14 February 2010


Two thousand Jews were burned to death or otherwise forcibly removed from Strasbourg in 1349.  Thomas Cranmer was declared a heretic in 1556.  Five members of Bugs Moran's Northside mob and two other men were killed by members of Al Capone's Southside gang in 1929 in Chicago, a city which, contrary to what 1970s pop group Paper Lace might think, does not have an east side.  The Bank of England was nationalised in 1946.  Australian currency was decimalised in 1966.

Born today:  Frederick Douglass (1818-1895), BoomBoom Geoffrion (1931-2006), Kevin Keegan (1951) and Simon Pegg (1970).

Today is the Lunar New Year and the first day of the Year of the Tiger.  Happy New Year, everyone.

(You didn't really think I was going to say anything about that other thing that is happening today, did you?)


  1. Thanks for a great day, yesterday. Philippa, the cake was lovely. Excellent choonage and no bottles were broken over any heads.

    You're all just swell.

  2. Well..that was good..hope nobody got upset or offended..except RexMundi who can, as ever, fuck right off..miserable, backstabbing, sniping shitehawk that he is.

  3. Happy day to lovers everywhere - past, present and future. May (y)our tiffs be tiny and (y)our shags superb.

    Great fun yesterday Montana glad you enjoyed it. What is it with you mid western ladies and men with perms(KK)?

    MF - hope the job thing going as you would wish.

  4. Happy day. My contribution is this http://womanofexperience.blogspot.com/2008/02/fg-vs-dy.html

    @Monkeyfish re buying papers. I don't. As a writer I have no need to do crosswords either so no need for paper.

  5. MsR - I linked to your blog when you first came on here.

    You've been at it for a long time (2007) and I haven't yet read all your work but what I have, I have much enjoyed.

    Long may your syntax run smoothly.

    I have to ask, before anyone else does, in that delightful picture of you, is that a Tuffnel's Caramel Wafer in your mouth? ;-)

    I hope that today you will have pleasant and pleasing encounter.

    My best wishes and wicked thoughts are with you.

  6. @deano30 2007 and 2008 were vintage years..I even got a bit famous...

    It is a shortbread in my mouth.

    Thank you kind sir for your wishes.

  7. morning all!

    Some (relatively)gentle music for you in case you are feeling fragile!

    Good party yesterday Montana! Haven't been up so late for years!

  8. Mrs R

    Well I might nip out and pick up an Observer later(when I fetch Mrs Fish her card..just hope she doesn't wake up before I return and I can convince her I remembered for once)..it is still just about worth a read although I get the feeling the Guardian is determined to drag it down to its own level. Btw..would you take advice on friendship from Tanya Gold?..or 'the langiage of love' from Alain de Botton?..hope not

    Anyway..as its Valentine's day..

  9. Morning all,

    happy valentine's day all you cupids and cupidesses.

    ***Message for BB*** ***Message for BB***

    Don't stress yourself out on the Cohen thread. You've done everything you possibly can over about 5 threads.

    Let the fuckwits crow all they want, they don't want to understand and wouldn't know law, morals or humanity if it slapped them in the face wearing a George Bush mask.

  10. love this one

    who could it be?

    Two links to Ms Day in under 12 hours..what's wrong with me?

  11. Sheff - love the film you posted to yesterday!

    MsR - bang on blogpost
    "By 3pm, nothing else has arrived, including Ms R's photocopying."
    My ofice would suffer from similar when it was summer / Christmas party day and everyone who knew how the billing system worked was in the toilets doing their makeup...

    I suggested that some of the rest of us could learn how the billing system worked, but aparently that constituted communism or something.

    Anyway - happy VD all!

  12. G'day everyone. Classic UT party, eh?

    Happy VD, Philippa? No thanks!

    BB - Catherine's right, have a day off.

  13. Morning all

    I'm impressed...our first birthday party - lots of good tunes, a wee smattering of philosophy, booze, cake and no blood on the carpet.

