23 September 2010

23/09/10

Masjid Wazir Khan, Lahore, 1894
It is never too late to give up our prejudices.
-Henry David Thoreau

152 comments:

  1. Well, colour me embarrassed. I thought "It's better to burn out than fade away" came from this.

    Apologies to moonwave and Monkeyfish for the continued annoyance of the spam folder. A couple of their comments yesterday ended up there & I only found them a few minutes ago.

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  2. "" bettystanton 22 September 2010 11:00PM

    Excellent article - I agree with every word of it.

    Can I also just applaud Cif's moderation policy where comments referring to Mr Lilico's current employment and past history are deleted even though this information is in the public domain and easily accessible. This is not relevant to this article, and if it was, then obviously Cif would have given this information in Mr Lilico's author profile. Being a lobbyist and a member of a right-wing thinktank is not relevant! The guardian is definitely not being disgenuous! ""

    !

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  3. Apologies in advance for boring everyone but I am genuinely intrigued as to why the think tank affiliation of Andrew Lilico was deemed off limits on his thread.

    Here was the post I wrote yesterday before it was deleted. I’ve tried to remember it word for word and if there is anything which contravenes the talk policy please let me know and I will shut up:

    “Chief Economist of Policy Exchange think tank writes puff piece defending the interest of its donors from public scrutiny of extortionately high pay.

    Quelle surprise.

    Guardian- why does it make no mention of Dr Lilico’s Policy exchange role in his Guardian profile?”


    That was it.

    Habib’s subsequent posting mentioning the same thing was memory holed before he repeated the same thing again on a post which has been allowed to stay.

    Two things- as asked, did my post contravene the talk policy? I’m at a loss here. Secondly, if my post did not contravene talk policy, why was it moderated (as was Habib’s?). Why are they hiding the fact that Lilico is chief economist at a right wing think tank and the article for all intents and purposes was a staunch defence of the interests espoused by this think tank?

    My post on Waddya is still there as is habib’s second post. I wonder if Habib’s second post was allowed to stay because it was at the end of the thread.

    I’ve emailed the mods and await a reply, but why has the Graun been censoring this?

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  4. Your Grace - he himself linked to the BBC page about the programme referred to, which included his job at PolEx...wtf is up with them?

    (sorry, grumpy, another early working start)

    (peh)

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  5. Moonwave, Frog2 and Wybourne

    We all know that moderation in its execution has nothing to do with its stated guidelines and policies, which makes it the more hilarious when people, all the way from the Olympian perspective of Matt Seaton to the view from the discarded lolly-wrappers and popcorn under the cheap seats of kizbot, declare that if you do not break the rules, you will not be deleted.

    Nothing to hide, nothing to fear seems to ring a bell.

    It could be that The Guardian is having to (figuratively, of course) manoeuvre itself into the position of obsequious servant, chief-cook-and-bottle-washer for the lovely new ConDems. Perhaps it doesn't yet know whether to present the open mouth for fellating duties or the bare backside for buggery, but is simply squirming to get it right.

    After all, it performed so splendidly for New Labour, nobody needs to doubt its abilities to both pimp and prostitute itself.

    When, before the election, there was the nonsense put about that the LibDems could actually be in power on their own account, various pundits observed that there were no media channels open to Nick Clegg and his team. They had been ignored because they were unimportant.

    Perhaps CiF is just proving - under the new management team headed by Hanman (no change here, move along) - that it can prostrate itself into any moral gutter of the new regime's choosing.

    As for BettyStanton and the comment quoted above - isn't it ironic? Wasn't it a way of being able to make the point without being deleted?

    I don't know because I am useless with names, but seem to remember seeing another comment by the same poster which appeared ludicrous at first glance but revealed itself as a dig and a pop.

    I could be wrong. I have not even tried to look at the back catalogue.

    Don't ask me. What the fuck do I know?

    PS I did email Hanman about being banned as soon as I mentioned moderation on her first thread, but there was no reply.

    At least little Seaton was always good enough to respond, even if it was normally hysterical and paranoid and in the form of an ill-disguised tantrum.

