15 August 2010


The Giant's Causeway, Co. Antrim (Credit: The Mister, July 2010)

It is never difficult to distinguish between a Scotsman with a grievance and a ray of sunshine. - PG Wodehouse


  1. PeterJ from last thread.

    I think it's a good idea to involve local papers, especially if that can be for the public shaming of the local MP.

    As for lists of people losing their jobs, I think it might be like the Channel 4 "Unreported World" programme recently about American unemployment.

    Those who lose their jobs end up sleeping rough in camps under the freeways because they are too ashamed to be seen to have been failed by the perfection which is the American Dream.

    They are also kept from public view by the police, who do not want them spoiling the postcard image of mom's apple-pie and American wholesomeness.

    I basically agree, though.

    There was a series of programmes called "Breadline Britain" to highlight the social successes of Thatcher's heyday.

    Remember that this is the first time that this type of austerity and poor-bashing has been tried in the internet age.

    I would suggest that it needs to be a type of distributed campaign, so local papers and other blogs are ideal.

    It needs slogans and rallying calls - like Breadline Britain above - which people can copy and develop.

    You need to take the government PR, distort it or whatever and use it against them.

    So, David Cameron's Broken Britain then becomes something like the old I'm Backing Britain but a picture of Cameron with the slogan I'm Breaking Britain.

    Whatever, you get the idea. It should be fun.

  2. thaum

    As they say in Newcastle:

    It's had time to be the morning!

  3. That's a good saying, AB.

    Sounds like there's been some very good discussion over the past couple of days to catch up with.

  4. This seems to be a starting point for local newspapers.

    You need to click to the paper's site and then look for the contact us section.

    Remember that CiF is not the only, er, fruit.

    More like a fruitcake stuffed with nutters.

  5. For Leni, Paul, LaRit, Sheff and many, many others on here who are worried re welfare reform this is a good group to join: no-to-welfare-abolition@googlegroups.com

    They send round up dates and emails - links to local groups who can meet up etc. and they are organising a demo at the Tory party conference in Birmingham in October.

    Also carerwatch have a great campaign as far as welfare abolition goes and employment rights etc. No to welfare abolition isn't just about welfare they are also concerned about employment rights and wages, working conditions etc.

    The thing is linking people together - if everyone at Carerwatch also became a member of the welfare abolition google group and everyone on UT who is interested became a member of both then suddenly three separate groups of a few people become one group of a hundred or more and it can grow from there. So I have put up the address here for 'no to welfare abolition' - you have to sign into google to join a google group but it is easy - from there we can then get them over here maybe too? More people on the UT sharing ideas.

    That Clegg article is sick the man is a disgrace.

  6. Thanks for that list, Atomboy - I already had my local editor's address lined up, but I might spread the net a bit wider.

    Has to be worth a try.

    I'll check the group out too, Princess.

  7. Nice pic, Thaum, can't resist the quote tho...

    "Worth seeing? Yes; but not worth going to see."
    Johnson, Samuel

    Google groups a good idea PCC. I'll have a look at that. Good to see Nap too. Chin up matey, the sunshine is lovely and they haven't found a way to tax it, yet. : )

  8. Turm, Johnson was an idiot as the drive up the coast is breathtaking. :-P

  9. Couldn't find that group PCC, have set up our own.


    Don't really know how that works but lets get some members! Start sharing ideas, info and strategy!

  10. Hey Turm will check out our group - cool. Re the 'no to welfare abolition group' I don't know why it isn't coming up? But I am bad at links.

    Anyway if you click onto this page: http://www.lcap.org.uk/?p=253

    It is the London coalition against poverty - about halfway down is a working link to the no to welfare abolition group - it will tell you you cant see stuff as you are not a member and has a link to click on to apply to join.

  11. You cannot post images here, but I found:


    which allows you to edit pictures online, which I normally find impossible to understand, but it worked easily.

    Wrecker "Honest Dave" Cameron

    Just to show that any moron - in this case, me - can produce something in the way of propaganda in about ten minutes.

  12. Nice AB! There is a UT photo page, I'll fwd the details if you post an e-mail addy, you can delete it after..

  13. AB/Turm

    Have copied AB's example to the gallery. If people have a play with that photo editor we can post the results up in the gallery, then anyone can use them.