    Here's something to soothe those hangovers

  14. WTF?? Who the hell is ´´Catherine´´ that´s my post!!

    posed the befuddled Duke.

    Anyone know why on earth my last post is ´´Catherine´´? I don´t even know a Catherine. I hope the wife doesn´t see it!!


  15. "Anyone know why on earth my last post is ´´Catherine´´?"

    Dunno...but you can't be in touch with your feminine side if you don't even know its name. Allow me to introduce you: 13th Duke...meet Catherine..your sensitive, inclusive, healing, handbag-loving side.

    Maybe you'll be able to multi-task from now on?

    My feminine side's called Sabrina...she's a right old slapper.

  16. My feminine side's called Daisy. Total cow.

  17. Mr F - "it's side"?...at least credit His Graces feminine side with the correct gender. My masculine side has an orange pick up with a gun rack on the back but I don't usually introduce him to people I'm fond of. He'd probably get on really well with Sabrina though.

  18. This comment has been removed by the author.

  19. Just back from walking the dogs before the rain, she do, falleth gently on my head.

    Nice choice of music Anne & Sheff - both favourites of mine.

    Chin my dear you too must have a day off - you health workers carry your concerns home at the weekends. I hope they are paying you extra. Mind you what do I know about sexually transmitted matters. I thought you couldn't get pregnant by holding bare hands, or by having sex with your eyes open. Three kids later I really must buy some gloves.

    MsB shortbread you say. Truth is I thought as much, but I couldn't resist finding out if you were still with teeth. And I wanted you admirers to be aware of the fact too. That is not to say that dentures are an impediment to future happiness they are most certainly not. These days ladies come along with all sorts of extra's. BB even wears perfume :-) x.

    Well some of the readers here will be pleased to read that I have nearly exhausted my new monthly 3Gb internet allowance already, and thus will have to ration my ramblings for the rest of the month

  20. I got in touch with my feminine side...

    Fucked her...

    Gung Hay Fat Choy!

  21. ....Gently on my head and my new, now non dripping, completely watertight roof.

    deano a soul of many skills is now an accomplished roofer.....roll on drums!!!!!..........\0/

  22. Sheff/Chin/Annetan, and the rest of the crew - stand easy ladies.....I didn't win the Euro lottery again this week so the filming of Frederick Furnivall will have to be delayed TFN.

    Just as well really it will give me time to buy some gloves.

  23. MsR I'm sorry about my inability to distinguish between a "R" and a "B" above. I have a blind spot when it comes to ladies names.

  24. Worked it out.

    I went for breakfast with the Duchess this morning in a fancy dan cafe with pc's and internet access. I had a quick squiff on the net.

    When I posted a comment it was with the previous persons log in who had obviously not logged out properly.

    Feel free to call me 'Duchess' all day as punishment.....

  25. Olay f'tang f'tang Biscuit-Barrel Paisley Trossachs Wybourne.

    Just signs Catherine...

  26. Hello all. Just want to say to all the untrustees and especially Montana that I am sorry for missing the party.

    Fully intended on joining the fun and games late afternoon but we had a family emergency. The father in law was rushed into hospital so we went up to North Yorks - he had a really fast heart rythm. But he is fine now - they gave him some injection and it helped bring it under control. Which is good because if that didn't work they were going to have to shock him - yikes. We didn't get back till very late though.

    So happy belated birthday to the untrusted. And a big thanks to Montana for the effort put in hosting this place. I am off now to read what I missed out on (sob).

  27. princess - yikes indeed. glad to hear he's OK - and hope you're recovering from the shock.

  28. Duke/Catherine/Duchess - that wouldn't be a punishment and you know it.

    Merely an excuse and an encouragement to visit a lingerie shop and buy yourself some expensive undergarments...but if you insist at least you can now do it online..

    a cut above bhs and m&s

    you bloody aristocrats any excuse - enjoy.

    ping there goes my warning bell, almost all my 3Gb now gone. See you all later.......