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  6. @Atomboy:

    …I did email Hanman about being banned as soon as I mentioned moderation on her first thread, but there was no reply…”

    Natalie Hanman’s not exactly covering herself in glory from where I’m sitting, either. I’m engaged in a low-level email tussle with her and her minions at the minute, as it happens. Thing is, I can keep at it for fucking ever, I’m hoping she’ll just get so bored of the hassle she’ll eventually give in.

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  7. Swifty,

    what's the tussle about? Is it the 'M' word?

    dave, bettystanton is one of the good gals.

    Atomboy, this is what I'm so intrigued about. Why a post pointing out an article authors role was wiped. It could be piss poor moderation but I think it's something else.

    Philippa,

    I know, ludicrous isn't it?

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  8. Duke - it'll be interesting to hear if they explain themselves.

    Atomboy - yes, I interpreted Betty's post the same way.

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  9. @13th Duke:

    No, unrelated to moderation, I got them to delete the SwiftyBoy log in etc as I'm done with CiF, but they won't delete the profile and comments, citing some “you grant us in perpetuity…” crap about the licence. I know they can do it, I know they have done it in the past, so I’m just trying to get a statement from them beyond this “para 4, subsection 3 of the EULA” bollocks…

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  10. Swifty,

    why are you jacking it in? Bored with it or is it another issue?

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  11. Duke et al -- a tactic I've used meself ...hehe.

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  12. swifty -- they did it on request for stevehill and maybe for inactivity on the account for the late donge.

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  13. @13thDuke:

    Number of factors really, mate.

    @dave from france:

    Yeah, they’ve done it for quite a few people, dunno why they’re being so precious in this instance.

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  14. Wybourne

    I wonder whether it is as simple as assuming that making reference to someone's job, position whatever is the same as an ad hom.

    I would think that they are all very aware of the fact that they delete to ideological rules and that the pages are used by all and sundry for propaganda purposes.

    One day, they may want to carry an article by David Blunkett which states that everyone in receipt of any kind of benefit should have to be processed through A4E - go through this door to the salt-mine slave-labour camp or through this door to the death-camp.

    They could hardly allow people to point out that he stands to make a fortune from the process, could they? It would corrupt and cloud the message and CiF would cease to be an obedient propaganda platform.

    SwiftyBoy

    I would think they will try to stick to the "non-exclusive, in perpetuity" thing for the simple reason that they seem to be pinning their hopes on people providing free content both BTL and ATL.

    To them, it's like allowing people to ask for their money back and having to wonder whether there will be enough in the till in the event of a run.

    I do think that the rules under which we submit content to a commercial operation should be changed, though.

    We should be allowed to ask for it back or only allow them to publish it under, for example, Creative Commons licence terms, which are flexible enough to allow for the content supplier to impose extra clauses and conditions to the basic licence.

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  15. Hi, folks.

    thauma et al, I was reminded of old discussions here about women in LOTR when I came across this quirky piece recently -
    Christine O'Donnell
    I wonder if Eowyn and Arwen ever masturbated?

    PS I think atomboy got it right and bettystanton was being sarcastic and making the point without being deleted.

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  16. PPS swifty, they deleted my profile and archive without any problems (although it took a while). That was along time ago though.

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  17. Hello scherfig,

    hope you're well in Europe's second cycling country.

    Some depressing news and amusing news from cycling's first country.

    The "Roma debate" has started in earnest in the Netherlands just as the budget cuts are being implemented.

    De Telegraaf (trash newspaper) is reporting on a Roma family in Utrecht who have been housed in a listed building. They pay their utilities but the council pays their rent.

    Like media in the UK and elsewhere, this one story is magnified to portray the whole community as being thieving layabouts. Additionally, some mayors are calling for ethnic registration along the lines of Wilders demands on Muslims.

    You can kiss the famed Dutch tolerance goodbye.

    At the other end of the news spectrum, James Bond has been revealed to be a Dutchman. Fleming got his inspiration from a Peter Tazelaar, a Dutch resistance operative who worked with Fleming for MI6 and the SOE.

    Apparently the famous opening scene of Goldfinger was not a figment of Fleming's imagination but was inspired by an actual incident which Tazelaar undertook.

