Our own little corner of Stewart
Rain here, and thought of the dogwalkers of UT -- The most affectionate ceature in the world is a wet dog . Typical Ambrose Bierce
Not a big fan of wet dogs, myself. Or indeed, dry ones.
I was brought up with em,rabbiting whippets in the country, but now do without very happily . My Ma --"Yes, but if we go to ..., what about the dogs ?"
@Dave:“…rabbiting… in the country…”We used shotguns for that. Lot less effort, and you could just lock the guns away in the cupboard for a fortnight when you went away.Unlike dogs, as you say.
Woke up to the sound of shotgunfire yesterday - start of the shooting season . Tho there are such large numbers of hunters here ( a very democratic activity as t'were ) that the chance of getting useful amounts of meat is small.
@dave:Yeah, likewise round us (Sussex). Lots of gunfire Sunday mornings, sounds quite close, though probably further away than it seems, you know how the sound of guns travels.Not been shooting for a while now – neighbour’s stag do back in June was the last, I think. Clays. Good fun, really should get out more with the gun.Not much meat on a clay though, either.
Swifty - sometimes here it IS close, like behind the house. Cross-country walks not advisable.They'll be letting out the pheasants some time soon, and occasionally they come into my garden and orchard . Bloody things are half-tame, no sport at all, but as belt-tightening advances I may practice with frog5's airgun, or just start feeding the creatures .Raisins soaked in rum was one recipe I heard .
@Dave:Given I live about a mile from the western end of the runway at Gatwick as the crow (or indeed, phezzy) flies, Sussex Plod might have something to say about the discharge of firearms if it came from the back of my house…My dad used to rear pheasants up North, he used to pen them on a bit of common land at the top end of the valley we lived in and release them in the autumn. Not my favourite shooting, to be honest, they fly like a bloody house brick, don’t seem to have the sense to fly *away* from the guns, just keep whirring away in a straight line in the direction they took off… preferred rabbits, at least they scamper around a bit.And we used to give away any phezzies we killed (after dressing them), or sell them to the local pub – likewise with the rabbits. Only my dad liked eating them – me, my sister and my mother never got a taste for either.
As I understand it Swifty the idea of rabbiting is to supplement the goods in the pantry............not to blow the fuckers to kingdom come. Rabbit is very tasty but not quite so good when peppered with shot.My dogs go on holiday with me, in fact they go everywhere with me and usually just wait in the car (mobile kennel) if they are not allowed in whilst I'm doing whatever.True that wet dogs are smelly but what the fuck so are me feet when they get wet after a ramble across the fields. All invites to my place are accompanied by the reminder "I live with dogs bring your own nosegay" Having had three kids, the paraphernalia of dogs is less demanding and the dogs don't answer back and constantly enquire if they are there yet as we travle around. I liked having the kids and the dogs are a sort of extension I suppose. Small children crap themselves and dogs fart neither of which are quite as bad as the odour of the incontinent geriatric. Fuck the piss pads it's the Beachy Head solution for me when it gets that bad......which I guess is just another way of saying all is relative.Good to see you posting back on UT Swifty. I always find it interesting that the ebb and flow of life (and sometimes I imagine simple boredom) brings folks in and out and in.Andysays should be back in London now and I wonder if he will rejoin UT or whether his last fleeting visit pissed him off for good...Frog2 - I read recently that grey squirrel is now becoming regarded as a delicacy in parts of the UK.I'm always sad when I read of the vast numbers of very small migrating birds that get shot down over Southern Europe each year. You need a lot to make a pie...laters guys
Fuck it's 11.25 the above post is now a bit out of synch - I started it about an hour ago and drifted in and out etc.
@deano:”…the idea of rabbiting is to supplement the goods in the pantry............not to blow the fuckers to kingdom come…”Unless you’re pretty much standing directly over one, unloading a 12-bore cartridge at a bunny wabbit won’t blow it to kingdom come – low muzzle velocity, shot dispersal pattern and the surprising resistance of Bugs's fur render it lethal but not that messy at anything over 30 yards or so. Unlike my erstwhile mate’s .303 rifle, of course, which did make big holes in rabbits from a fair way off…That said, dressing a rabbit is a bit of a pain in the arse - particularly digging the spent shot out.
Morning allDrear day here, grey and damp. Definitely not dog walking or shooting weather.But it is a day for planning trips to pleasant lands - so have just raked the pennies together and booked a trip to Essaouira (Morocco), to escape from the Christmas frenzy. Friend of son & daughter in law has a house out there. Can't wait.
Not mad about pheasant but rabbit OK from time to time . I'd 'do' the former to get back at the shooters who take over the countryside here, and rabbit for meat and a stalk. The ideal air rifle needs a licence here, so'd have to be a less powerful type. Target shooting at pix of Sarko would be popular too.
Pretty much all my rabbiting is done on blogs or out with mates.
How bad is the ITV news they have just said, as part of their main news story that David Milibands wife is said to be furious at Ed!Flipping unbelievable gossip mongering.
jenni -- but very funny ... It's that old lack-of-self-awareness thing, by journos this time .
Hi all. Have to agree with Deano on the dog question - worth any ''hassle'' and more.Deano I owe you an apology. I wanted to meet up with you for lunch when we were away but we had no net access at all when we got up there for me to put a message up on here - and I was in a right rush before we left (I am very, very disorganised). So couldn't get hold of you. We had a quiet time anyway as little dog is still not right and needs to be kept quiet. But we had dead good weather and the shack had an outdoor decked area that was fenced off and looked out over fields, cliff and sea so you couldn't ask for more. The only time we did venture out to a pub little dog went mad and then big dog followed and we were roundly shamed. He has been very defensive ever since the op and if he even sees another dog starts howling! Jen, the coverage of the whole Milliband thing is just too vile for words. The already massive pressure not to 'lurch' left, the Red Ed shit etc. It makes me sick to my stomach that a right wing neo liberal like him is branded a practicing commie by the likes of the Mail and the Telegraph. I remember my mum leaving the Labour party in despair when Kinnock was made leader as she saw him as right wing - and now he is seen as some sort of outrageous Marxist. Shows how far the pendulum has shifted. Hope you doing good?
Hi LeniHave just read about a woman who is unable to leave her house because she sufferes from severe double incontinence.Didn't score enough points at her ATOS medical and has been declared 'fit for work'.Defies belief.
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Hi dave and Princess.Sounds like you had a nice break up here Princess, you were lucky with the weather, it is gray and nasty now.It was funny dave, it just took my breathe away a bit with how inappropriate it wasYou know you are in a parallel universe when Dianne Abbott is talked about as a 'loony lefty' and Ed can be talked about as being left at all when the day before he said the things he did on the Andrew Marr show.Not that he let much slip but that University stuff was very troubling.
Have you got a link for that Paul? Bloody shocking stuff.
Hi JenThe link to that story is HERE.You'll need to scroll down a bit to get to it.