  29. Deano

    bit too classy for my masculine alter ego...although he might not think so.

  30. @monkeyfish Not so sure about Observer..oh for the days when they could pay the likes of Ed Vuilliamy to do proper investigation. I always felt that was what a Sunday paper was for.

    BB: Stunning work on torture thread. And as one person- far less technical than you said - "What does it say about us?"

  31. Thanks Philippa - I am fine. Bit tired but okay. Seems I missed a roaring party though - as is fitting. I hope you were all very, very drunk!

    Monkeyfish - hope you got the card in time. I have done the forgetting this year. I meant to get one yesterday and then with all the stuff that went on I didn't. so I forgot and now I might have to make one - except I am not 'crafty' at all and it will look like a dogs dinner. Ooh thats an idea I might make one from the dogs. Their paws are not as agile as hands and therefore could be a legitimate reason why it looks like a pile of crap.

    I really hope the Prince hsan't got any flowers or some such or I will feel even worse. Although on past performance that is unlikely. We are a most unromantic couple in that sense. We always forget our own wedding anniversary!

  32. @deano30 Minarets. I think you need Minarets.

  33. Princess - sorry about your dad! Glad he's OK.

    I had something like that on my last birthday! but normal rythm was restored (albeit still too fast) by the time I reached hospital. They just did loads of tests and kept me there until my heart rate had fallen to normal (which in my case is about 65 beats/minute)

    Do they know why it happened in your father's case?

    Apparently it can 'just happen' to people with my condition (dilated cardiomyopathy). They don't know why.

    Its is scary but my daughter says its not often dangerous (she is a nurse on a cardiology ward).

  34. Monkeyfish, if I say nothing then I will have said nothing. I am actually very chary of representation and try and avoid it when I can. I do not think that because Bea Campbell has gone green that CO2 alters its physical property, as some do, or so I suspect.

    I am not bothered by a combative milieu but do not see it as some carte blanche for bullying.

    What is the UT? The set of posts, of posters, of lurkers, the motives and actions that caused the letters to form on PC screens? The deleted posts that were never sent?

    Hank accused HeyHabib of re-writing history (but history is always ever only written it is reality that just is duh) yet he deletes his own posts on occasion. He only condemns his own small hypocrisy.

    Bitterweed, sorry to hear that Cif / the G won't relent.

  35. "carte blanche for bullying"

    of whom, by whom, when?

  36. Pen

    I don't see we really even have an argument here. It really boils down to one phrase in one of your posts which led me to suspect you had no truck with objective reality and you might have something of a relativist bent. You put me straight on that.

    Do you think I was overly aggressive in the way I expressed myself when questioning you? I've just looked back and I genuinely don't detect any aggressive, combativeness or 'bullying'.

  37. Is it rewriting history to delete your own posts, pen? Surely that's just creating a new reality.

    Anyway, fuck it, it's wholly in keeping with the spirit of the UT that there should be some verbal fisticuffs. And given that the anniversary represents a time for looking back on what's happened on here over the past year, it would be dishonest to pretend that there have been no fallouts.

  38. Monkeyfish, it's cool. The UT needs debate and I am not like some ATLer descending duchess-like (sorry Duke) downstairs to, not so much rub shoulders as that would be too much contact, as grace the hoi poloi with my fragrant presence.

    As I said I am not a relativist schmook (but maybe I misquote myself :)).

    I thought Hank was boorish, he took a lot of words just to say he doesn't like some people. HeyHabib was just hanging out why start? Sure I may have missed something and it is not for me to police others' communications and it's no biggy on the cosmic scale.

    I didn't think you were being overly aggressive, I've been responding haven't I? Wasting my life / time :). You've engaged in discussion, I think that's good.

