott sketch in which he's round at the posh in-laws when the family dog starts licking his own balls.

    Embarrassed silence all round, broken by JC saying

    "I wish I could do that."

    To which his tweedy MIL-to-be says

    "If you stroke him, he might do so..."

    Thank you very much, you've been a great audience, Happy Xmas to one and all, even you, you and you.

    You all know who you are


  112. Scherf... curiously, no Beatles at present. (Long, boring reason - they are actually my first band)

    Hank - I got "Gram Parsons" and "Grievous Angel". As it's me missus Ipod I'll have to hold back on all the good shitkicking shit, including the buritos, although she likes Emmylou and Alison Kraus etc.

    Managed to swing in some *real* old school Western Swing and some Nickel Creek too. Pure Banjo and Mandolin insanity...

  113. Shaz... that is one of the finest songs ever recorded, and Wyatt's was the finest version of it, it makes me well up I tells ya.

  114. Hank - talking about heroes/wars and just desserts [and just for good measure my most hated species (BB excepted) fucking law mongers..].

    Are you aware of the story of the sanctity of contract/common law and the position of merchant UK seamen in both world wars??

    Those who sailed in the merchant ships on the winter North Atlantic convoys and on to Murmansk and who from time to time encountered a torpedo came in for really sick treatment.

    Some of their widows were shocked to find that their husbands pay stopped the moment the torpedoes struck - the contracts of employment ended immediately because the judiciary had decided that such an event constituted a frustration of the contract of employment.

    I heard that some sailors went on risky wartime voyage, and were torpedoed after a week at sea. They then spent several additional weeks surviving adrift in an open boat and then several years internment as a POW and after the war picked up a solitary weeks wages.

    Shipowners nonetheless doing rather nicely out of compensation for loss of shi and cargo though

    Fucking lawyers (BB excepted) I'd hang the bastards on the grounds of conspiracy to defraud the people by not exposing Blair as tosser in chief.

    Somebody (annetan?) said above you get law not justice from lawyers and Courts and working men/women get shit law to boot.

  115. Shaz
    Here's one of my favourite Britsh acts - Show of Hands. Great, great English folk. They're brilliant live too.

    Tall Ships

  116. Lol shaz, will check the Stalin one in aminute, after Tall Ships...

  117. @scherf - didn't expect to see you here tonight, mate. Thought you'd be at the Grapes. I popped in there earlier with my blackberry and my "I'd love a Pimms" t-shirt.

    Had to leave early doors though. I'm not really one for confrontation or argument, so I bailed out when a couple of guys from the McVities' marketing department crashed the party with competing "it's a cake"/"it's a biscuit" pashminas.

  118. Shaz Miss Diesel of Southfield to give her her proper name was conceived and born in Southfield Hessle!

    We lived there before I took to being a tramp. I shall be joining all our family with my two sons who still live in Hessle for Christmas dinner and loads of drink... boy I am looking forward to getting off the wagon having rested my weary liver for about five weeks now

  119. deano--Good stuff on the dogs, they sound like worthy companions for you. I've been told by friends that my goatee resembles those of my dogs. Bastards were right too, although the winter colour is on me now.

    Bitterweed--Ever hear the excellent album that Emmylou and Knofler did? I think you and Mrs.B would enjoy it.

  120. I'm extending the deadline on the Whiffies, on the grounds that there's little or no interest in it. Not to worry, if all fails I'll choose my own pet peeves as winners. :-p

    And, as I mentioned before I'm only too happy to use the tender embrace of the UT as the forum for votes. Trimming back the categories a bit, feel free to give your votes for the following categories (I've put my own underneath with a short explanation):

    1. Worst Contributor
    Polly Toynbee - for cheerleading when she should have been thinking.

    2. Worst Article
    Libby Brooks's "The Jane Andrews I knew" A close call this one, but Brooks edges it with an identity politics corker, founded on the belief that since women are incapable of evil and men aren't, it must be the male victim's fault. Extra marks for trashing a dead man, hurting his family and not coming up with a single piece of evidence to support her contention.