This brooklynowes/bitethehand thing is getting beyond a joke. He's just inventing stuff to smear me with now. Apparently, I've "defended the reputation of J. Stalin", FFS!Can someone tell me why bitethehand was banned?
SpikeWhat with recent events both here and over at CIF i've decided i'm gonna try and not rise to the bait.Engaging with some people is tantamount to drowning in a pit of quick sand.And although it goes against the 'no grassing' rule i had drummed into me from childhood i've decided that if someone makes a serious false allegation i'm gonna report it to the mods and let them deal with it.
PaulThe comments on that are mostly truly vile, why are people so vindictive?I loved the self proclaimed 'red hot socialist' who worked for his money and didn't see why benefits claimants should drive a nicer car than him.
"Can someone tell me why bitethehand was banned?" Because he didn't like Jaffa Cakes ?
LeniHave just reread that link.It actually didn,t say the woman was examined by ATOS at home.I just assumed she was given her condition.
JenI ignore those sort of comments.I do believe the story of the woman though because i've heard of far cases worse cases than that being declared fit for work.The level of ignorance around not only this issue but many many others is truly astounding.
PaulLast night I read a report of parliamentary committe questioning IDS. Committee member asked him when ATOS contract was up for review - IDS didn't know ! One committee member said words to the effect @ The ATOS questionaire - despite complaints - doesn't deny a medical conditione exists it merely determines that the 'client' is fit to work'Long report - the number of 'don't knows' was rather frightening if not unexpected.I'll try to find it again - Iwas so disgusted I closed it before bookmarking.
I agree Paul it isn't an outrageous story, you only have to read Mike Bachs stuff to realise that these kind of things happen and I have some knowledge of the medicals from my sister, only anecdotal stuff but she was actually there and I can't see any reason why she would lie to me.In a weird twisted way you can see that the idea that everyone could do some kind of work is valid.The trouble is that it is a twisted and I might go as far to say evil idea, even in good times some people would require such massively constrained working conditions as to make them unemployable.And as we know we are not in good times, I was reading on Cif about some guy with a good degree who had a full time day job who to make ends meet did pizza delivery at night.To throw vunerable people into a job market that is only going to offer them rejection is evil and I do think that many will just not be able to cope.
On Wednesday Sept 29th unions will be striking all over Europe - but not in the UK it seems.
@Spike:Bitey was banned for being a vindictive little shit who deliberately distorted what people said and frequently made stuff up outright to smear other posters.In Biteyland, my (then) 9 year old son was a teenager with a drinking problem and I was a card-carrying member of the KKK because I once remarked that, despite the fact that my son is a white male, he does not have the privileges in life that Malia Obama has.The things he made up about BB were even worse.
By the way: home from work today because my now 11 year old son is ill.He still doesn't have a drinking problem, by the way.
Hi MontanaHope it isn't anything serious.
SpikeBitey works - alone or for a company - recruiting students for I think British schools and colleges. I did once ask him - here - to explain how this works as I am actually interested. I assume fees are payable by the parents. He didn't respond.
Montana"He still doesn't have a drinking problem, by the way."Hope that means he's getting plenty of fluids and will be better soon ;-)
MontanaGlad you have day off - even if for wrong reasons. Hope son is better soon. SheffI am wondering just where Ed will go with the unions now.
Montanacan you tell us about the rather odd statue ?
@MontanaThanks. I've told him I don't want to go to the mods but I don't see what else I can do if he continues to make up libellous shit about me.We'll see...
Leni - I wondered that too. I think it's a Chac Mool. Not that I knew what one was till I looked it up.
@SpikeI wouldn't worry. The bitey persona is already bursting out through the previously unsullied skin of brooklynowes, and it's bound to do something really unforgivable soon. Like Diana eating a guinea pig in V.
deaninteresting. I looked at him for a long time - he has an air of expectant waiting about him. I wonder if the statues always looked in the same direction - W or E perhaps ?
Spike 14.36Brookly -- from what I've seen occasionally apparently sane, then goes snidily looking for a long fight ... waste of space, don't take the bait ? Madely -- another dumbass looking for long ones.I'd never dream of reporting any of those 'boring' types, leaving them dangling is more fun . Accusing you of defending Joe Stalin is just ludicrous, innit ? jenni 14.54 Arec made the point , about midnight, that the WCA etc system was not misfunctioning, but was broken . You hit the nail squarer , it's designed to break people. Leni 14.53- amazing IDS couldn't answer on the Atos Contract renewal date, OR is it that not continuing it is so much taken for granted ... because they're doing the job as intended ?Does anyone know the date, from elsewhere ?
Montana - regards to you lad. Jen/Paul - regular (frequencyy of once a week or once a month) bowel incontinence alone is supposed to get you 15 points and thus the benefit!The more I read the more I become convinced that most people will need advice about filling in the Incapacity/ES forms and being alert for the trick questions.Bastards - I did come across an unverified suggestion that the ATOS medics (and some are nurses rather than Drs) are on £1500 per week......which answers the question about ethics.PCC - worry not I'm sure that we'll run into each other again in due course. Glad youu had a reasonable break.I'll send you and Jen a copy (via Montana)of me password for a helpful Benefits site I've paid to join. I won't publish it here for reasons of copyright(Does M have your email addresess? )away to shop...
@daveThe ATOS contract with DWP runs until 2012 (seven-year term awarded in 2005). And according to this story, the contract's just been confirmed by the new government.
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201011/cmselect/cmworpen/uc468-i/uc468-i.htmfrog The link to the transcript. V long but worth a read. Some interesting stuff around 'up front payments' to main contractors and their subs. Also doubts around IT systems able to keep track of people - IDS is quite sure IT systems are fine but gives no supporting evidence.
@davePerhaps you're right, but there's lots of through-traffic on Whaddya and shit can stick.
LeniI am wondering just where Ed will go with the unions now.He's already being accused of being to the left of the leftist thing you can think of by the usual suspects and that's not going to go away soon. So now they've done their work for him and got him the leadership, I think it'll be gloved hands from the end of a long pole.MonkyfishCould you stick a link and the abstract for that Edmund Standing essay up on UT2. It's worth keeping available and it'll just get lost in the daily threads.
I am wondering how many points I might get from the medical if I turned up pissed out of my head. ;)
Peterthat is interesting - the committee questioning session was on Sept 15
JenniFor goodness sake don't paint your toenails. I know a woman in her fifties who made this mistake - her little grand daughter painted them. She was refused benefit on the gounds that she could reach her toes - despite severe spinal arthritis which restricted her movements and causes her almost constant pain. she should have worn shoes rather than sandals - but who knows these things before entering the lions' den ?
Leni - that statute is in Cancun Mexico You can find it's exact location from this Flikr copy Locate the tag and zoom in and out on the attached map ....