  39. Hi Anne - it was my father in law. He has a lot of heart issues as he had a bypass some time ago. He also has high blood pressure and cholestorol and is on lots of drugs for that. I don't know exactly what caused it - they said it was beating too fast but they had him in a couple of weeks ago and did a test where they put dye into his veins and checked out his arteries - so don't know if it is that that caused it. Unluckily for him his issue is on the other side so they are going to have to repeat the dye procedure. I should really know more about it but it is quite complicated. He seems absolutely fine now though.

    They told him it wasn't that dangerous too as your daughter says. A nurse said that some people such as people with certain forms of diabetes can have periods of days where their heart beats too fast. They said that most hearts can beat faster for quite a long period of time without harm. But obviously they are cautious and so try to bring it back down.

    I am sorry you had it - it must have been scary - and on your birthday. I remember you posting about it actually. I once had an episode of trachycardia - I was on a run and in the middle of a field in the middle of nowhere - it came on out of the blue and my heart was going bonkers. It was racing - my heart rate monitor showed it was up to 220 beats per min and I couldnt get my breath. In the end I called an ambulance on my mobile. By the time it got there it was fine! The doc sent me for an ecg but that was fine and they said was just an episode of fast heart rate and it can be quite common in women in their thirties and forties. Scared me to bits though at the time!

    What does your condition mean if you dont mind me asking?

  40. Hi Hank,

    Yeah (sorry if we cross posts again). Deleting posts is like editing Trotsky out of a photo. It changes the current state of reality but it does not change that of past states.

    But editing is always revision. I'm not trying to damn you Hank. I can be argumentative and abusive too. And I have also defended righteous anger as a virtue at times.

    Sure there's always conflict wherever there is cooperation. It's the tension between the two that drives the dynamic.

  41. "Sure I may have missed something..."

    Given the infrequency of your visits here, I'd say there's every chance.

  42. Hank, we all miss stuff.

    Who 'owns' this? Don't get all possessive. Over what?

    Does some moral quality attach to n of visits?

  43. I'm not getting possessive, I'm simply pointing out that you're unlikely to be aware of the complex relations between certain of the regulars and ex-regulars if you only read this forum from time to time.

    As for your previous post, I don't disagree with your view of me, but I'm not going to apologise for being argumentative. If Habib feels bullied, I'm sure he'll say so. FWIW, I don't think I attacked him personally, I challenged his version of events. And, just for the record, I like the guy.

  44. Hank,

    I too am sure that HeyHabib can take care of himself.

    How do you know when I read, surely you are more likely to be aware of when I post. You project your own informational state onto reality.

    One can debate versions til the cows come home.

    Hank, I don't think it is a biggy and doubt HH does either.

    I commented because I had been part of yesterday's thread and thus knew the immediate history at least. The substance of it is of course a factor in how and what I do/did re posting. Some posts are more likely to encourage me to post more, others less.

    I'm not seeking to silence you, Hank, nor to say sorry.

  45. Just watched Gomorra about the Camorra in Naples. Great film but the reality it describes is very sad and depressing.

  46. Still to see it Sheff - probably wait till it's on telly, no point in paying to be depressed when you can get in that state for nowt.

    Norman Lewis is one of my favourite writers - his Naples 44 is too bleak for me to read again though. Lewis was one the first people to write about how American Intelligence put the Mafia (or Mafias) back into place in Naples and Sicily. Meanwhile American gunners were shooting down Spitfires trying to land. Not their fault, their officers didn't think it worth informing their troops the British were Allies - a hellish and prophetic book.

  47. Edwin

    I'll look that Norman Lewis book out - but think I'll have to gird my loins to read it...

  48. Evenin all

    Just had a fab new year's lunch at me dad's. His partner is from th philippines and put on a fantastic spread. All bloated and half tipsy now.

    Happy Year of the Tiger to you all.

  49. An icon from my childhood has died today. We used to watch an early evening news programme, 'Tonight', fronted by Cliff Michelmore, where he'd sing a calypso he'd devised from topics covered on the day.