    3. Worst Commenter
    CiF and UT's very own BiteTheHand - for never seeing a feminist leg he didn't want to hump and, rather contradictorily, quite spectacular vileness towards any woman with a child and an internet connection.

    4. The Why Oh Why Oh Why? Most Pointless Article Award
    I'm going to go with Melissa McEwan' 'Dynasties and Double Standards' article, the basis for it being that she googled "Chris Cuomo nepotism" and got 4,950 returns, then googled "Jenna Bush Hager nepotism" and got 25,900 returns. On such analytical genius was a towering indictment of sexism in the media built.

    5. The Identity Politics Race For Victimhood Award
    The 'Why Are People Mean To Gingers' One. The Fatties one came close, but gingers as the oppressed took the (ginger) biscuit.

    6. The Max Gogarty Worst BTL Savaging Award
    Not necessarily the same thing as gales of BTL laughter, but the two are often linked. I'll give this one to Barbara Ellen's "The Little Manboys Are Just Gagging For it". Campbell's OBE was funnier, but for genuine anger and shredding of the article, this edges it.

    7. Most Glaring Omission
    The Death of The Neets. 15% of all people with no education, job or training dead within 10 years and The Guardian apparently couldn't give a damn.

    So that's my full list. Chip in with any of your own.

  121. @hank so you didn't catch glance of all those bottles of wine I sent then?

  122. @deano - vaguely aware of it. I'd like to read a bit more about it, so why not post some more detail on UT2?

    As long as you don't diss my grandad....

  123. Oi you, RapidEddie - leave off the gingers! :p

  124. shazthewombat

    Brilliant song. One which just springs into your mind after years of absence and you still feel the tingle of delight.


    You all know who you are

    Not necessarily, which is why I, for one, will be out shopping for one of those mighty fine new ID cards tomorrow.

    You can never be too rich or, er, have too much ID.

  125. deano - my mum lives in Southfield. Will be there on Wed, weather permitting!

    BW - that is one fuck-off awesome track, thankyou!

    Polly Come Home

  126. Cake off, Scorpio, or I'll jaffa you on Waddya. You're such a biscuiting prole, I don't why I bother. (Sorry for the bad language, I just get so angry sometimes that I behave like ordinary scum and forget all about my noble uncles in the concentration camps.)

  127. RapidEddie - 'for never seeing a feminist leg he didn't want to hump'

    *wipes wine off the keyboard*

    +1 for the Libby Brooks article.

  128. Plant and Kraus eh ? I need to get that...
    Glad ya liked the Tall Ships thing shaz, I've been going to see them since I was sixteen or younger, they're immense.

    BB - sorry I didn't reply - I've been away for a bit seeing that mate I told you about last September. All good ! ;-)

  129. OK possums. Time I was asleep.

    Nighty night xx

    And a special hug for Mungo and Diesel too. xx

  130. @BW and Gandolfo - full disclosure here, guys, I missed out on the benefits of a private education. I know, you're disappointed. I'm sorry.

    As a result, I have limited understanding of the social mores, the means by which hands are greased, jobs are blown, how it is that bourgeois butterflies of limited intelligence get to take and keep well-paid jobs, how said bourgeois idiots get to contribute to the wideranging fuckup we see all around us, and yet get to blame it all on the poor, the rich, everyone but themselves basically.

    Where's BTH btw? Is he buying into the project?

  131. @ hank what you went to a state school? Oh well that explains everything vulgarity, crudeness and such contempt for those of us that know what is good for you, I myself, as no doubt you have gathered, am of optimum breeding stock and have a penchance for being up my own arse......

  132. Phew! That was fraught, but worthwhile.

    I just skipped out of the opera to email the manager of a little bijou bistro where I knew Sir Terry Leahy would be dining this evening with his wonderful guests and asked him to send over a few bottles of wine to their table.

    In the whirl which is my social set, we do this sort of thing all the time.

    I was slightly perturbed, though, when an email came through from Sir Terry's office, saying: "Get fucked. If I want some booze I've got fucking great warehouses full of the stuff."

    Obviously a crossed line.