Leni/JenInteresting posts from you.At present around 50% of working aged people with chronic health problems/disabilities are employed.The remaining 50% are mainly classified as 'inactive' and claiming disability benefits rather than unemployed and claiming JSA.I can't help but think that the government is planning on many of the 'inactive' sick/disabled simply remaining 'inactive' but stripped of their benefits.For even they must realize that many of those declared fit for work by ATOS haven't got a cat's chance in hell of getting work either because of employer prejudice or becasue there simply ain't no jobs.What therefore will happen to the sick/disabled who don't have families to support them.Begging??Charities?Workhouses?Suicide?
Leni I have had judgements like that applied to me, I was refused psychotherapy recently on the basis that I dressed too smartly and made eye contact.I don't know how it works if you have physical problems but in the case of mental illness you get nothing unless you are a drooling mess.Catatonia and psychosis will (sometimes) get you the help you need, anything inbetween is not their problem.The system really stinks.
Looks like it is positioned North(feet) to South(head) and thus she/he is looking West?.....if I've worked it correctly??
Oops! I seem to have 'lost' the sentence about those stripped of disability benefits and not eligible for JSA.They were the ones i was referring too in my last para.
Afternoon all.For those of you who have not had chance to read the papers today, allow me to condense the main stories into a nice, easily digestible format for you!"Unions hijack our democracy to elect a communist....blah, blah, impending Apocalypse, disgrace, David woz robbed, and with it, all traces of human decency, dignity....erm, immigration and asylum seekers, ....we're all hostages now, err...something else about communism,...Ed talks about "Love", but what does that mean for the cause of 'x'-ism (from the Guardian that one, obviously) ....also, did we mention communism?....Oh, yeah, great result for bennie scroungers and cheats,.....DANGER, DANGER,......WE'RE ALL DOOMED (but it'll cost you a quid to read why),....regression, and, one more, for luck, COMMUNISM!!"
jennifera30 said... "I am wondering how many points I might get from the medical if I turned up pissed out of my head." ;)non Jen they will turn you away.Alcohol problems ( they are supposed to question if you need to have a drink in the morning) get a maximum of 2 points according to the guide I just got!
James As a benefit scrounger I can't tell you how excited I am about the election of known scrounger lover Ed Miliband, I am expecting my diamond covered scrounger book in the post any day. ;)
James DixonIt would appear, from the weekend's coverage, that Fox is to be adopted as the new bench mark in British journalism...
Wow deano really, so some poor git who is in the terminal stages of alcoholism gets two points?Shocking.
Spike-- I wouldn't call it "libellous shit", just plain shit and attempted smear that will be scrolled through ,and forgotten. Not worth giving those people more than a swift squash .I occasionally do react but only to put up something of general interest, not a real 'engagement' with them. PeterJ 15.54Bundling IT contracts together, with commercial confidentiality on top, I wonder what the rationale is ? The only obvious one I can see is implementing similar systems for two Departments, and being paid by each for in fact doing one job ! Not 100% sure all the Atos contracts have slid through, but does look like it.
lol James! - very accurate summary of what I've seen so far. I recommend that Edmund Standing piece that MF posted a link to yesterday if you haven't read it yet. Although it deals mainly with debunkingIslamophobia, he talks about our propensity for pessimism about societal changes and how this is ratcheted up into frenzies of apocalyptic gloom.
Indeed Jen, you'll be quids in now!From what I can tell, Ed's already got a soviet style strike force ready to take possession of all Britain's hardworking families' diamonds, and hand 'em over to the unions, who will, in turn, distribute them around among the feckless, undeserving poor, (who'll inevitably just trade them in for a subscription to Jeremy Kyle.com and fertility treatment to have another 15 kids)!!This is the future I tells ya. THE FUTURE!!
Agreed Sheff, it was a very good read.
@daveATOS Origin has contracts with DWP, the Ministry of Justice, and the Borders Agency, the last two restricted to IT services. It looks like the Government has taken the three contracts, merged them into one, and presumably knocked the price down a bit. The problem with doing that, of course, is that it will be harder to renegotiate parts of it now.@LeniReading the IDS hearing, it was interesting to see confirmed that the WCA so far is passing 68 percent of applicants as fit for work compared with DWP expectations that it would be about 23 percent. I'm surprised nobody on the committee picked up on that.
BittersIndeed. Although, to be fair, the FOX thing's been around for a while. (The Guardian actually beat the Murdoch press to it, surprisingly, but Sky news has embraced it completely now (compleat wiv spellingz mistakes and txt spk and evrything)).SheffI bookmarked the MF thing yesterday, I'll give it a read this afternoon!
deanoI think you're absolutely right.It would be great if eveerybody receiving the ESA50 form that precedes the ATOS medical had easy access to the help needed to fill it in 'properly'.Knowledge is power and all that.But what a sad inditement of where our country is at the moment where the sick and disabled have to have their wits about them when they're at their most vulnerable.
It is amazing how this stuff gets into your head and changes the way you think about yourself.I have worked, either full or part time since I was 16 and I have only claimed unemployment benefit one other time.It was for about six weeks when I left a partner I lived with and moved back up north to my parents house.I do feel guilty every day for claiming the benefits I do, I feel like a fraud (even though I am not).If the propoganda even works on me then it is no wonder that those who have never had to claim feel the way they do.
I would hope that by then Jen she would also be getting many more points from the physical problems that arise eg liver failure etc.The death throws of Alcoholics are very unpleasant so I've been told..... the final internal ruptures can put vomited blood and bile on a high ceiling as you retch your last.The thresholds are:15 points for a physical health problem10 points for a mental health problem or 12 points from a combination of physical and mental problemsas this layperson understands the system (thus far from my reading on the subject)
Radio4 islamification in Prison .... ?
Just read monkeyfish's edmund Standing article. Pretty persuasively written and the conclusion speaks volumes - to me at least - about how culturally impoverished Britain has become to allow such a pathetic consciousness to prevail.There was a programme the other day about post-Tito Bosnia and its current very precarious tripartite peace. Post-Dayton ghettoisation is leading to some very disturbing militancy on all sides; unless we act (internationally) very carefully over the next two to ten years we could soon have a European 'Palestine' to contend with. And, presumably we'll wring our hands over it while doing nothing and talking fatuuously about school dinners in Bradford.
I received this email, my adress is found on my Cif user profile, so I sometimes get interesting emails based on my comments,....Subject: network to house destitute asylum seekersI read the guardian article on destitute asylum seekers and noticed fromyour comments that you seemed to be sympathetic, at the moment I am tryingto set up a network to house destitute asylum seekers with no recourse topublic funds. Anyway i was wondering if you were interested in gettinginvolved, you dont have to offer accomadation you could just help findpeople who can. no obligations of course, just ignore me if your notinterested or if your not but know people who might be please tell them.anyway see below if your interested, thanksWe have had a couple of meetings and decided to join forces with LondonNACCOM which has the same aims. This is part of a national network.at the moment they are getting a list of hosts together so if anyone wantsto help find hosts eg by asking, emailing facebooking etc everyone youknow and generally spreading the wordl please do, or if anyone wants to bea host please let us know. ifthey live outside london doesnt necessarily matter, also maybe able torefer them to another naccom organisation i guess.we also discussed possibility of getting group together in kent wherethere seem to be a lot of supportive people.the next london naccom meeting is wednesday 6th october 4-6 at Praxis inPott St, Bethnal Green, so please come along.thanks elie........Obviously I am in no position to help, as my own housing situation is temporary, but I thought some people on here might be interested.The email adress is firstname.lastname@example.org
peterthe committee let IDS off the hook on lots of questions. he whole plan seems disconnected from the reality of things - figures picked from the air and reports based on supposition and paucity of actual information.
