16 April 2010


Masada fell to the Romans in 73.  Martin Luther made his first appearance before the Diet of Worms in 1521.  The Battle of Culloden was in 1746.  Lenin arrived in Petrograd in 1917.  Bob Feller pitched the only Opening Day no-hitter in the history of Major League Baseball in 1941.  An explosion on a freighter in the port of Texas City, Texas, in 1947 set fire to the city.  At least 600 people were killed and 5000 were injured in the town, the population of which was only 15,000 at the time.  At Virginia Technical University in 2007, a student went on a shooting rampage, killing 32 people and injuring 25 others.

Born today:  Elisabeth-Louise Vigée le Brun (1755-1842), Anatole France (1844-1924), John Millington Synge (1871-1909), Charlie Chaplin (1889-1977), Spike Milligan (1918-2002), Merce Cunningham (1919-2009), Peter Ustinov (1921-2004), Kingsley Amis (1922-1995), Henry Mancini (1924-1994), Dusty Springfield (1939-1999), Gerry Rafferty (1947), Rafa Benítez (1960) and Pierre Littbarski (1960).

I'm sure it's the feast day of some obscure saint, but I forgot to write one down & can't be bothered to look now.


  1. I don't know what to do about the issues that people seem to have been having with commenting here. Blogspot's help pages aren't very helpful (to me, anyway).

    I will say that I've only encountered any problems with commenting about 3 times in all the time that the place has been in existence and wonder if it's browser related? I use Chrome. Blogspot & Chrome: both Google. ?????

    Just a thought. Someone with more technical nous will soon tell me I'm wrong and it couldn't possibly have anything to do with the browser people are using.

  2. Montana I'm using Internet Explorer (mainly because I'm too idle to change it!) and I don't seem to be encountering any problems.

    Recently my posts have even posted first time!

    Not smug (honest! ) just puzzled. ;)

  3. I've been on firefox here, IE at home, no real problems on either.

  4. Seems OK with Safari on the Mac too...

  5. Montana, annetan,

    Are only UK users having this problem? It may have something to do with BT and other UK ISP's deep packet inspection with which they spy on their customers.

    If you think i am paranoid, google

    site:guardian.co.uk deep packet inspection

    Orange has already been caught selling data about customer activity gained through this form of spying.

  6. ALternatively it may be an attack of gremlins on one or more of the server farms, but i have not had this difficulty. linux, firefox with NoScript extension.

  7. medve: This German poster here also has encountered problems, but they seem to be gone.

    Read the open thread "Are women too picky when it comes to mates?" and found out that "being nice to his own mum" seems to be a conditio sine qua non for many women.

    Dammit! It's hard enough to listen unemotionally to my mother when she is in bigoted know-it-all-mode (or worse, in "spanking kids is necessary" mode), being nice is really an actual impossibility to me.

    Couldn't women make an exception to the "must be nice to his mum" rule if said mum is objectively horrible? (And do het men have a "partner must be nice to her dad" rule? Cause I don't.)

  8. elementary:

    There has been some deep packet inspection in Germany as well, but with blogspot being part of the googles ...

    Forget i said anything about it. server farm gremlins after all perhaps.

    On the more serious matter, is it not an acceptable work around to just appear to be nice to his own mum? I sneakily side-stepped this one by contriving that they did not meet at all until after our first child was born. simples!

  9. Hello, CIF have given me an ASBO for being funny and clever on Bidisha's hallowed posts it seems and now I am not allowed to comment. So I have been on strike eating chocolate. Now whenever I come on this site a little round circle tells me that the 'script is slowing it down."

    Am I banned too. I am only small.

  10. I think everyone was having issues posting last night, which suggests that blogger was having a bad night - possibly traffic? not just here, but there would have been lots of liveblogs / streaming etc on the debates, might just have clogged things up.

    Morning MsR!

  11. Nah, Ms Robinson, you're not small: they are small-minded, uber-defensive and on a very shoogly peg indeed.Either they know that they are wrong and are being petty and partisan defending certain dross because it's their pals' dross (c.f. the laurie penny car-crash yesterday, Andrew Brown,Bea OBE, etc etc, and that alos includes pet BTLers: see Peter Bracken got vanished for a strong but valid, non-abusive, post to a favoured BTL-er the other day) or just as bad they believe they are right and so are risibly narrow-minded and blinkered.

    Re: the connections/sign-in shenanigans. I'm reasonably sure it's a Blogger-side issue, having had similar problems with other Blogger sites. I think they're trying out some new stuff (dimly recall being offered the chance to try some beta Blogger testing a while back).

  12. MsR, you're surely not banned? I hope not.

    Edwin, if you're reading.