    He was dropped from a boat off the Dutch coast, swam in his wetsuit to Scheveningen beach, took off his wetsuit to reveal his tux and wandered into the nearest hotel to undertake spying work.

    Kudos or what?

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  18. Hiya Scherfig,

    Will have to check that out later!

    Éowyn probably did. Arwen probably didn't.

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  19. My comment is still there!?! They're taking the piss out of us now, Duke.

    Their last non-apology apology still makes me chuckle.

    "Usually users are kept under premoderation until the moderators are satisfied that their future comments will not break the community standards, but given your generally good posting record and the length of time it's taken me to get back to you I'm reinstating your posting rights now. Do try to stay on-topic in future."

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  20. @scherf:

    Go raibh maith agat mate, I remember your saying it took a while, not in a rush, just a point of principle really (I do have some, honest!). Trust all’s well with you and yours.

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  21. Morning Scherf, long time no see...

    So its off topic to point out when a writer is employed by an undisclosed think tank? They really are geniuses.

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  22. Those bigoted bastards at the UN Human Rights Council just don't understand that no one is supposed to criticise Israel.

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  23. brusselsexpat has posted the following on Whaddya:

    PaulBJ
    ______

    I will say this for the last time. I was disgusted by a number of the posters over there and I still am.

    I did not behave badly. I reacted to the disgraceful treatment I received after showing considerable generosity (and I have the emails to prove it incidentally). But of course women on there are not allowed to speak up for themselves. They are expected to grovel and put up with any amount of insults.

    Not me babe - not in a million years.


    Would any of you "grovelling" women care to comment there? :-)

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  24. Spike Sir.

    Who Sir ? Me Sir?

    no thankyou Sir . I'd be frightened Sir.

    Perhaps the men could march in and explain how we utteresses know our place and give due respect to all masculine opinions. We understand it enhances our feminity.

    We'd be ever so grateful Sir.

    What a cheek Bru has.

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  25. Aha, I see we have more "e-mails to prove it".

    Apart from that, I think Leni's covered it!

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  26. Continued...

    I quoted her and wrote:

    Heheh. I think they may have something to say about that. You do know that UT is the blog of a woman not particularly noted for her submissive nature, don't you?

    She replied:

    BTTP
    ______

    Oh please - revelling in victimhood does not a feminist make. And now I really wish to end what for me is an extremely boring saga. If only other people would let it die.

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  27. Yeah, that's why she's constantly stirring and trying to start a fight. Oh well, I fell for it again.

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  28. Afternoon all

    Briefly touching my forelock here - to the chaps of course - you girrrrls can stew!!. For those of you who are going to Bitters' knees up - don't expect me to repeat it. Draw the line at grovelling though.

    Brus extreme lack of self awareness is beyond parody - I am beginning to doubt she is a real person.

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  29. Thauma

    Meant to say MsC and I are coming down for Bitters do - Princess can't make it as she has something else on. Hope you're coming - we need to keep our end up amongst all these oppressive blokes.

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  30. Quiet there, missy, what do you think you're doing, coming on here and speaking for yourself?

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  31. Ah good! Yes, I'm planning on coming.

    Who else is in?

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  32. Little piece from the groan today.

    A WW2 vet aged 86 with cancer of the stomach, liver and lungs and given two months to live was denied NHS nursing care because he is "not ill enough>"

    How ill do you have to be ffs? An example of the way things are going..?

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  33. Chekhov's coming. BB said she'd try. It's about bloody time Habib turned up (lightweight that he is..:-)) Deano mentioned it I think. Don't know about anyone else.

    PBrax has said he's coming which should make for an interesting evening.

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  34. Oh. Suddenly I feel an illness coming on.

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  35. thauma....I'm depending on you...no whimping out... "We are women, we are strong" and all that.

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  36. I would be more than happy to attend, Sheff, but I fear that ripping Bracken's head off and pissing down his throat would put rather a dampener on proceedings.

    :-)

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  37. Afternoon all. I hear this is the place to come to if you have shirts that need ironing - any takers?