    Well, I'll have to say toodaloo as a friend of mine has asked me to open an art gallery, which will be simply swamped with world leaders recovering from Copenhagen.

  133. The other day (Sat?) I started to write the following comment, but for some reason never actually posted it:

    I don’t expect that this will meet with unanimous approval, but here goes…

    It became a sort of tradition that I would welcome new arrivals to Untrusted, so I would, genuinely, like to welcome BiteTheHand.

    I have always stated my objection to people being banned from CiF, and I see no reason to change that now. No one should be banned from commenting, even those whose views and/or methods of putting them across I find abhorrent.

    It’s difficult, however, to avoid a certain amount of satisfaction about what has happened to you, especially given the extent to which you have appeared to seek and gloat over the moderation and banning of others.

    You’ve also made statements on CiF about some of those here which I think are disgraceful, and I wouldn’t expect them to be especially forgiving, even if apologies were forthcoming, which they don’t appear to be.

    But should you wish to continue to contribute here, I for one am prepared to accept you as you are, and judge you just as I attempt to judge anyone else here, on the basis of what you say here and the way you say it.

    On previous experience, I don’t imagine much of what you say will be of interest to me, but as far as I’m concerned, you’ve as much right to comment here as anyone.

    That’s what freedom of expression means to me, and that’s what Untrusted has always been about, as far as I’m concerned, not about being a clique or any of that nonsense.

    Long may that continue…

    But having read what you’ve written here over the past few days, and judging you, I hope, solely on that basis, it appears that you’re the same old BTH, dragging up shit the rest of us have long since forgotten, convinced of your own rightness and righteousness, without the smallest amount of self-awareness, simply interested in attempting to justify yourself to everyone but not able to take on board the smallest part of what anyone else is saying.

    As I said above, you’ve got as much right as anyone to post here, BiteTheHand, but really, I don’t know why the fuck you’re bothering.

  134. Atomboy: 'I was slightly perturbed, though, when an email came through from Sir Terry's office, saying: "Get fucked. If I want some booze I've got fucking great warehouses full of the stuff."'

    Thant's just bloody rude. Send Blue Nun next time.

  135. RapidEddie
    I'm still thinking BTW - been away most of the time since you posted that...

    All the tedious twittering from Climate Camp made for some irritating conclusions about protest, although the day was saved for me by Zounds and his comments about the Whitehall Anarchist Group, whose site is worth a look...

    There have been some outstandingly ignorant pieces by Ilana Bet-El on the EU, by Amel Boubekeur on French feminism (pro Burqua, describing Ni Putes as 'alarmist'), so so many ignorant as shit pieces on ... well everything really...

    Thanks for that heads up earlier too.. Mark K can knock out a tune alright, and AK is awesome...

  136. however one can always aspire to this I put subtitles because I know not everyone is a polyglot like myself...

  137. @RapidEddie - ever see a crowd you weren't looking to please? (-:

    3. Worst commenter - scherfig. For the third year running.

    BTH worst commenter? Seriously? He's got a lot of issues, but jeez, he's bringing up the rear in a strong field.

    I'd place him well behind Len Firewood and anyone of the BNP posters who BB will be able to name.

    Also, sabraguy, a Zionist twat who would be less unpalatable if he restricted his neo-con triumphalism to the I/P threads, but unfortunately seems to think that getting multiple reccs from the GIYUS crowd means that he has some kind of credibility elsewhere on Cif. A seriously sick puppy.

    In the same vein, BatleyMuslim. In short, a wanker.

    BreakingFree - if waltz is the darling of the Daily Mail lurkers, BreakingFree is the doyenne of those who haven't yet mastered two-finger typing. As is her fellow small-minded bigot, worriedblueeyes - cannot even begin to dscribe the contempt I feel for her and her postings about her brave, beloved son and the scummy people he drops bombs on.

    FuriusCamillus - who namechecked this blog on the Ciffies thread but has never had the guts to show up on here. A nasty piece of right-wing pondlife-sucking scum.

    But my vote for worst commenter has to go in the end to HermioneGingold. A seriously banal attention seeker. At least the right-wing commenters above have something to say.