    I saw you discussing Bob Crampsey on the Wisden thread. An absolute legend. His 'now you know' columns in the Evening times pink were part of my growing up watching football. My dad always got a pink outside Celtic Park or Kilbowie if we'd gone to watch the Bankies and I always turned straight to his column.

    About 12 years ago, he did a one off appearance at the Edinburgh festival. It was fantastic. He spoke for nearly 2 hours on his reminiscences about the Scottish game. I came out with a tear in my eye. So evocative of the great days of Scottish fitba. His '100 years of the Scottish league' is one of my favourite books.

  13. Watson - Couldn't women make an exception to the "must be nice to his mum" rule if said mum is objectively horrible?


    A better rule of thumb is to observe how someone treats people with no perceived power over them: checkout staff, barmaids, etc.

  14. @ Duke, did you see any of the series on STV (pretty sure you can catch online, either officially or unofficially) called "The Football Years".
    Here's a wee write-up on it (PS, aye that's my wee brother who's mentioned...)

  15. PS... does anyone else feel that this "Historic TV Debate" is all about upside down politics ?

    I feely creepily abnormal: the BBC, Guardian, everyone in the media this morning seem in absolute concesus that it's a perfectly terrific way to drive democracy. Yet it seems that media/politcal establishment have just dictated it

    Political leaders used to be as much the product of their party, grassroots supporters as strategists and persuadors. Last night didn't feel like it was making the public any more empowered ...

    It seems conferences rope just parties into line, whips keep backbenchers in line, and the media strategists and leaders in the Westminster Village agree with the establishment media what options we - the public - should be given to vote for. Rather than offer anything worthwwhile, I thought last night was merely a beauty contest. The Ballot Factor...

    Or am I - seriously - just turning into one of those old cranks I used to meet on the festival circuit, who just DOESN'T GET poltics any more ??

    PPS commisserations MsR - those mods are crazy I tells ya.

  16. Oh dear, the CiF Friday Afternoon car-crash has arrived early...

    "Make media studies a core school subject to help children negotiate the words and images the world bombards them with"

    Jesus fucking christ on a moped....

  17. Alisdair,

    nice article, I did watch it, it was excellent. Your brother was the football archive researcher? Give him a pat on the back from me. Couldn't think of a better job for myself. Researching football history and getting paid for it.

    Loved that story from Willie Miller about the great Socrates after the 82 WC Scotland-Brazil game. To produce a urine sample after running about in the stifling heat, he drank 24 bottles of San Miguel!

    I also have a great photo from the USSR-Scotland game in 82. Two Scotland fans on the terraces holding up an enormous banner emblazoned:


    Tragicomic in so many ways.....

  18. @ Bitterweed
    Nope, you're right: it's a big sideshow/distraction, a Westminster bubble/wonk/commentariat circle-jerk, giving the talking-haeds brigade more airtime and column space to speculate and pontificate about, well,what? The amount of flimsy guff and silly shite that's being emitted at the moment is hard to bear.
    a) Viewing figures, including average duration of viewing?
    b) Indications of the make-up of viewers,their prior voting intentions and their ‘floatingness’

    I have something of a feeling that of those who watched for longer than, say, 10 minutes,many are already politically active,engaged and quite possibly already committed as to where there will place their X. Just a hunch, but if right,it would mean that the televised debates themselves are just not that important. Coverage of them, by the older media channels and the spin (positive and negative) applied might be as significant, if not more so, than what actually happened in the 90 minutes.Note also that the spin machines of both New Labour and new Tory have a good track record in (presumably unintentionally, but you never quite know) alienating,patronising and essentially feeding disillusionment with, and estrangement from, Westminster politics.
    Performing when nobody’s watching, or at least when few ordinary and/or undecided people watching are there to be won over makes this a curious,regressive innovation.See also the ludicrous emphasis on tw*tter by the parties and papers like the Guardian as if those twittering all day about the election aren't party activists or stooges. Feed the machine, and don't bother meeting the man or woman in the street.

  19. Have put me spreadsheet (jpeg format, unfortunately, so you can't see data values) and a little note up on UT2, to look at vote / seat stats for Labour / Tories.

    Obviously extrapolating trends in the FPTP system is near impossible (for me at least) but the next Parliament could have a lot more 'others' in than at present. Although my hope for a big drop in the Big 2 vote may be overly-optimistic, if it did happen, things would get interesting...

  20. A woman on R4 was saying that it's down to a few floating voters in 150 seats that will decide the election, hence all the targetting of marginals by Ashcroft et al..

    Read a great book in the 90's 'the last election' Pete Davies i think. Keeps coming back to mind...

  21. This comment has been removed by the author.

  22. More than pre-mod. I write perfectly innocent comments and Most Respectful re election debate being a sideshow (unlike Australia where compulsory voting makes the swinging vote REAL) and no sign of me.