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  38. I'm sure PBrax, MF, Hank or His Grace would be more than happy to oblige Vizzo.

    Habib - make the effort - I guarantee you'll have a good time. And re PBrax's head...there's a queue and you're not first!

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  39. OK, if Habib promises to fulfil that, I will come.

    Ivo - I'm not very good at ironing but as long as you're wearing the shirt at the time I'll be happy to give it my best shot.

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  40. I'm not very good at ironing but as long as you're wearing the shirt at the time I'll be happy to give it my best shot.

    Will that be warm, hot, steam or dry Thauma?

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  41. Do irons have all those settings? Who knew?

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  42. @habib

    I fear that ripping Bracken's head off and pissing down his throat would put rather a dampener on proceedings

    Not for me it won't. Is that a promise? When's the next Eurostar?

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  43. Thauma - PBrax will know - he was in the army and soldiers are very good at that kind of thing so I'm told.

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  44. Whenever I get my cobweb-encrusted iron out, you know I'm either invited to a smart function where there'll be customers or due to appear in court.

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  45. True dat, Sheff. Bet he knows how to sew too.

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  46. You women on this site paint us poor oppressed men in a dim light. I iron one shirt a day for five working days !(don't wear a tie though), any more than that and I fall down crying like a... stuffed pig. (Didn't want to get on the bad side of Jen tonight)... Never found a female companion who would willingly do my ironing *sigh* and probably never will ! In fact never met anyone who enjoys ironing.

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  47. Evening

    Tip hat to you Thauma.Methinks you achieved more with your single word post to Sprouts than i did with my series of posts.Although i like to think i help set up that killer goal of yours.

    I can't be arsed with Kiz/Bru anymore.I actually offered them a conditional truce which they pointedly ignored.In the past they've suggested i've been brainwashed by the UT and am acting on behalf of you lot.Couldn't be further from the truth.Not a shred of self awareness between them.

    Anyways i've discovered today that if Bru ever again submits a post stating that some on CIF view her as being 'Mata Hari' i mustn't respond in jest by suggesting 'Hairy Mary' might be closer to the truth because that's misogynistic.So using that 'goal post' i assume women who jest about men with hairy backs must also be miscandric.All very confusing.

    Can i come to this pissup in October ?

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  48. Oh who am I kidding? I couldn't take the top off a Cornetto these days.

    Getting to Northampton - pfff! Getting out of bed requires an extraordinary leap of the imagination...

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  49. Got to say I was wrong about 'bettystanton'
    last night.
    When read in a sober state, it's quite obvious really !!

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  50. Hell of a thunder storm here -
    Mungo hiding under the bed!

    I can sew, iron and cook... and brew beer and make wine. I used to be able to darn socks but there's not much call for it these days. I never learned to knit though, but me dad could.

    I think LaRit said she hoped to make Bitters - she's away at the minute.

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  51. Paul

    Tip hat to you Thauma.Methinks you achieved more with your single word post to Sprouts than i did with my series of posts.Although i like to think i help set up that killer goal of yours.

    Nah. I just pointed out the own goal!

    Tascia - do stuffed pigs cry? ;-)

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  52. It was beauty of a thunderstorm here, too, Deano. I love that sound.

    I can iron, though, so Vizzo, shirts are £3:50, trousers £2:00 and you get a free pass to Wankersville if you want want your jeans, socks, or undies ironed.

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  53. Paul - the Northampton gig is just like UT open to all.

    I posted yesterday that I hoped South based UT's would make it. Swifty said he can't, not heard back from Jay or you till now.

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  54. Oh, and Paul - of course you can come! Hell, if Bracken's being allowed in....

    I think Jen said she might be able to come to Bitters' gig in Leam in November?

    Deano - ah, but will you do the ironing and darning for your beloved? Tell Mungo not to be scared, poor lad.

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  55. Depends with what they are being stuffed - I suppose. Damn now I've gone an offended the bloody Animal rights movement.

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  56. That ewe ain't smiling either, Tascia.

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  57. Or is she? It's so hard to tell with sheep.