Paul"But what a sad inditement of where our country is at the moment where the sick and disabled have to have their wits about them when they're at their most vulnerable".Amen to that.And the most disgusting thing, the thing that can never be rationalised, is that this was the intention.Not to accurately assess anything, but to take from those who, essentially, were least likely to be able to defend themselves, or, often enough, are not even in a position to understand what is happening.Jen"It is amazing how this stuff gets into your head and changes the way you think about yourself.I have worked, either full or part time since I was 16 and I have only claimed unemployment benefit one other time".Again, this is intentional. It doesn't matter how much you've paid into the system, or how much you want to pay into a system that's so dramatically stacked against you, the second you claim anything, you're the criminal, the scrounger, the parasite.Don't believe any of it for a second. Because it's shite, and it's insidious, and it's wrong.
JamesI am still a bit shocked at the general attitude accross the board about Unions - did you read the comments of that Demos exec on the "expert" Observer panel yesterday ?? Just a rizla between him and the Mail.
Don't be silly Jen, there is no need to feel guilty. If anything, I feel guilty about not working, although really I suppose they were things beyond my control- severe teenage depression due to a very dysfunctional childhood, and then being on strong medications for several years afterwards and then I move to Glasgow looking for jobs, and the Karkaesque system of looking and applying for work defeats me.
BittersI didn't see that one, but there's been a lot of stuff over at the Observer about Unions recently, and I was also quite disheartened at the general consensus.Apparently, the Unions have done nothing but fuck up our country, and are the reason that we're all in the shit we're in.Which, is, you know, quite a funny way of looking at it, but there you go!!(Oh yeah, and throw a bit of disruption getting to work in there when they strike, and they're also responsible for rising infant mortality rates or some such too....)
JenYou mustn't feel guilty about being on benefits.One of the founding principles of the Welfare State was that people pay into the system whilst they can work and are then paid benefits when they can't work.It's like if you had been paying premiums into a private scheme to pay you benefits when sick you surely wouldn't feel any guilt claiming those benefits.So why feel gulity claiming benefits when you've paid tax and NI all these years.The benefits you get are yours by right IMO.
Obviously I am in no position to help, as my own housing situation is temporary, I don't think it's obvious at all Charles. You did say you were looking for voluntary work and although you may not be able to accommodate someone yourself, there's plenty of other things that need doing like befriending, conversation groups to help with English, admin work etc. You should consider getting stuck in - however bad your circumstances are and/or seem to you, a failed asylum seekers is infinitely worse.
Charles That is what I mean, they have got you coming and going.I have worked for over twenty years and you have been unlucky enough not to find a job but we are both cast in the same light.Every single person has a story to tell and some of them may not be flattering but we are all lumped together as scroungers and parasites.I hope your own difficulty finding a job has changed your mind about the people you see getting drunk or otherwise off their heads in Glasgow.Sometimes it is all they have.
Sheff, Jen.I am thinking of setting up, with help from others obviously a 'dole union' here in Glasgow. I, we, can't go sitting around all day complaining on Cif. You guys started that ATL project a while back, but how many of you have been off printing and distributing flyers, arranging public meetings etc, or mutual support networks for unemployed people.
"Boys from the Blackstuff" was on BBC4 yesterday.For those unfamiliar with it - it was a classic Alan Bleasdale Liverpool based series on the tribulations of the unemployed (in the early Thatcher years) of the 1980's.The haunting character of Yosser " Gizajob gizajob" quite sent the shivers down me spine. I'd had forgotten how brilliant the series was. Bernard Hill as Yosser (a man demented by his circumstances) was fucking amazingWell worth a watch on iPlayer if you don't know the stories...
Oh Charles don't do that.I am a clincally depressed person with anxiety issues.I have to get people to take me to the drs or anywhere else I might go.So now I should be ashamed because I haven't set up a local collective?You have no empathy at all do you?
@Charles:”…I am thinking of setting up, with help from others obviously a 'dole union' here in Glasgow. I, we, can't go sitting around all day complaining on Cif…”Crack on, then. Ditch the blogging and do something real.
Jen - remind yourself IB is a contribution based benefit. You only got it 'cos you paid your National Insurance contributions.Couple of keywords in there - contributions and Insurance.The kind of unilateral changes to the system of recent years would constitute breach of contract if a private Insurance company did what the government has done.Don't feel bad.
JamesThe Demos director is Kitty Ussher. Sickening to think how they've got the ear of the Party...
3P4 - if that's you behind the current Canadian flag my friend I have to say that I think you called it wrong in your now deleted WADDYA comment yesterday.I was very surprised at your comment.Hope you are feeling a little bit better without your dog. It sure takes time.
This is worth a read"Manufacturing Dissent": The Anti-Globalization Movement Is Funded By The Corporate ElitesUnder contemporary capitalism, the illusion of democracy must prevail. It is in the interest of the corporate elites to accept dissent and protest as a feature of the system inasmuch as they do not threaten the established social order. The purpose is not to repress dissent, but, on the contrary, to shape and mould the protest movement, to set the outer limits of dissent.To maintain their legitimacy, the economic elites favor limited and controlled forms of opposition, with a view to preventing the development of radical forms of protest, which might shake the very foundations and institutions of global capitalism. In other words, "manufacturing dissent" acts as a "safety valve", which protects and sustains the New World Order.To be effective, however, the process of "manufacturing dissent" must be carefully regulated and monitored by those who are the object of the protest movement.
And by the way Charles how dare you insult others for just whinging about stuff when all you have done is 'think' about setting up a dole union.How much work have you actually done?I am thinking about solving the worlds energy crisis by setting up a network of farts.Does that mean I can have a go at those who just campaign about climate change.
BittersThe whole 'think-tank' thing is another way we've adopted a US style approach to 'democracy', and I have to say, I think they're largely shit.For me, they're mostly set up to fill any gaps in the politics/business revolving door thing, (although, if he's about, I suspect the Duke could spread a bit more light on their relative shittyness), and because it sounds better when somebody says 'x think-tank recommended this', than, say, 'RBS' recommended this.....
JamesProbably. I suspect Duke has files on thes bastards ;-)Does anyone know why Madeleine Bunting got kicked out within three months of her Demos directorship ?Always intrigued me that did...
JamesDixon -- Spurious Respectability with a high-sounding name . I remember noticing way back how the BBC introduced " Niall Ferguson of the Heritage Foundation " to comment, objectively of course, on the Iraq War.