    He was the most beautiful man I'd ever seen in my 12 year old life.

    RIP Cy Grant

  50. BB - having recovered from my hangover, have just read through the Cohen thread. Well done, dear, in the face of...erm...i can't even come up with a suitable analogy. But I quite understand how you got to this point:
    "Please try and understand this before one of us dies"
    Which was definitely my first laugh of the column. They're still going, though, although SongRemains nailed it for me (woolly lib rather than lawyer!) with
    "It is about us.
    What kind of people we want to be."

  51. Ah sheff, Cy Grant, there's a great spirit gone.

  52. Princesscc
    Dilated cardiomyopathy is a condition where the heart becomes infected (by a virus eg flu). In most people the heart recovers (you just experience a bad bout of flu). But In my case because of a gene I inherited from my father the heart has remained damaged and has enlarged in an attempt to make up for the damage. The walls of the heart have become thin and a bit floppy and I have to take shedloads of pills to help it beat properly.

    Was diagnosed 3 years ago and have only had one incident. Usually am Ok but tend to get tired and then I need to sleep a lot.

  53. Philippa

    It's just the way people keep saying "well, we haven't seen any evidence that he was tortured" like they are expecting polaroids of his gonads or something.

    Maybe he got his bits out in front of Judge Kessler...

  54. BB, Philippa

    but funnily enough the same said posters were probably happy to believe there was WMD without any evidence...

  55. Fair point, habib, but Bob Hope?!

  56. Yeh, Hank, he was a bit of a right wing git, now I come to think of it. Alright, I'll have no Hope.

  57. Agree with you, BB, about exarmy's post on the Cohen thread. I'm pretty sure he was poster of the year 3 or so years back. Not as prolific as he used to be but always talks a lot of sense.

    As for Cohen, he's been a very confused bunny since it kicked off in Iraq. Brilliant on PFI but he painted himself into a corner on the war on terror and, in his ongoing mission to justify the unjustifiable, he has had to compromise his ideals.

    Nothing's more fatal for a writer than having to push a confused and compromised message which lacks all conviction.

  58. 'Alright, I'll have no Hope.'


  59. exArmy may not be able to write flowery prose, Hank, but he sure as hell knows how to make a point.

    This is the second week in a row Cohen has badly pissed me off, although frankly he does more often than not now. There are still times when he writes something coherent that I can support. But those days are few and far between now.

  60. Just read the Cohen thread and it's a good example of why I am staying away from cif these days, apart from a few relatively painless forays. BB, exarmy and one or two others spell it out but the drones still can't or won't listen. I really can't be arsed to talk to people like that anymore - or read Cohen. What isthe point?

    Still, i admire those who have the tenacity

  61. I do wonder about Cohen and the 'War on Terror'. Does he believe what he's writing or as Hank says is he trying desperately to stay on message to save face?

    He was one of the first to nail the New Labour project for what it was, but like the Observer itself, has been compromised completely by support for the war.

    What is revealing about Cohen is that he has frequently mentioned that his two greatest heroes are Orwell and Camus.

    I think his sudden conversion to the neo-con lobby along with his 'What's left?' polemic is in his mind, a continuation of the iconoclasm of Orwell and Camus in the face of their left wing contemporaries.

    He is trying to create a parallel between his actions against the contemporary left, Orwell's Anti Stalinism (and acting as an anti communist intelligence informant) and Camus' break with Sartre and subsequent denunciation of Communism.

    He's utterly deluded of course but from what I have read of him I think there is more than a grain of truth to this.

    Anyway, signing off, sweet dreams y'all.

  62. Hank, you've kept a hope alive. Thank you.

    Gotta catch the bus and go to work. Love you, Hank, as much as you may not believe it.

  63. That's a really interesting point, Duke. Camus fell out with Sartre of course because of Algeria, but Camus was hopelessly compromised by his status as a pied noir himself. My understanding was that he was conflicted about the Algerian War and that, in other circs, he would have supported the independence movement. He let his heart rule his head, and couldn't ever reconcile his position on that war with his ruling moral philosophy.