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  58. Tascia - I seem to recall that you are Midlands based so if you fancy a jar or three at the South Mids UT get together in Northampton all are welcome. It's on Sat Oct 2nd - 3pm onwards

    Bitterweed will be posting details of the pub and cheap overnight accommodation for those who need it when he gets back from his tour.

    Sorry to read about your employment problems habib. Hope someting turns up soon our kid.

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  59. Oh -- She's smiling allright, couldn't get that bloody grin offa her chops for weeks. Kept telling all the others about the bike ride as well ! Ewes cueing up in the morning with a baleful look in their eye's.

    Never again.

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  60. Deano Would love to come and meet you all, but I have a date with a beautiful bitch that weekend. (I'm dog sitting !)

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  61. Never send a biker to do a ram's job....

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  62. Never get a ram to fix ur bike....

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  63. "...but will you do the ironing and darning for your beloved?.."

    yea if she's up for a game of doctors and nurses..

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  64. thauma

    Nah. I just pointed out the own goal!

    Well own goal or killer goal it achieved the desired TKO.:-)

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  65. ======> unattached women! <=======

    Deano is your man.

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  66. tascia - worry not I'm sure there will be other occasions in the future.

    Leni/A42 any chance you guys can make Northampton on the 2nd? - be good to see you before the snows cut the Principality off..

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  67. ... I presume you're fine with the nurse role, though, Deano?

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  68. tascia -- it's soon going to be the only way to get posts to stay up . Any mod who knew me would go on immediate alert if I started --

    " Mr Garton Ash has given us yet another extraordinarly concise but deeply profound analysis bla bla bla" ! ( hehe )

    but maybe they are using trainees or even interns ?

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  69. I bet that Leni and Annetan knew somebody who knew how to make rag rugs.... I did.

    Doctors and nurses on a home made rag rug with a jar or two of home-brew thrown in to ease the shyness ..........aye them were the days.

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  70. Frog - I don't expect the mods pull down a lot of cash. Although I think Bella is one of them.

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  71. Absolutely thaum I like to be examined by lady doctors.... almost as much as I like me books fetched from the stack by a lady librarian.

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  72. It took me a while to click on to the fact that Bella-the gaffers daughter-is the same as Isabella the mod.I,ve never had any problems with her myself although having a mod going ATL as well as BTL doesn't seem right somehow.

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  73. "Sorry to read about your employment problems habib."

    Deano, I have none of those - too much of a smart arse for any of that nonsense, just taking some time out to relax and not cease. :-)

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  74. habib

    Are you going to this pissup in October?

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  75. And for those who are unemployed, just take to crime - the powers that be do it.

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  76. Paul, I would love to, but I really can't.

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  77. "i like to think i help set up that killer goal of yours."

    Maybe, paulbj, but not so much Ryan Giggs as the crossbar.

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  78. Frog - Tis clever to reverse the psychology of thinking - especially along those lines. Far too much for me last night after a moderate amount of alcohol. *Ahmm*

    Right off down the pub for a pool match. Tough team to beat tonight in not very salubrious surroundings (away game).

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  79. Habib - best. x

    Tascia - good luck!

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  80. @deano

    What is this thing you earthlings call "shyness"? :-)

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  81. Scherfig - can't get your bloody link to work. Keep getting 'gateway timeout'.

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  82. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  83. @Paul

    Easy, tiger!

    You really ought to calm down a bit. If you want to take people on, it's much better to stay calm. When you lose your temper, it doesn't look good in print. I'm speaking from experience.

    For what it's worth, my hard-won advice to everyone is to wait a bit before posting when you're angry with someone and never post anything other than banter and music links when you're pissed.

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  84. Evening all

    I still dunno whether I will be able to make the Northampton booze-up or not, because I have a shitload of work on at the moment, and I also need to get up to Staffs to see my sister next month, but I am setting my sites on Leamington in November.

    Hey gillesboy - I haven't read back so I don't know what you have said to merit being told to fuck off, but nice of you to drop by anyway! :o)

    Deano - doctors and nurses, eh? Have you been watching Carry On Matron again? :p x

    And a special bisou to Scherf too xx

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  85. Paul, re-evaluate, if it suits you.