Christ, Jen, I did not mean to insult you. This is the problem with sites like the UT and the internet in general, people take things the wrong way so easily.Anyway I am not welcome round here. I only came on here to post that email I received becuase I know there are some people, ie Sheffpixie, who might be interested.Bye.
BittersI've no idea, but maybe, after working at the Guardian for so long, the shock of hearing somebody actually disagree with her nearly gone done her in.....DaveffIndeed, they always remind me of the political equivalent of 'scientific experts' that are often hired in for the defence/prosecution in the courts....Throw in a few studies, numbers, big-sounding words, and bish-bash-bosh, you've justified everything that ever needs to be justified/proved/pointed at with a flashy laser pointer, and it's job done!!
I've put a link up on UT2 to that Edmund Standing paper "Debunking the Islamisation myth.
"Christ ... people take things the wrong way so easily. 'Nope . Engage brain before posting , and when you go wrong, admit it . Fast . Imogen screwed up on that, too .Quite a few old-stagers around here at composing and distributing leaflets, etc, etc, as well. Spike, Sheff, me, for a start.
Sheff - not sure that your linked article "Manufacturing Dissent" wouldn't have been better titled "Emasculating Dissent".Either way worth the read.The world 'machine' really is depressingly sophisticated in it's smothering reach - but then we knew that.Can't figure out the new commenting system on UT2. The Palestine piece you also posted was a warming read but couldn't get to say so.
Re comments on UT2 - me too, thought I was being thick...
Thanks for the thoughts about Joe -- he'll be fine. There's been a tummy bug doing the rounds here for about a month now, so it's not surprising that one of us finally got it.Re: Commenting on UT2Oops. Kinda forgot about the Intense Debate thing. I'll remove it so that it goes back to the Blogger commenting.
Yay.Best wishes to the lad BTW Montana.
Comments are now back to normal on UT2, so you should be able to comment on both the Islamisation and Palestine articles.
Thanks for fixing that Montana. Hope your boy is back on form soon
Sorry Montana, but sometimes I just so fuckin grateful I don't live....etc...can't decide whether my favourite's 3 or 5"So in the spirit of Banned Books Week’s push to make people aware of the often insane reasons people try (and succeed) to ban books I offer you this sample list from the American Library Association’s website of books that have been banned and the stated reasons (from various schools and libraries) for banning them.The Top Ten Ludicrous Reasons To Ban A Book1. “Encourages children to break dishes so they won’t have to dry them.” ( A Light in the Attic, by Shel Silverstien) 2. “It caused a wave of rapes.” ( Arabian Nights, or One Thousand and One Nights) 3. “If there is a possibility that something might be controversial, then why not eliminate it?” ( Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee, by Dee Brown) 4. “Tarzan was ‘living in sin’ with Jane.” ( Tarzan, by Edgar Rice Burroughs) 5. “It is a real ‘downer.’” ( Diary of Anne Frank, by Anne Frank) 6. “The basket carried by Little Red Riding Hood contained a bottle of wine, which condones the use of alcohol.” ( Little Red Riding Hood, by Jacob Grimm and Wilhelm K. Grimm) 7. “One bunny is white and the other is black and this ‘brainwashes’ readers into accepting miscegenation.” ( The Rabbit’s Wedding, by Garth Williams) 8. “It is a religious book and public funds should not be used to purchase religious books.” ( Evangelical Commentary on the Bible, by Walter A. Elwell, ed.) 9. “A female dog is called a bitch.” ( My Friend Flicka, by Mary O’Hara) 10. “An unofficial version of the story of Noah’s Ark will confuse children.” ( Many Waters, by Madeleine C. L’Engle)"
Hi Montana,Nice to have you around! Hope Joe isn't feeling to poorly to enjoy his sick day. I remember being sick as a kid and my granny fussing over me all day and not having to do anything I didn't want to do - really quite enjoyable!Wouldn't mind a day like that this week myself. Unfortunately the dog isn't much cop at waiting on me hand and foot, so I've put a spag bol on for some comfort food. (For me, not her.)Miserable drizzly Monday and year-end company accounts to be sorted this week. Fantasising about escaping to a tropical paradise.
*aaargh!*to -> too
“It is a real ‘downer.’” ( Diary of Anne Frank, by Anne Frank)Fucking Hell.Mind you - have you read the last page? "Today is my birthday. Dad's bought me a drum kit".
monkeyfish - that's finished off my day nicely. I am now going to get absolutely quidditched in the name of utter fucking ignorance.
BitterweedIt only took a second, but my mind went through picturing the drum kit and wondering whether it was full-size or child-scale to thinking it was pretty good to be able to get hold of such things in wartime to picturing the snazzy, shiny, sparkling sides of the drums.Then it hit me.Brilliant.As I have said, Atomgirl tells me I must be autistic to some degree.The other evening, she was making a point by holding her thumbs together and flapping her hands to imitate a bat.All I was thinking was, "How am I going to get that fucking bat out of the room?"
Shaz - I loved your stinger at the tail end of WDDYA yesterday. It really made me laugh.Class.
"*aaargh!*to -> too ????Hard day thaum?
The Top Ten Ludicrous Reasons To Ban A BookPeople actually think these things? Jesus H....
Deano - not a great day, but things could be so much worse ... thanks!Off for the nosebag ... back in a bit.
Of course most people can do something – hardly anyone just does nothing all day, although what they can do may be very limited. The presumption that being on benefits equals being a useless member of the community who everyone else has to carry, while being in work equals someone wonderfully productive, is complete nonsense.While many people who are working full time still remain on benefits, because of their low income. Are they all scroungers too? Surely it is rather the employers taking advantage of the government top-ups?Why shouldn’t those who’ve paid their insurance policies be allowed to claim? But that was what Unum realised – make a whole section of conditions the fault and imagination of the claimer, and the insurance company can keep their money. Of course it is the intention that those on Incapacity who have been found not fit for work – generally for sound medical reasons – now be found fit for work – knowing that they still won’t be able to work, but they can be paid less benefit – or, even better, denied it altogether.If all of the people whose focus of work was doing things which make the lives of others more miserable and/or difficult, while doing nothing of use themselves, were made redundant, there’d be huge savings.Think tanks? A large wage for – what? How does one set of out-of-touch phonies talking to another set of the same help anyone? Chuck them onto the dole – then they can try starting to think. Around here most people over fifty, once they’ve lost their jobs, remain unemployed one way or another, and with real jobs increasingly being changed to voluntary ones for the unemployed to be sent on for ‘work experience’, there’s no way of winning. We now have a government of millionaires acting on behalf of billionaires – all working together, through the media, to remove the rights of the ordinary citizen, and denigrade anyone fighting on behalf of the less fortunate amongst us.Nobody should be made to feel guilty by their tactics – disgust for those tactics is all that should be felt.