    I don't think he was necessarily iconoclastic so much as hopelessly compromised, and that seems in keeping with Cohen himself.

    It's simpler with Orwell, I think, in that he was a principled leftist and remained so until his death, but his experiences in Spain convinced him that the Soviet Union was just another hegemonic power which sacrificed principles on the altar of realpolitik. Animal Farm and 1984 are, for me, about the fact that the last people we should cede power to are people who love power.

    The above two books, along with Homage to Catalonia, should be on the national curriculum, and every MP should be compelled to read them every year.

  64. Evening all, have just caught up on today's thread but not yesterday's yet. It appears I may have missed some interesting conversations which I probably won't be able to read until tomorrow at least.

    Got rid of the Evil One (mother) and two other guests just in time to pop round the neighbours' to watch the rugby (oo er!). The neighbours' house contains a time/wine warp so am now pissed and unsure whether I should go straight to bed or not.

    Hank, good to see you back!

  65. Hank - right on about Camus; as I understand it, he was all about freedom until it came to the Algerians.

  66. ah, you soppy sod, habib...Great tune btw, here's my favourite Ella track


    Hi thauma - did your dog get my Valentine's card?

  67. Hiya Hank - *pfft* the postie must have been deficient again. Still, she had various visitors to sniff today and a good run over the fields, so she seems quite happy.

  68. I'd add Brave New world to that list Hank

    “Alpha children wear grey. They work much harder than we do, because they’re so frightfully clever. I’m really awfully glad I’m a Beta, because I don’t work so hard. And then we are much better than the Gammas and Deltas. Gammas are stupid. They all wear green, and Delta children wear khaki. Oh no, I don’t want to play with Delta children. And Epsilons are still worse. They’re too stupid to be able. . . .”

  69. Yeh, same problem my end, thauma. Bloody postmen.

    Btw, if you get a visit from the RSPCA in the next few days, it's got nothing to do with me emailing them a picture of the hound wearing a stupid rugby hat.

  70. I'll have you know that I've just arranged for emergency identity reassignment surgery. She will look like a toy poodle by tomorrow afternoon.

    Really must be off to bed as it's taken me about 10 mins to type the above, what with all the backspacing....

  71. Have to say I've never read BNW, sheff. That's my own iconoclasm coming into play, I think. We're all made aware of the canon of books we must read, and all of us, when we're stroppy subversive teenagers, kick against the accepted wisdom.

    I did read Eyeless in Gaza though, when I was a spotty yoof, for no other reason than that there was a band of the same name signed to Cherry Red and played on the John Peel show. Bored me rigid. The book and the band.

  72. BNW is a feather bed of a dystopia - more akin to the Ikea world so many of us are content to inhabit these days. Although it was written in the early 30's it has lots of resonance today. People happy in their ignorance and slavery. All pain vanquished. Very frightening.

  73. Hank, you callin' me a soppy sod? Well then.

  74. Stop skiving on youtube and get some work done, habib. (I really need to download thauma's icon here.)

    You know that one of the things that really pisses me off about Cif is the timewasters who spend their time posting what passes for their thoughts about why the economy's fucked and are then amazed when Imogen loses her "job".

    If I could be arsed, I'd pop over to waddya and suggest that Kiz writes an article about her role in Greece's downfall.

    Whatever happened to the concept of dignity in labour?

  75. I'll confess that I haven't read Brave New World, but I have read We by Yevgeny Zamyatin, the book that Huxley ripped off for BNW. I remember kind of enjoying it, but I don't remember anything about it. Don't think I'd bother reading it again.

  76. Imogen didn't lose her job. She quit. If you'd pay attention, you'd know these things, Mr. Scorpio.

  77. Hi Montana, as we already have Mon 2010 Feb 15th here, happy official first birthday to The Untrusted!

  78. Right everyone. Time for bed. Early start tomorrow. Night night x

  79. Yeh course she did, Montana. She had a better offer from a cumpany desperate for a self-absorbed dyslexic timewayster.