    "never post anything other than banter and music links when you're pissed."

    Ha ha ha ha ha

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  86. gillesboy

    Spike is absolutely right.I don't know what came over me so i,ve deleted my 19.20pm post .I profusely apologize for offending you earlier on CIF with the words 'Hairy Mary' and telling you to 'Fuck off' a few minutes ago here.Was uncalled for.Anyway welcome to the UT and i hope you have a lovely evening here.

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  87. Awww c'mon paulie I was just breakin your balls.

    Think I'll take spike's advice and offer you a nice tune great for annoying your neighbours

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  88. Hah!

    Best live version of Hocus Pocus, that! Love it. :o)

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  89. I dont think i'll be able to make it, Deano, got a lot on at the minute. Got my final OU exam coming up (just submitted my final essay, which was nice).

    Ironing - i dont even remember the last time i ironed a shirt. I dont think they need ironing, to be honest, seems a waste of time.

    Hello Gillesboy. If you were to choose the song for BiBuBiBu's first show as a dance troupe, what would it be?

    Just to hold in your head for a moment the image of them, I would have outfits like this:


    And then have them dancing to this song:

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  90. habib

    This my friend is my favourite HENDRIX track.Did enjoy yours though.

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  91. BB - nice to see you in N'hampton too, but make sure you make it to Leam!

    Gillesboy - didn't understand your earlier post (not being a footie fan) so glad you've cleared that up. Do you know that Focus are touring this year?

    Your use of 'Paulie', though, unfortunately reminds me of this.

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  92. In fact if you put the first one on mute, use the sound from the second on a different tab, you can get quite a good feel for how the performance would look.

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  93. Nah, Jay. They would be wearing these.

    And dancing along to http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xhvj1_grace-jones-i-need-a-man_music

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  94. Ruined the bleedin joke now....

    *sulks*

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  95. Not a bad combo, BB, not bad at all. But you've linked from somewhere that *isnt* youtube. I dont even know if thats legal. Its certainly not decent.

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  96. Now you're just being googlist, Jay.

    I won't stand for it!

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  97. "This my friend is my favourite HENDRIX track.Did enjoy yours though."

    Red House, every time.

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  98. It is beautifulburnout isn't it? I'm going to look for 'Sylvia next.

    "Hello Gillesboy. If you were to choose the song for BiBuBiBu's first show as a dance troupe, what would it be?"

    Ah Jay, it could only be this Maybe you could get your UT groupies to have a go too;0))

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  99. You objectifying beast, Gilles...

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  100. Jay

    Ironing - i dont even remember the last time i ironed a shirt. I dont think they need ironing, to be honest, seems a waste of time.

    Exactly my point of view. In my experience, ironing doesn't make them look any less wrinkly, but it does add water spots.

    You are a fookin wuss, though, for not attending any of the meet-ups. If you *really* (rolls eyes) can't make Oct, what about 7th Nov?

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  101. Possibly Nov, yeah, but not October, thats about ten days before my final exam for my degree, Turgle, cant be swanning off around the country with you reprobates can i...

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  102. I'm a crap impressionist thaumaturge. That's what I was supposed to be doing.

    Ryan Giggs has the record for what we used to call 'goal passes' but which are now called 'assists'.

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  103. Something to do with shirts, Shaz, i checked Wiki but left me none the wiser.

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  104. Jay - if you'd been keeping up with your studies properly all year, a mere exam oughtn't to phase you.

    gillesboy - in rugby, there are 'suicide passes'. Do you have those in footie too?

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  105. Nah, I'm guessing not as you don't have 20+-stone forwards about to pound someone into the ground....

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  106. BB

    Like 'Wind Cries Mary' and ANGELwhich IMO is one of his more underated tracks.

    Jay

    I thought being wrecked was a prerequisite of sitting exams.Although in my case that was down to cramming all my revision last minute in all night sessions.Probably not the best way come to think about it.

    gillesboy

    So you're a football fan.Who's your team?

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  107. When I played, the team considered any pass to me suicidal. Strictly sofa...

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  108. Brilliant top tip in this month's Viz:

    Homeopaths. Save money on petrol by filling up at the water pump. Your car will remember the petrol from your previous fill.