Moonwave - excellent post.Tomorrow I'll be paying the year-end taxes.If I thought they'd all be going to benefits recipients - yes, even the odd scrounger - I'd be happy enough, but it annoys me that a good portion will be going to wars, Trident, bankers, etc.Wish we could earmark them.
Who is moonwave? ;-) (a quick wave, why not!) Hello and evenin' all..... back from being up France!Ahhhh.... Paris....2 days not long enough ;-( Now am seeing London with fresh eyes though.
8 hours in the Flea Market.... 100 records bought by MonsieurLR and 48 hours later, rockin'!
Hiya, LaRit! Glad you enjoyed yourself.You going to make it to Northampton on Saturday?
Heya Thauma!It was a long story, but a good one ;-) feel good though!Am going to do my best to get there on Saturday.
Great, LaRit - hope to see you there!Off to bed now.... NN all!
Top Tips for those dealing/struggling with an Incapacity Benefit Claim:(The following is the first of ten tips that have been sent to me in daily emails as part of marketing exercise promoting a professionally produced guide to claiming Incapacity Benefit. the guide is very good and costs £18.95 the top tips are free and worth sharing)"If you have to have a medical as part of your personal capability assessment (PCA) for incapacity benefit, it may seem like the doctor or nurse is just having a friendly chat with you. The truth, however, is that every question the doctor or nurse asks is being prompted by computer software called LIMA (Logic Integrated Medical Assessment) and very unfair assumptions are likely to be made based on the answers you give. For example, one of the questions you will be asked is whether you watch TV and what programmes you enjoy.If you say that you enjoy watching films, the doctor or nurse may well assume - without asking you any further questions - that you can sit comfortably for at least two hours without having to move from the chair. This means you will score zero points for problems with sitting.In fact, the law says the sitting test is based on how long you can sit on a very specific sort of chair: an upright chair with a back but no arms, like a dining chair or the sort of chair you might find in an office or at a supermarket checkout.And the truth may be that you can watch a film for two hours. But you probably don’t do so sitting on a dining chair. In fact, if you have back problems you may not sit at all, but lay on a sofa instead. And in that two hours you may get up and stand half a dozen times or even get up and walk around the room during the adverts, to relieve your back pain. But the doctor or nurse is paid on a piece rate for every medical they carry out. So they are very unlikely to take the time to ask you all the additional questions they would need to in order to build up an accurate picture of how long you can really sit on the correct type of chair.That being the case, it’s up to you to make sure you volunteer the information that they need rather than waiting to be asked. This applies whatever your condition: there are assumptions lurking behind every question.So, don’t make it easy for rushed health professionals to create inaccurate reports about you. Instead, use our guides to improve your chances of getting the correct decision about your incapacity for work by knowing the kinds of questions you’ll be asked and the assumptions that hide behind them. If you haven’t already seen free, sample excerpts from our guides, you can download them by clicking on, or copying and pasting, this link into your browser window and following the links on the page that opens:Live LinkTomorrow: How your incapacity medical could cost you your DLA.Good luck,Steve DonnisonDon’t want to wait any longer to get access to all our guides, news items, forum and confidential DWP resources? Find out how to join from this link:Link to Site
Night thauma, and hey LaRit!What's all the kerfuffle with Ashcroft/Panorama tonight, anyone know?
As you were...found something!
Fuck I've been spam binned again.Good to see you back LaRit - glad to read you had joy.
..deanothe chac mool statue has been buging me all day. Then i remembered H Moore ! http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.henry-moore.org/images/leeds_lh59_0.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.henry-moore.org/works-in-public/world/uk/leeds/leeds-art-gallery/reclining-figure-1929-lh-59&usg=__Rbl6NIT5fWqs_YnRMZX7WFNW_GI=&h=328&w=460&sz=35&hl=en&start=1&sig2=z09hvb9b4in1-CodLRWtJw&zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=EAf8YaGRWkMWtM:&tbnh=91&tbnw=128&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dchac%2Bmool%2Bhenry%2Bmoore%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26tbs%3Disch:1&ei=yQWhTOqSNMbfOLeB-cML
Cannot make links work !
Hi LaRit xx
ThaumaturgeWhat’s the odd ‘scrounger’ on a few quid – and often even then they’ve not much in the way of alternatives in reality (not saying it’s right – just more understandable when you’re low on options) – compared to all of those raking in sack-loads of taxpayers’ money just to find more ways of giving less to others and keeping more for themselves – and, as you say, some wars that are about … ? … something more to do with US imperialism than anything else – which comes to the same thing on a greater scale.La Ritournelle – waving back ~ ~
No doubt I'll be resurrected in due course.The post was to be the first of 10 ten tips that I've been given for those dealing with Incapacity Benefit claims/problems.I've posted a copy in the UT Resource section ( see the tab at the the top of this page) and I'll post copies of the other 9 tips in due course.Interesting post Moonwave - which area of the UK you posting from ?(if you don't mind being asked)
"Cannot make links work !"hehe - no foolin'?(Hope you don't mind, but I took the liberty....)Henry Moore doodah!
Leni - Of course! I thought I'd seen a similar theme/image elsewhere/somewhere but couldn't get it to click exactly where. I'll see if I can get the link you had in mind.
Jamesclever clogs - I was going to flirt with you but not now !
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/27/opinion/27krugman.html?ref=opinionAs if we needed anymore evidence to know we have been stitched up.More on the same theme from "Golem":http://golemxiv-credo.blogspot.com/
What’s the odd ‘scrounger’ on a few quid – and often even then they’ve not much in the way of alternatives in reality (not saying it’s right – just more understandable when you’re low on options)I remember, yonks ago now (80s I think), a little local tale about how these things work.There was a woman who cleaned for this bloke, a well off business man of some kind, earning a fairly miserly sum each week. It turned out she was claiming benefits and when it was discovered she was working (a couple of times a week), she was taken to court and jailed.Said rich bloke was, at about the same time, found to owe a massive amount in unpaid taxes. He hired a clever lawyer and managed to get off most of it - just ended up paying a derisory amount.That is how it worked then and how it works now.
James, Deano, Leni, Moonwave, Chekhov too....Waving back and saying hello ;-)Still recovering from a very long journey home train, bus, miles of walking, ferry, train, walking, black cab...dragging cases... still better than the plane, but just completely wasted!Need to catch up on more zzz's.... I'll be more compos mentis tomorrow.Nighty-night. xxxxxx
Hiya Sheff too.... and g'night!
G'night La Rit - sleep tight!
LeniHehe - Apologies. (It sort of worked anyway, I just helped it along..)Night LaRit!
@Monkeyfish:No problem -- I wouldn't live here either, if I didn't have to.@Deano:I thought I rescued your post from the spam folder, but I'm not seeing it. Sorry. @LaRit:Nice to see you back here -- glad you had a nice time!@Everyone:I've been battling the internet on two different browsers for almost 2 hours now, so I'm currently suffering netrage. Going to give up for awhile.Most of you will be going to bed soonish, so good night!
Cheers James Wow this Moore is something I was unfamilr withI see they have a couple of pieces of Henry Moore in Northampton!