    I guess Bidisha is still crying and Matron Jess hasn't got over the fact that I told her that feminism as she saw it was sooo over.

  23. Thanks to PeterJ on Waddya for posting a transcript of the debate last night, which people may find interesting...

  24. Their loss ms R. Slag Bidisha and reap the whirlwind. I just can't be bothered with Cif these days...

  25. MsR - if you've been banned / pre-modded / sent to naughty step / radfem re-education commune, isn't there a red thing wot comes up when you try to post? If it just says 'script slowing' that sounds more like a pluck-up...

    Hope you're not banned. You're a voice of sanity on many of the threadds...

  26. And now I seem to be blocked again. Hmmm. Hope it kicks back in soon...

  27. Same as PeterJ - Safari and an (old) mac no problems.

    he was such a nice guy Your Grace. He spoke at the launch of my friend Kevin's Third Eye exhibition back in the 70s, a real gentleman, always ready to help others.

    The Run-out is one of the great cricket novels but the sex scene is one of the most cringey in fiction!

  28. Ms R it may be a techy thing. I understand nothing of this but I remember Waltz thought she was banned (Big H had a few blogs on at Heresy Corner) but it turned out to be tech stuff.

  29. Morning folks.

    I went a bit OTT on the media studies thread, even by my own standards.

    I compared media studies to peaedophilia. On cif, my argument looks shabby, so let me reflect more slowly here.

    1. She is arguing, instead of curtailing and banning advertising and commericalim aimed at children, we teach children about it.-- 'The ways of the dark side' IMO.

    2. The analogy is comparable to-- instead of locking paedophiles up, we give each child pepper spray and martial arts classes.

    Does anyone see. I am basically saying the onus of responsibility is not on the children, but the other party, either paedophiles or agressive marketing.

  30. Good stuff Napoleon, not a problem with any of that.

    Alisdair Cameron
    I tend to agree. The big telly thing was all about Nixon and Kennedy, in the "white heat" of new technology - all this crapola they're doing now is just masturbatory harkening back to when millions watched and actually gave a shit about tv channels' content. It's the political equivalent of Glastonbury: what was once a trailblazing expression of genuine public sentiment is now a just formulaic celebration of the event for its own sake.

    Steve Bell is pretty good today.

    Someone's comment on Facebook this morning re: the Lib Dems

    "they're a load of born again christian supply teachers who spend their holidays on naturist campsites."

    Nice. Not everyone was convinced then !

  31. Wasn't "Life of Brian" banned in one Scandinavian country X and afterwards marekted in Scandinavian cuntry Y as "The movie that is too funny for Scandinavian country X!"?

    Getting banned/premoded/deleted for being funny is considered a badge of honour among the real intellectual elite, so here's to you, MsRobinson!

    Media Studies: What it is with guardian writers arguing that children should learn to "negotiate" something - the articles using this phrase seem to be exceptionally stupid. (After having written that, I'll take a look at that article.)

  32. The story about Brian being banned in Aberystwyth


    is actually a myth (Brian's girlfriend of course became Mayor!) but it was banned in Glasgow.

    Your Grace have you seen this??


  33. Hi BW, I'm here, but my brain is jelly, earlier I caught myself talking to Gammarus (small freshwater shrimp type things)

  34. Gammarus ... good CiF name ...

    How about a band called Billy and the Bivalves ?

  35. Cock Robin?

    I'm at work, roll on the end of the school hols! Last day here, it's like bedlam!

  36. Always wanted my band to be called Thaumaturge and the Side Effects.

  37. BW

    Gammarus ... good CiF name ...

    yours if you want it, I've got a long list of obscure birds I can run through first if needs be!

  38. turm: I guess this name is lurking just around the corner, but won't remeber the promise it made.

  39. Thauma Bejeezus and the Urge?

  40. Winthorpe has an article up.l That man is totally class.

  41. Ooo look - time to go home! \o/

  42. @BW and Dot - I always fancied Xiphias if I ever used a pseudonym. Or maybe Heterocephalus.

    Anyway, back to the false world; media studies for toddlers and valueless debates... (I saw that one blog tracked National Grid electricity consumption graphs during the event, BTW, and suggested that most people had turned off before nine.)

  43. PeterJ
    How about a Nietzche-reading mod* -

    Zaratwostroke ?

    (*As in Paul Weller, not twat with a delete button at Guardian Towers)

  44. My pal wanted to call a band 'Baltic Fleet' still think that's a corker..

    How about 'Thaumaturge & Demiurge' German synth pop duo.? : )

  45. G. pulex and the mayfly nymphs....

  46. "Baltic Fleet".. Hmm.. like it..

    How about a hardcore anarcho-punk-folk collective

    "The Fuckwit No!"