    Just back from lovely walk in the Peak. Was so tranquil and beautiful, didn't see a soul all the way round - almost possible to forget all this shit.

  14. Thanks Turm and Sheff.

    Meanwhile, on WADDYA:

    Ah, look! The shape of things to come.

    Help us stop £1.5bn benefits scroungers

    The Sun declares war on on Britain's benefits culture.

    TODAY The Sun is declaring war on feckless benefits claimants to slash the £5BILLION wasted in Britain's shambolic handouts culture.

    Hundreds of thousands of scroungers in the UK are robbing hard-working Sun readers of their cash.

    They cannot be bothered to find a job or they claim to be sick when they are perfectly capable of work because they prefer to sit at home watching widescreen TVs - paid for by YOU.

    Do you know a benefits cheat?
    Report them by TELEPHONE: 020 7782 1340 or EMAIL: benefits@the-sun.co.uk

    We all know that prior to the election, David Cameron used to be whisked away on Rupert Murdoch's son-in-law's (Matthew Freud, one of the Freud dynasty) private jet each time the septuagenarian global media mogul and master of the universe wanted to tell his underling what to do.

    So, whose message is the "kick-the-poor, they are human scum" meme?

    The organ-grinder's or his little dancing monkey's?

    Hard to tell, but who cares when you have access to the highest selling national daily in Broken Britain?

    Now, which way will The Guardian go on this?

    As Tony Blair proved, it is so hard not to just fall into line and yap obediently at the heels of the big boys.

    Especially when there might be a pat on the head and a treat in it, as long as you can keep up that begging pose and look as cute as can be...

    Yap! Yap! Is that a ribbon they are getting for my hair?

  15. BTW Turm

    I have split the atom into so many fucking pieces, mostly forgotten, as I have adopted one identity after another that I hardly ever even bother to try to check emails these days.

    I'll set one up which I can remember and let you know.

    If anyone feels they are suffering from a lack of multiple-personality disorder and wants to take one of my identities for a spin, let me know.

  16. Tempting AB!, Who are you on cif at the moment?

  17. Came across this one of Milburn, who is now going to join the ConDems because all political parties are now the same, so you can just move around and mingle, like a drinks party.

    Why he looks like a tortoise who has just had a pineapple thrust up his backside is another question.

    Fill your boots.

    PS I do not have copyright permission on these images. Ha! Ha!


    At the moment, I am legion...

  18. I'm not sure if I know the answer to this conundrum but I'm guessing there are hundreds if not thousands of blogs just like this one where the penny has finally dropped people are saying "right, enough is enough, let's set up a protest site and start recruiting.

    I fear we are just playing into their hands and,yes this is fundamentally an "us v them" situation.

    Maybe if we could get something up on Youtube to that effect and call for nationwide two minutes silence at some date in the near future in remembrance of the death of our democracy.

    A Saturday afternoon at 3 O'clock would be a good time, when all the football grounds are full!

    Any takers?

  19. I'm up for it checkov.. Join the A.T.L group and start the ball rolling.

  20. Turm:your link to the ATL group didn't work.
    could you clarify? thanks.

  21. Try this checkov..

    All That's Left

    I've had that Milburn image, cheers AB!

  22. I've uploaded the Milburn pic to the gallery and created a couple of sets. One for 'propaganda' and one for the UT meetups

  23. Hee hee, love the "best defacement" one!

  24. OMG: they are just taking the piss now.
    Fucking Blunkett's getting on board!

  25. @chekhov

    Blunkett? Have I missed something?

  26. Ah. As you were, chekhov; I have just seen it.

  27. I came here in case I have finally gone insane.

    Could someone confirm once more that we have today witnessed the end of democracy in any accepted or meaningful sense of the word in the UK, from the coalition government which promised to restore it and mend broken Britain?

    This is war, isn't it?

  28. It's war all right, AB. The political class and its corporate mates against everybody else.

    And you remember those politicians who said they were standing up for everybody else? Yes, so do I. Wonder what happened to them apart from the brown envelopes?

  29. PeterJ

    It is just the utter blatancy, the barefaced parading of the kleptocracy by Blunkett and Milburn and its facilitating by the government.

    They are basically saying: "What the fuck are you scum going to do about it?"

    Complete and utter daylight robbery under the all-seeing eye of the internet.