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  109. Had a conversation recently with a woman who used to play rugby - a very petite woman. She'd played it at school and went on to play for a year or two at Oxbridge (!) until she noticed that a good number of her teammates were missing a few teeth, etc.

    She decided to give it up and go back to playing hockey.

    Now, I've played hockey and I'm not sure there is actually a more vicious sport. Rugby was a piece of piss as it was girls against boys (I *am* going back to primary school here) and the boys were afraid to tackle the girls. The girls had no such compunction.

    Hockey, though ... fucking brutal. Not for the faint-hearted.

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  110. West Ham and Real Madrid paul. You?

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  111. Hockey is indeed a vicious sport, im pretty sure lost teeth cant be that rare.

    "Homeopaths. Save money on petrol by filling up at the water pump. Your car will remember the petrol from your previous fill."

    Brilliant.

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  112. "Paulie" reminds me of this. (I couldn't find the actual film scene so this is a video game extract)

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  113. gillesboy

    I support Spurs.And a frustrating experience it can be as well.On paper it doesn't look like we're doing too badly at this early stage of the season but a couple of our games so far don't exactly fill me with confidence for the long term.And as for our defeat in the cup against Arsenal the less said about that the better.

    Of course it could be worse.West Ham eh ?:-)

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  114. Can't stay long -- got to work at the school carnival for awhile. I would like to say that the Bitch from Brussels might do well to remember that she's not the only person with old e-mails.

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  115. Montana

    Have tried to call a truce with Bru/Kiz so as to prevent further spats on waddya but seems like they get off on this idea that everyone on UT has a vendetta against them,we're all guilty by association and that those like me who very occasionally challenge them have obviously been brainwashed heere.It probably bugs me more than it should do so i'm going try and view them as non-persons from now on.I know we've had our differences but FWIW i do agree with you on this one.

    Anyways i hope all's well with you.

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  116. Spurs!? You're one of these teams that wanders in and buys our players these days. Still haven't forgiven you for Frédéric Kanouté.

    Anyway, bygones etcetera... here's a song a student made me listen to and which has now completely captivated me

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  117. They're talking about Ralph Milliband on Newsnight. It's like the Portillos. How do thoroughly decent parents manage to raise little shits like that? Rebellion against integrity, honesty and humanity, I suppose.

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  118. gillesboy

    Likewise.Cheers for the link.

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  119. Jeez it's a ghost town here.

    Heres a track from the great Stevie Wonder

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  120. Hello Paul

    Ghost town indeed - perhaps everyone is busy .

    Cif is more tedious than ever - we will have to suffer the minutiae of NuLab conference next week followed by the triumphalist braying of the tories. Oh - the empty joys of politics.

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  121. What's with the "Error 503 Service unavailable"?

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  122. No bloody wonder it's like a ghost town on here if everyone had the same crap trying to post that I have tonight!

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  123. Anyone still around? other wise I'll hit the sack

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  124. Hi Leni /chekhov

    Had a bust up on waddya today.Was given some sound advice from Hermione which replicates what people here have said.But for a number of different reasons Kiz and Bru really do piss me off and whilst it may sound petty on my part i deeply resent the fact the mods allow them to get away with so much.Tried to sort it out with them but they don't wanna know.They both obviously get off on their self- perceived 'victim' status.Anyway in the overall scheme of things they are an irrelevence so i really do need to learn to ignore them.Not easy with my temperament.Especially when they make highly offensive false allegations but from now on i'm gonna get the mods to deal with that.btw my partner is getting seriously pissed off with me.She can't understand why i bother with people who wind me up and it's a fair point.

    Here's a tune from Roy
    Ayres

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  125. Paul

    Let it go - you won't change them.

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  126. Leni/chekhov

    Did either of you see QT earlier?John Redwood was on and the same obnoxious twat he always was.Still have trouble believing we have this ConDem coalition in government at the moment.Vince Cable was on too.Reminds me of Toad of Toad Hall.