Sheff last nights Boys from the Blackstuff dealt with just the point you make - except poor old Chalky, in trying to get away from the dole office spies, paid with his life ...whilst the bloke employing him on the black market .......well watch it on iPlayer BBC4 and see.
DeanoWe should have a day out at the Yorkshire Sculpture Park. They've got some wonderful Moores - plus a load of Hepworths and stacks of other stuff. Mungo would love it too.
deanoboys from the blackstuff was brilliant - and very moving.haven't seen it recntly - I remember Yosser- disintegrating - walking along followed by his confused children,
I'll do that Deano.
Also this, not entirely unconnected article in todays Indie has a massive hit response.http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/in-defence-of-the-older-man-2090300.htmlAnd another from the NYT in the same vein: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/20/business/economy/20older.html?scp=1&sq=unemployed%20over%2050&st=cseI sense a pattern emerging!
Another attempt to escape the spam bin....Top Tips for those dealing/struggling with an Incapacity Benefit Claim:(The following is the first of ten tips that have been sent to me in daily emails as part of marketing exercise promoting a professionally produced guide to claiming Incapacity Benefit. the guide is very good and costs £18.95 the top tips are free and worth sharing)"If you have to have a medical as part of your personal capability assessment (PCA) for incapacity benefit, it may seem like the doctor or nurse is just having a friendly chat with you. The truth, however, is that every question the doctor or nurse asks is being prompted by computer software called LIMA (Logic Integrated Medical Assessment) and very unfair assumptions are likely to be made based on the answers you give. For example, one of the questions you will be asked is whether you watch TV and what programmes you enjoy.If you say that you enjoy watching films, the doctor or nurse may well assume - without asking you any further questions - that you can sit comfortably for at least two hours without having to move from the chair. This means you will score zero points for problems with sitting.In fact, the law says the sitting test is based on how long you can sit on a very specific sort of chair: an upright chair with a back but no arms, like a dining chair or the sort of chair you might find in an office or at a supermarket checkout.And the truth may be that you can watch a film for two hours. But you probably don’t do so sitting on a dining chair. In fact, if you have back problems you may not sit at all, but lay on a sofa instead. And in that two hours you may get up and stand half a dozen times or even get up and walk around the room during the adverts, to relieve your back pain. But the doctor or nurse is paid on a piece rate for every medical they carry out. So they are very unlikely to take the time to ask you all the additional questions they would need to in order to build up an accurate picture of how long you can really sit on the correct type of chair.That being the case, it’s up to you to make sure you volunteer the information that they need rather than waiting to be asked. This applies whatever your condition: there are assumptions lurking behind every question.So, don’t make it easy for rushed health professionals to create inaccurate reports about you. Instead, use our guides to improve your chances of getting the correct decision about your incapacity for work by knowing the kinds of questions you’ll be asked and the assumptions that hide behind them. If you haven’t already seen free, sample excerpts from our guides, you can download them by clicking on, or copying and pasting, this link into your browser window and following the links on the page that opens:http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/content/incapacity-benefit/ib-claimsTomorrow: How your incapacity medical could cost you your DLA.Good luck,Steve DonnisonDon’t want to wait any longer to get access to all our guides, news items, forum and confidential DWP resources? Find out how to join from this link:www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/content/join-us "
SheffpixieI know someone who used to work at some local government office (not sure exactly), and he said it was always the wrong people who got prosecuted (as far as he was concerned) – that is, those who were had up for small amounts – because those who could afford it got a good lawyer and got away with it. Rarely do you see anyone of a good income paraded in the local press for their (often large)tax evasions being discovered. If anyone bothers to discover them at all, a quiet nod-nod-wink-wink arrangement is made. We’re not equally in this together, while the law is harsh for poor people and hardly exists at all for the rest – unless they do something really blatant, and even then… look at what the politicians were up to – splashed across the main papers too - and how many charges have their been? Their attitude was mostly that it was not good form to mention such matters – it shouldn’t apply to them. I feel really angry when I see those name-and-shame articles in our local paper – rarely someone I’d call a crook as such – usually some poor single mum trying to make ends meet – and a big point been made of how anyone taking money from the taxpayer can expect to be punished. We can only wish that that was true.
It was Cup weekend in the Halifax Ziggy's Spice House League, and Cup fever gripped fans from Mixenden to Stainland. Tie of the round was Elland United's 5-3 win over Northowram after extra time, while the biggest giant killing was non-League Copley United's 2-0 win over mid-table Brighouse OB. Now there's just the tension of the next round draw for the lucky winners.Full details, as ever, here.
@Sheff: haven't been to the Yorkshire sculpture for years. Well worth a day out there.BTW: what's happening with the plans for the bunfight in Northampton?I might have to make a contingency but e-mail me with the options and we'll take it from there.
Leni you can't get clearer than old Henry himself:"I could make a list of ten or twenty works which I know have been keyworks and which I know have solved some directions that I wanted to be satisfied with. Chronologically, it is first the figure I did in brown Hornton stone in 1929 influenced by the Mexican sculpture, particularly by the Chac-Mool figure"and it being in Leeds Art Gallery a place I used to call in ((when it was raining) when I was a kid in Leeds....well spotted.There are some other early works with a distinctive ancient South American feel too..Sad to see no Moores in Wales!Sheff - aint been to the Yorks Sculpture Park for a few years so a day out sounds good.
Moonwave"We’re not equally in this together, while the law is harsh for poor people and hardly exists at all for the rest – unless they do something really blatant, and even then… look at what the politicians were up to – splashed across the main papers too - and how many charges have their been?"Indeed, look at tonights panorama thing.Ashcroft's a crook, but the Lawyers got involved, so now he's not.Job done!!
moonwaveSome good posts from you today.Tip hat to you.The LAW has never been implemented fairly in this country with the working classes and the Black working classes in particular bearing the brunt of the abuses.The judiciary are after all largely made up of White public school bods who tend to look after their own or the 'upwardly mobile' who too often sell out to their roots and become grander than the grandees themselves.
Hi LaRitHope you had a good holoday.
"...nod-nod-wink-wink arrangement is made.."Too many journalists, judges/lawyers and senior public servants are.....................Freemasons.
@deano.....posed conspiracy grandpa....
Fuck it's spam binned me again ....my third attempt at the tips for incapacity claimants appeared then disappeared......
Peter - As I say to my two sons when they catch me out ranting on old themes....."smart arse!
ps - good to have news of the footy results. I was starting to wonder ....