    I still keep thinking I am going to wake up.

    This is truly astounding...

    ...and they will probably get away with it.

    This is the government-sponsored corporate heist of the UK.


    I have joined your group but not sure quite what to do next.

    I decided to use my real name because I do think it is so important on the internet to be exactly who you pretend to be.

    So, the email is:

    thatatomboyjohnny at gmail dot com

    I'll leave it here so that anyone can use it to remind me when I forget...in about ten minutes.

  30. That Sun story is shocking.

  31. Furthermore, the reason many stay in watching TV is because that is cheap. In Britain, even just to go somewhere on the bus costs a fortune, so a TV becomes attractive.

    Also many stay in because they are beaten down by the system and lose self esteem. It is happening to me even, it has been a lovely weekend and I have spent most of it indoors, I am lethargic and down in the dumps.

    Other than that I am fine. The most important thing is to keep busy and keep occupied. Good luck with your campaign group.

  32. I would also recommend reporting that Sun article to the Press complaints commission.

  33. Would it be a good idea to start a campaign where we report the likes of Ashcroft, Green et al to the sun for being scroungers?

    Maybe we could have a section on ATL collecting the names of known tax avoiders?

  34. Blogger keeps breaking, I get these little spanner and screwdriver icons?

    Good idea to get a list of the tax dodgers RB! Hi Nap! I've spent a lot of today in the house too, think i'll take a stroll. L8r chums.

  35. Turm: how does the posting protocol on ATL work?

    Just posted on there and I seem to have opened another thread, when I was just attempting to join in the chat.

    (BTW: I clicked on "new post".... couldn't find a "Post Comment" to click on

  36. 'Would it be a good idea to start a campaign where we report the likes of Ashcroft, Green et al to the sun for being scroungers?

    Maybe we could have a section on ATL collecting the names of known tax avoiders?'

    Either that, or deluge the Sun's disgraceful shop-a-cheat email service with names of known tax avoiders?

  37. Hi All

    Just put bit up on waddya about local guardian efforts.

    go to Guardian local - then cardiff, leeds or E'boro.

    All absolute rubbish at the mo but perhaps we can use them ?

    Have to dash. xx

  38. Certainly, a campaign to report tax-dodgers would be a good idea.

    We are always told that tax avoidance is such a victim-free sport that it is actually a positive public good.

    It isn't. It is simply the rich wriggling out of their responsibilities because they are too psychopathic and feckless to do the right thing.

    Do not expect the Sun to publish anything like this, though.

    You could check whether News Corporation pays tax in the UK, however, since it has tended to be an immutable law running through successive governments that you never, never ask Rupert Murdoch to pay tax for fear of what he might do to your electoral prospects if you did.

    The Guardian, naturally, is another media group which likes to say "No!" to the taxman.


    I had your problems.

    I assumed it was just my natural thickness.

  39. It's all new to me on the google groups! Thanx for your efforts thus far all, lets see where it takes us...

    I saw three swans flying over the village just now, with a big gold butterball sun just at the horizon and a half moon on the blue sky, a beautiful evening.

  40. "This is war isn't it?"

    Yep: hauling Blunkett on board was the equivalent of Cameron saying, "fuck you suckers, now bend over, this is going to hurt, a lot!"

    He's still trying work out how to deal with the humiliation of being a "fag" at Eton.

    I despair sometimes, I really do.

    You couldn't make this stuff up; as Hermione said on wadya, "Beyond satire"!

  41. @Ratboy: there seems to be a bit of confusion about how to post on "ATL". Since you managed to post an the first thread rather than opening a new one (which is what, I think, myself and Shazz and Sheff have done)could you enlighten us as to the correct procedure?

    No doubt a few teething problems in its early days but I'm sure we will get the hang of it quite soon!

  42. chekhov

    I had your problems.

    I assumed it was just my natural thickness.

    15 August, 2010 20:33
    Thank god for that; someone else as thick as me!

  43. Evening all.


    I just clicked on 'reply' and my post appeared. Beginner's luck, I assume - shame about my linky, however :(

  44. This is war isn't it?

    Yup - sure looks like it.

    I joined the googlegroup too and put a message up - but not sure I've got it right.