    Here's a track fromjamiroquai

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  127. Hi chekhov

    Paul
    Didn't watch QT - couldn't face Redwood. He is one of several politicians I find rather worrying - something missing there. Some vital part that we consider necessary for us to be human. It's more than a moral vacuity.

    Does Mrs Paul have to listen to you raving about Bru or is it your chewing at the table leg that upsets her ? x

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  128. Leni

    You're dead right .I have this deep rooted and possibly too idealistic sense of wanting fair play and justice and end up focusing that on stuff which let's face it is trivial in the overall scheme of things.I think its the unfairness of the mods that pisses me off most of all. They must be aware of what the 'Sisters Grimm' get up too but do nothing about it.But when was life ever fair?

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  129. @Paul: sometimes it's just better to walk away. I appreciate you have a grievance but just let it go....Bru and Kiz aren't worth bothering about.
    I don't like to get involved in other people's spats but you are wasting your time and energy with them.
    Besides most of the people who are interested know all about the history so you are preaching to the converted!
    I gave up on Cif years ago and you know fine well why I don't post and that site anymore.
    If you want to keep posting on Cif, by all means do and your campaign to raise awareness of the ATOS issue was admirable but don't let Bru and Kiz wind you up even if you have a case for them slandering you. I don't expect that most people noticed!

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  130. Leni

    Does Mrs Paul have to listen to you raving about Bru or is it your chewing at the table leg that upsets her ? x

    LOL ! Probably a bit of both!We don't have much of a social life at present having to work long hours.As a result my front nashers have badly mashed up the furniture so you can understand why she's not happy.

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  131. Btw Paul, are you going to the "bunfight" in Northampton?

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  132. @chekhov

    Cheers for that.Sorry i'm going on about it.Are you still working nights?

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  133. @chekhov

    I'd really like too for selfish reasons as much as genuinely wanting to meet people here.Don't like the idea of people here thinking i'm a total nutjob so hopefully when i get to actually meet people it will put that one right.Not sure i'm gonna be able to make the one on 2 Oct as it's a bit short notice.I thought it was the 22 Oct for some reason.

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  134. paul

    I find it best - when trying to impress - to leave the straight jacket and 6'4" attendant at home.

    I won't be able to go go I'm afraid. I hope you all have a good time and report back.

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  135. Leni

    No worries there.I'll be heavily sedated when i do eventually meet people here and i'll have an oxygen tank attached to me back just in case i start hyperventilating.:-)

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  136. Leni/Chekhov

    I've got to sign off now.

    Nite x

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  137. I think the UTers and others did a useful job in getting some subjects pushed forward on Cif. That's a small something .

    The feud is a waste of time :)

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  138. @Paul: I met up with some fellow bloggers from both UT and Cif in Sheffield earlier this year and it was a blast! Great people and a lot of fun. It was an industrial strength piss up and the hospitality was second to none!
    I'd notch it up as one of high lights of my life!

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  139. hi frog

    are you ok? I was wondering where you were.

    yes the Great Feud - complete waste of time - feeds peoples egos .

    we are to get at least a series on personal experiences of the cuts - it will be interesting to note any change in support for victims over the next few months. I suspect many ciffers will either become unemployed themselves or know others who will lose their jobs. How soon before the overall tone of posts start to change ?

    Were Cif to use this sensibly theu could create an interesting social document - giving them material for editorials etc. this will not be a soon over period - the results and offspins will linger for a long time.

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  140. We are beginning to see effects here of the down turn - Barrats are building some new houses near Swansea- they had agreement with council to build 20 starterhomes on the estate - described as 'affordable' - they are now asking to renegotiate the contract and build fewer.

    Again - those on lower wages will suffer.

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  141. Leni

    yes the Great Feud - complete waste of time - feeds peoples egos .

    Quick visit.Hope you weren't implying my spat with Kiz/Bru was an ego trip on my part.:-)

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  142. Paul

    stop being so tetchy ! No I wasn't. x

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  143. I have just noticed the mods on CIF have deleted my attempts to sort things out with 'Sprouts' and her sidekick but have left 'Sprouts' responses standing.I wasn't breaking any rules but yet again the mods appear to be allowing their personal preferences to over-ride what should be their professional impartiality.

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