  138. RapidEddie, hello good soul - I like your noms.

    Had it been female, and not feminist, leg for the humping I would have had to have nominated Stoaty, but in the circumstances I think your nomination will do a MAM on the rest of us.

    Stoaty's not the sort to idle his time on a no-contest contest so I think your nominee will win by a breathless head, to say nothing of the rolling eyes and leading tongue

    Small world Shaz - we left in 2000 after 15 mostly happy years there. Grand street to walk a male dog on, lots of good trees to piss on.

    Talking of Winston Churchill as Hank was - did you know that the STS Sir Winston Churchill was built in Hessle?

    Fine Sailing Boat

  139. Hank, gandolfo, Atomboy
    You funny bastards. Right. I'm taking my last glass of wine to bed, where either it or I or both am needed
    Night ;-)

  140. BW
    how passé really it should be a good cognac..

  141. deano - Mum moved there in '95. She loves it, even though the house is really too big for just her since my dad died - she keeps talking about moving, but I doubt she will! Great for dogs, but when the kids were little we had to walk on the road with the buggy - pavements no good! Didn't know about the STS SWC - thanks for the link. Hope you have a great Christmas, if we don't collide again before then!

    gandolfo - Formidable!

  142. Oh, while I think of it - Bea Campbell:




  143. Keyser Soze is living in a cul-de-sac in Northampton?

    Organised crime clearly doesn't pay.

  144. @rapid
    3. worst commenter
    I personally find the repetative psychobabble of freewoman with the smacking islamophobia crass and repetative at their very best

  145. @gandolfo - good shout. Freewoman is a tiresome Islamaphobic drone. I'm guessing she's either in the armed forces or has a partner who is.

    Put her in the same box as worriedblueeyes.

    @Rapid - how many votes has GeoffreyAlderman got so far for worst ATL contributor? And is there any way to rig the vote?

  146. @hank
    I was guessing that she was actually banged up in some semi derelict asylum and occassionally given use of the internet as part of her "therapy process"

  147. Could I use your space to pass on my appreciation of JayReilly's post on WDYWTTA today, 21 Dec 2009, at 11:39AM.

  148. From WADDYA tonight...

    "As my relative, who came out of Buchenwald concentration camp, always said

    'Living well is the best revenge'."

    Guess who?

    It's a fair point though. After all, the Nazis were motivated purely by their contempt for bourgeois airheads who cared for nothing beyond shoes, jewellery and the ballet.

    There might have been a little collateral damage involving 59.8M people who didn't fit the profile, but hey, let's not let the Holocaust, much less the Second World War, get in the way of a self-aggrandising story which fits your story of victimhood.

    @RapidEddie - if the poll for worst commenter is still open, I'd like to vote for Brusselsexpats. A seriously twisted, cynical, emptyheaded, meretricious, mercenary, hormonally-conflicted, pettyminded, narcissistic, shoe-fetishist guy.

    Most of the longtime posters on here have never taken her seriously, and I certainly wouldn't have nominated her if not for the recent turn she's taken, trying to build some credibility by invoking the Holocaust and her new Jewish bf.

    I don't recall Bru ever mentioning her Jewish heritage before, either here or on Cif, nor can I ever recall her mentioning anything about her religious or political beliefs until a couple of weeks ago, when she lost the plot completely and constructively dismissed herself.

    She is of course persona non grata around here since she alienated everyone with her ill-judged and spiteful attacks on posters far more popular than her.

    Given her personality, it's not surprising that she would try to reclaim some kind of moral high ground by assuming the mantle of victimhood, however vicarious. It surely can't be long before she's back here claiming that she was hounded out not just by the misogynists but by the anti-semites...

  149. Hank - if you have an interest in the Merchant Navy story in WWII bookmark the following and read it at your leisure

    Merchant Navy Stories/photos

    My special and expensive library ticket to the law library at the local Uni has expired so I cant get access to the law references necessary to write an informed piece for UT2.

    Hearsay stuff not really an option.

  150. "Living well is the best revenge'."

    .. a friend of a friend of an acquaintance of Bernard Madoff no doubt.