  45. Just pasting this from "wadya"

    "If David "I'm setting myself up nicely to make money on the backs of the poor through my consultancy with gang-masters to the government, A4E, especially under the ConDem's poor-bashing regime and The Sun's shop-a-scrounger campaign" Blunkett does join Iain Duncan Smith's misnamed Centre for Social Justice think-tank cover operation, should his constituents not start a campaign to have him de-selected and removed from office?

    After all, they elected him as a Labour MP and he should now be performing the role of a part of Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition.

    They did not elect him to be a collaborator who wanders across the floor of the House on a whim to feather his own nest."

    I'm losing the will to live!

  46. Blunkett:

    "Adviser on business development to A4e Ltd; global public service reform. (£25,001-£30,000 per financial year) I occasionally travel overseas on behalf of the company.
    I have not yet drawn down any income from the above directorship".

    Also had a contract with The Sun, worth £45,001-£50,000 per financial year, which seems to have ended October 2009. Paid a few thousand for writing for The Times these days.

  47. Hi Chekhov,

    I clicked on 'reply' at the bottom left of the previous post. I hope that helps. I'll see if I can figure out how to upload some pictures later. I've got a collection of the conservative mock posters saved from the election.

  48. Right, off to bed, check in tmra, when I expect to hear the zombiefied head of Mrs Thatcher has been found in a jar in No10, and has in fact never left there, rather everything that has happened in the last 20 years has transpired exactly to her design...

    Sweet dreams ; )

  49. BTW Turm: I'm getting e-mails from people posting on "ATL".
    I don't mind but some people might not want their e-mail address so easily accessed.

    Great idea to set up a "Google group" site and I'm with you all the way but perhaps you might consult with Montana about how she tackled security issues when she set up the UT site.

    Let's not beat about the bush here; however much we dress it up as idle chit chat with bit of humour, we all know that we are being subversive and as far as the bastards in Westminster are concerned that's tantamount to treason.

    So let's not shoot ourselves in the foot on "ATL" before we have even got out of the traps, if you know what I mean.

    Does that make sense?

  50. "I'm losing the will to live!"

    Stop reading waddya then, chekhov.

    It's the ultimate water-cooler for vacuous liberals with nothing of interest to say. Waddya used to have a point about 18 months ago when the debate was about the Graun's editorial policy and the talk policy on Cif.

    Once the ruling elite won by buying off some of the rebels with offers of ATL pieces, it lost any credibility. As did those who spend all their time on there because they haven't got the balls or brains to engage on CIF proper.

    Waddya's a rest home for the intellectually mediocre, the type of people who matily address Hadley Freeman as "hadders" and still get dissed or ignored.

    The type of people who think that hermione is a socialist heroine.

  51. I'm getting e-mails from people posting on "ATL"

    Me too. Looks as though any posts are forwarded by default to members' email addresses?

  52. Hank --- I've only been following waddya for a little while, and it was bloody vacuous, but the last few days and this weekend have serioused-up. A number of hard BTL posters having a go at the guardian editorial policy on ATOS and A4E.

    I'm just about to take my 'real' e-mail address off the only google-group I belong to, because it is seriously clogged with chatter on craft cider-making.

  53. I don't want to sound "alarmist" but I think we should all know what the terms and conditions are before posting on "ATL"

    We all know that Montana protects our privacy. Is it possible to make your own rules up if you subscribe to a "google group" website?

    So far I've received e-mails from Ratboy Shazz and Sheff but I'm pretty sure they didn't think they were actually sending an e-mail to me.

    Did any of the above receive one from me?

  54. shaz -- must be a box somewhere to tick if one doesn't want all those mails ?

  55. Chekhov - I got one from you, Ratboy, Sheff, Turminder, MsChin... and me.

    Frog - just going to have a look! :o)

  56. Okay ATL people - go into 'Edit my Membership' & check 'No email'...

  57. I've had those mails too guys, the perils of google groups... I'll try and sort it out in the AM. Sorry!

    : (

  58. Ah, I see Shaz is on the case. l8rs.

  59. EDIT MY MEMBERSHIP just done at Cider Workshop Google group too !

  60. Concerning ATL -

    You can prevent being emailed each message by selecting -Edit my membership- located on the right hand of the home page. Choose the top option - No Email-.
    However as stated by Chekhov earlier this doesn't address security concerns people rightly have. I've never set-up a google group so I'm unsure if Montana can select an option to prevent messages being emailed regardless of user settings.
    I'll have a look into whether there is an option to mask your email, but hopefully there will be a central way Montana can tighten up the privacy settings.