    Nominated for Ciffer of the Year. And resigned from Cif because she'd lost her job so wouldn't be able to post on her company's time.

    She deserved Ciffer of the Year for that admission alone.

  80. Hank -
    "We're all made aware of the canon of books we must read, and all of us, when we're stroppy subversive teenagers, kick against the accepted wisdom"
    Hell yes - there are so many books 'oh you must read', aren't there? I used to care, but having tried to read the Satanic Verses a while back, gave up - I just didn't like or care about any of the characters... (could also explain why the kite runner, arthur and george, and a bunch of sarah waters books are sitting, dustily, on the unread shelf)

    Interestingly (perhaps) round about the same time - when I was trapped in a friend's flat without my own library - I started to read Huxley's debut, Chrome Yellow - which includes, as part of a very pat country house conversation, a reference to 'growing babies in bottles'.

    I always wondered where he got the idea for BNW - sounds like it may actually have come from 1920s 'progressive' ideas on childrearing...

  81. Kick against the pricks, Philippa. I refused to read Satanic Verses on moral grounds, ie the Daily Heil endorsed it on "freedom of speech" lines. Fuck that. And fuck them. Like they care about freedom of speech, wankers.

    My political education owes a lot to the NME. Back in the mid-80s, when Paul Morley was a lot slimmer and less of a twat, the NME was quite a political paper, and the kids were all into Orwell, Camus, Sartre etc. Baudrillard and Rimbaud too, but even as a starry-eyed 16 year old I wasn't buying into that shit.

    Sad as it is, I was an impressionable kid when I read the Roads to Freedom, Road to Wigan Pier, and Germinal, Ragged Trousered Philanthropists, and Love on the Dole.

    So those books, and those ideals, shaped me. And I'm still angry all these years later.

    Btw, it's Crome Yellow(-;


  82. "Satanic Verses" is a titanic waste of time to read. "Midnight's Children" makes you question why you read books. Salman Rushdie I'm sure is a nice guy, but jesus he's boring, as a writer.

  83. "A Tale of Two Cities" was the best book I was made to read.

  84. Wit u there Habib, gave up on Satanic Verses, and catch 22, just seemed pointless... And Crime & Punishment..

    Read all the Thomas Covenant books tho. that takes stamina..

  85. I had to read Mill on the Floss and The Spire for A level, habib, and loved both of them.

    Also had to do Romeo and Juliet, and as I was the only guy in a class of 15, I had to take a lot of the speaking parts. Self-conscious as fuck, as you are at 16, I hated it, and will never play Juliet's Nurse again.

  86. Turmider! Catch 22? You didn't like that?

  87. Mill on the Floss was good stuff.
    sorry Turminder for mispelling your name, hell I can't spell anything,

    Hank you do make me giggle.

  88. I liked the Joke in Catch 22 Habib, just less so after 100 pages..

    "There's no trust,
    No faith, no honesty in men; all are perjur'd
    All foresworn, all naught, all dissemblers."

    Must have had an effect huh, Hank?

  89. "Tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow
    Creeps in this petty pace
    From day to day
    Until the last syllable of recorded time

    And all our yesterdays have lighted fools the way to dusty death.
    Out, out, brief candle
    Life's but a walking shadow,
    A poor player who struts and frets his hour on the stage
    And then is heard no more.
    Tis a tale told by an idiot
    Full of sound. And fury.


    Not sure that's kosher, posted from memory.

    "No faith, no honesty in men...."

    Yeh, it's had an effect, turminder. Depressing, isn't it?

  90. Hi, can anyone around please tell LavartisProdeo that penileplesysthmograph would really like to be visited in hospital? p.p.g. is blocked from email and non-CIF blogs, so you can contact him via me or kizbot or ... Cheers.