Meanwhile, in other news, the Deputy Governor of the Bank of England, Charlie Bean-Counter, tells savers to clear out their accounts and blow the money on loose women and fast cars."I wouldn't want to call it [low interest rates meaning that savings produce almost no earnings] a side effect. I think it's important to realise that actually it's a key way that monetary policy affects the economy by affecting the incentive to save."What we're trying to do by our policy is encourage more spending, ideally we'd like to see that in the form of more business spending but part of the mechanism that might encourage that is having more household spending so in the short term we want to see households not saving more but spending more."Does that sound like desperation?Is he saying, "You are our last hope. If this fails, we are all totally fucked. Look, the only people with savings are old, so you may as well just withdraw it all and fritter it away on one last blast."You'll be dead soon anyway and you cannot take it with you. Forget about your children. They will be sold into slavery and there is nothing you can do.So, do you want to come to a party? Pick you up about eight-ish, OK?"Look on the bright side, everyone.After all, not everyone gets to live through the end of the world as they have known it.
Chekhov I see Copley United took the points from Sheffield United Res a while ago Super Copley
"The judiciary are after all largely made up of White public school bods who tend to look after their own or the 'upwardly mobile' who too often sell out to their roots and become grander than the grandees themselves."You are not wrong about that, Paul, just add Oxbridge educated politicians and journalists into the mix and "Bingo": job done!I should have known the writing was on the wall years ago (I was sent to board at a Public School in the 1970's)it's the pillocks who I went to school with who are running the country now!All of a sudden it all makes sense but perhaps too late!Sorry, everyone, it's all my fault. I should have worked it out much sooner!
For those wondering what happened in the Peace Musabi family reunion deportation case, which the Guardian made something of a song and dance about in July, the final verdict came through a couple of weeks ago (it just occurred to me to check). The story from the local paper is here.Oddly, there's nothing about the verdict in the Guardian, or on the website of Women Against Rape who were leading the campaign at the time.
chekhovSorry, everyone, it's all my fault. I should have worked it out much sooner! Well yeah it is all your fault but much to Hanks disgust i'm trying to be more tactful these days:-)
posed conspiracy grandpa.... @PeterJ: do we really need our own equivalent of "Guyius" on here?just 'aving a laugh Peter!
@Deano: you are quite right. The Freemasons have a lot to answer for but of course they won't!I'm not going to reveal what I know about the Freemasons on here(and it's very little) but if want to give me your e-mail address through Montana's security system I'd be willing to tell you a story!
Chekhov - You can tell me next time we get together..Goodnight all.
@Paul: nowt wrong with attempting to be more "tactful" just don't confuse it with the art of "Diplomacy" which is a totally different thing!
Dunno if there are any UT ers who like Diana Krall but i've just heard this cover of Cry Me a RiverEnjoyed it meself.btw Diana is married to a certain Elvis Costello.
chekhovDiplomacy tends to be used in the context of people conducting negotiations between states,people,companies etc.Tact on the other hand is more to do with not jumping into any situation with both size 9.s if you get my meaning.Not sure if any diplomats would fare to well on the rare occasions the shit hits the fan here.;-)
PaulThere are always various types of social discriminations going on, and making laws about it makes little difference, as they can always be explained away in other ways. Tribes prefer to stay together – so the ‘upper circles’ prefer not to be polluted by lesser ‘tribes’ - their ‘inferiors’ – although most of their ancestors got where they did by theft and violence – and many of those originated from the criminal fraternity of those brought in to make up the army of William the Conqueror.DeanoI live in southern England – in a large town with many deep social problems – low employment prospects – high numbers on benefits – many teenage mums and single-parent families (not saying anything against such) – many drug/alcohol/mental health problems – big sink estates… A regeneration which is just the outside big-players splitting up the cake for themselves, with a thorough contempt for the local yokels, who shouldn’t argue about what’s good for them. A local paper which is scarcely more than a mouth piece for the local authorities – you can see the corruption, but can’t pin it down, and no journalist is likely to be paid to try.Talking of the Freemasons - it is said that the local planning officer has a funny handshake. I wouldn’t know, but it could explain all the really awful development plans – profitable for outfits not local - which keep going through however great the intelligent protest against them. It’s not the case that every area below the old northern industrial towns knows nothing about real improvishment, but it is true that it’s a different scenario. Here the removal of the old industries did not decimate anything – we never had much industry going on in the first place.
@Paul: point taken and well put. Sorry for my clumsy obeservation!
chekhovDon't be silly i wasn't having a go.No apology needed .These online misunderstandings are gonna turn me into a paranoid wreck:-)
Observation even if I could learn how to type properly!
@Paul: I'm afraid "online misunderstandings" are going to increase and proliferate. I dearly hope I'm wrong but all the evidence doesn't make the case in my favour!
ChekhovTalking of tact and diplomacy i had to contact a woman recently whose surname was Fuchs.Trust me when i tell you that asking the receptionist to put me through to Mrs Fuchs had me sweating a bit.
@Paul: LOL reminds me of Francis Fuckuyama and "The End of History"
Moonwavei have at various times lived in villages outside both Crawley and Basinstoke - both with huge and sterile post war estates. They certainly have problems of disassciation from the main economy. They are different in character to the older industrial towns of the north but certainly have their problems.
Paul think the diplomatic service would either benefit from you full frontal attack approach or collapse - I can't quite decide which XX
ChekhovNice one ! I,m struggling to understand the latest population projections for the UK using this thing called the Bayesian Method where amongst other things they talk about 'Posterior Distributions'.WTF!To think that someone somewhere decided to call it that.I,m signing off now so i'll say goodnight.
MontanaOne more thing.I just wanted to thank you for your support on waddya yesterday.I saw your post before it got zapped.Was much appreciated x
LeniHello.I did see your message the other night (in the midst of what was becoming a Sat-night brawl) – thank you – and I have been trying to answer it this evening, but keep getting distracted. Yes, there have always been pockets within the south where the wealth of the south has never quite reached somehow. While we don’t have to be suffering from or in danger of a problem ourselves in order to feel concern for those who have those problems. What is wealth? As you say, having what we need, and some good society, and that which feeds our minds satisfactorily, and some of the wonderfulness of the natural world around us – or a park – gardens – a flower pot… There was once a time when I had much depression for various personal and economic reasons – and even if it was only for a few minutes a day I would focus on something that brought pleasure to the eye – a picture – a plant – sunlight shining on something – anything, and get lost in it; and I found that gradually that 'magic' grew and the depression decreased.The focus of those who make our economic decisions is so distorted because it treats everyone as economic units, and decides the success or failure of human beings in relation to their success as economic units. It then follows that to keep making/taking more makes you a better person, except that there comes a point past which the methods make you a worse person. Which is why so much of everything in our Alice-Kafka-land is so much of the wrong-ways-around – and taking from the less successful economic units to give to the more successful economic units to them makes good sense.
@Paul:My pleasure. I didn't really think it would change her mind (even if she managed to see it before it was zapped), but I thought it needed saying anyway.I figure it was my admonishment to her to remember that she's not the only person with old e-mails that got the post zapped -- possibly seen as some sort of threat? (Although her comment threatening to go public with old e-mails was allowed to stand...)The only other thing that I could see being out-of-order was my line to Gigolo that my only conclusion re: the Taff, Jock, Yank, etc. thing was that a lot of Londoners are apparently insensitive jackasses for not seeing those words as pejorative.