  61. Posted this to ATL


    Some nasty Benefits Scroungers stuff

  62. The symbolism of the personnel announcements by the ConDems still staggers me. The cuntocracy has won, we had inklings of that with New labour, but Jesus wept, this really is rubbing folk's noses in it. The blatant contempt of all those involved for ordinary people is staggering, but this is so overt, so out-there, yet also so fucking pointless if they wanted to do much: the likes of Philip Green, Milburn and Blunkett will contribute sod all, but are brought in as a gratuitously extra way of saying fuck you. This is all about sending out a message to we little people that we don't matter.

  63. By the way, regarding the Google group, the person who set it up,so that's TX, can, I think, hide the member list so other members don’t have access to all Group members’ email addresses. To do this, click Group settings > Access from within a Group.
    Find the section for Who can view members? and change it to only allow managers to view the members list.

  64. Hi Turm - I do get emails from other members of the 'no to welfare abolition group' and if I send a message it does show my email. But Alisdair seems to know how to turn it off.

    I cannot believe that Blunket and Milburn have now joined the bunch of cocks in the condems. And Sheffield is being well and truly shafted isn't it just? I mean Blunkett obviously doesn't give a shit about forgemasters if he is willing to join this shower. I just cannot believe the news - every day there is something new that my brain can't quite take in.

    I firmly believe the UK is being 'shock doctrined' it really is.

    As others have said - this is war!

  65. There is a box - you can tick the no emails thingy.

    see there is now an article on Cif re. "Nudge"

  66. @Princess: yep, the "shock doctrine" is being applied as we speak. We thought( or at least those of us aware of it) that it just applied to third world countries.
    Not a bit of it; welcome to the UK, a new third world country where the poor and disabled are rich pickings for corporate exploitation.

    Next game show? Who can take it up the arse before succumbing to haemorroids?

    Sorry to be so blunt but I'm sick and tired of these cunts masquerading as "right honourable" members of Parliament.

    Even the thought, let alone the reality of Blunkett getting a second bite of the cherry left me nauseous and I had to have a lie down in a dark room.

    I thought I might wake up and find it was April the first but no, this fuckwittery is for real isn't it?

    Fucked if I know what to do!

  67. Chekov - I agree with you completely. The Blunkett news has really fucked me right off. I fear the only thing to do is what has been discussed and try to fight things as much as we can.

    Eventually one of two things will happen - either it won't be as bad as we have all been led to believe i.e. they won't be able to do it and they will back down on many areas.

    Or things will be as dire as their current pronouncements indicate they will be. If that happens I do believe that people will wake up and get very angry. What scares me though is that we will then end up on a road to right wing extremism.

    In the US the Tea Party movement is a revolutionary movement - just a bloody fascistic one. The Republican party think it is under their control I would hazard a guess that it isn't. I think Krugman has it spot on when he said the other week that the Tea Party movement will grow and grow - because the Democrats think they are all racist right wing nuts whereas his view is the nuts are in charge but many members are middle and working class people sick of paying taxes and getting no benefits for it. Instead of campaigning for more benefits - they have repeatedly been let down by Democrats so feel deserted by the 'left' - they campaign to keep more of their own money and not pay the taxes in the first place. His argument was if the US doesn't cap its massive war machine and start to create jobs and benefits for its own citizens it will face a far right revolutionary movement.

    That is unfortunately what I could see unfolding here too down the line.

  68. "Yeh, ok, stevehill, but how?

    And you've recently become a father of two young boys.

    Let's be honest, you're not going to be adding much to the global gene pool.

    So, you've bought yourself a Thai bride.

    Well, that's the free market. It's not much consolation to the hard-working guys you put out of work just so that an ugly chinless backscratching mason could buy up in the marriage market is it?

    An ugly amoral chinless twat who buys a fuck and a family - the neoliberal poster boy par excellence."

  69. Sorry, chekhov and princess - you carry on talking amongst yourselves. I'm rambling....

  70. Princess + Chekhov

    How come the right wingers are are the streets while we stay home ?

    he EDL seem to be gathering members and marchers . What has gone so wrong ?


    You don't like Steve then ?

  71. think have manageed to log into ATL group - wd TX - haave been bit bad recently, is some chaos here (not me but personal) will take some dealing...

    roger ebert clearly one of life' gentlemen, as a sideline.

    Plus, just sojmething from Dad, which tickled me:
    "I'm rambling here as a way of avoiding trying to avoid pulling something together out of a disparate mass of random thoughts for this morning's service at L____, where my organist plays his own machine as if at an afternoon tea dance for people with zimmer frames beneath a glitter ball. Last time, I asked if he could play a little faster for the last one and he said "faster than what?". This could become the title of my searing expose of life and work in t'ministry, as yet unwritten . . . "

    Anyway ...

  72. Hank - is that what you've just posted to Stevehill? On what thread? Or have you just posted it here? Whatevers good stuff.

    That man makes my blood boil, his views are morally degenerate and based on nothing more than rampant greed and yet he thinks he is so smart and such a savvy economist. Has he really bought a Thai bride?

  73. erm? 1 new of 1 PhilippaB (1 author) 12:26am
    Hi all 2 new of 3 brook richard (3 authors) 12:24am
    Hello 1 new of 2 princesschipchops (2 authors) Aug 15
    ?????????? 2 paz Newis (2 authors) Aug 15
    View this page: "Nondoms and tax dodgers" 2 MsChin (2 authors) Aug 15
    What now?

    above is out "Topics list" for ATL. First line of post registering as "topic" - makes us all look a bit undecided .

    I posted - was told it had gone thru but 'tis nowhere to be found.


    Old tactic - threatening murder and then only inflicting GBH. This could be their game so that we could be seen as panic mongers and also make people accept the still unacceptable from a misguided sense of relief.

  74. quite, leni - but only got a decent menu page when had already put in something new - will work on that...

  75. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/aug/12/homeless-poles-rough-sleepers

    Welcome to Britain.

  76. I didn't post that post to steve. No point. He's impervious to criticism.

  77. Yes he is Hank - like a brain dead robot repeating endlessly his lies and self justifications. Quiet on here this weekend - think the UT'ers are suffering collective depression.

    Off to bed - nite all.

  78. This comment has been removed by the author.

  79. "think the UT'ers are suffering collective depression..."

    Always been the case.

    The trouble with most of the regulars on here is that they all want to be nice and popular and are afraid of getting angry.

    I've been angry for years. And, bless you all, you've tolerated me.

    But I've always been ahead of my time and I'll fucking enjoy standing back and watching while you all get angry as your cosy lives unravel.

  80. g'mornin' to anyone who's about.

    Just been listening to Mark Thomas - The Manifesto. I like this idea - all politicians should be made to wear the names of organisations who pay them any money, on their clothing - like formula one drivers.

  81. Ha, I'm about, and me and Mark bonded at the Kilburn Tricycle to the point at which he handed me a commemorative teatowel and devoted the first chapter (Let's Bomb Switzerland) of his latest book.

    Suck on that, habib.

  82. Hank + Habib

    I ain't depressed. Politicians should be branded on the forehead - so we know what we are dealing with.

  83. I envy you Hank, I wish I could find self-worth that easily.

  84. Bugger, I've just checked - my contribution, "Shut Down Tax Havens, Bomb Switzerland" - was in fact chapter 2 of Mark Thomas's "People's Manifesto".

    Chapter 3 was "Models should be chosen at random from the electoral roll".

    Chapter 17 is "Everyone should be entitled to phone in one day a month and claim a 'FUCK IT' day off.

    Mark Thomas is a great live act. And a proper leftie.

  85. Definitely a hero.

    Regarding self-worth and how easily it can be found, I did once slow dance with and get a peck on the cheek from Josie Lawrence. No teatowel though - bloody cheapskate!

  86. @heyhabib - uh, huh huh, I want you, habib, uh, huh, huh uh, huh, huh.

    Or not.

    Who the fuck are you anyway?

    A squeaky voiced little tosser who's not got an opinion about anything.

    What does habib think?

    Habib thinks that he'd like to shag montana.

    Beyond that, who knows?

  87. Never mind, Hank, I'm sure Forest will get better. Not a bad result, really, did you see Reina's fun time?

  88. This comment has been removed by the author.