  47. Once attempted to write screenplay featuring riot grrrl band called 'Eve was Weak'.

    Best thing about it, the band-name...

  48. I know a lad who plays gigs around the Kettering / Rushden / Wellinborough triangle:

    Isaac Hunt ("I sure am")

  49. 'a thousand tiny magnets' is what i wanted to call my band. It's from a 'Johnson Co.' style advert from 70s comics, but i can't track down a copy of the advert.. Was just 1 segment of the full page ad, a dog made of these tiny brick shaped magnets with zig zag power lines radiating from it...

  50. Grr, just had a comment vanish..

  51. Phil: You're a failed screenwriter? *swooon*

  52. i've failed in a wide variety of sectors, elementary...nothing if not consistent!

  53. If we're putting a gig together, you've got to use the "Resounding Seahorses".

  54. Thanks for being entertaining guys, my brain is so fried I can't decide whether to have bitter or cider in the pub tonight!

  55. Dotterel
    Both ! Pint of Cornish Rattler or similar first, to sort the thirst, then straight into a few Timothy Taylor's Landlords... mmm Landlord...

  56. You interest me strangely, BW. My own plan is to try a few Dark Star Hopheads, perhaps intermingled with whatever guest pint the pub has put on for today.

  57. "Resounding Seahorses" Baddiah!

    No booze for me for a few days, fell right off the waggon these last few weeks...

    I write screen plays too! 'Final draft' is a godsend..

  58. Phil, somehow I find failure at something like screen writing far more interesting and, may I say it, attractive than succeeding at it. "I tried, but I failed" is where the story lies; "I tried and I succeeded" simply lacks any dramatic arc.

  59. Interesting plan BW...

    Although IIRC the pub we're heading to only serves cider you can see through unfortunately!

  60. I tried and was about to succeed, but was brought low by;

    A tragic flaw
    an evil wo/man
    the man

    The old ones are still the old ones...

  61. heh heh.

    am all about the dramatic arc, me.

    am hoping not to fail with book, though. if i ever finish the bloody thing.

  62. blimey, that BNP thread was reasonable for about three comments and then ... do they have a beeper system or something?

  63. Afternoon, darling Utters of my heart.

    Finished for the weekend! \o/

    Feet up, cup of tea, sun shining. Niiiice.

    Just saw the BNP thread too. What more could a gal want? :p

  64. Well, Phil, you can fail with your first and still succeed with your second. Then you have the best of both worlds. You could also turn your failed projects into short stories, made up as reviews of the novel you wanted to write; you can lay out exactly what you wanted to do, don't have to write 500 pages and make a po-mo homage to Jorge Luis Borges, all in one comparatively short text.

    Which reminds me I wanted to write a play about staging an adaption of "The Way to Almotasim", the book Borges made up; however, sadly, I failed to start doing it, yet.

  65. BB: According to my favourite feminist film critic, what a gal could want more is this

  66. PeterJ - haven't had Dark Star for yonks. Middle of West End last time - probably twenty years ago.. enjoy!

    It's not a headbanger, about 6% and it's got a nice sharp kick to it without being flat-out nutter juice. Here's there pleasingly amateurish website


  67. BW - I'se got me some Hobgoblin to drink later tonight. Really nice beer. And only a quid a bottle in Lidl atm if anyone is interested.

  68. BB
    Hobgoblin... never quite got into that one. I did have four Old Speckled Hens last night. That was some orgy.

  69. Hahahahah! Old Speckled is lovely too. Hobgoblin has a slightly fruitier, sweeter edge to it though, which I like. It is more like the "brown" beers you get in France, which aren't half bad some of them - or a bit like a belgian Chimay only not as strong.

  70. Chimay....? ... I have very *bad* memory of visiting my brother in Brussels, getting shedloads of Chimay in my overnight bag to bring back on the Sunday night train, only to neck *the lot* on the Eurostar home. Ten bottles, five blue, five red.I got stopped by security in Waterloo station I was so f@cked, and was still so ratted even when I got home two hours later my missus nearly sacked me... never again...

  71. BW - you must have been in at the beginnings of Dark Star, then, before it set up on its own down here. It started out in London as part of the Pitfield Brewery, and spun off after it started winning awards. Still brewed by the same bloke, with a new seasonal beer every month.

    One of my locals usually has three of them on; it's one of the main outlets apart from the brewery's own Evening Star near the station.

  72. PeterJ, cracking local by the look of it !

  73. LOL BW - evil stuff, that Chimay :o)

  74. Holy cow, just found (courtesy of the ever brilliant,reliably obscene b3ta) the ideal game for Andrew Brown, and those apologists for Catholic sex abuse...

  75. Good evening.

    And what a fine evening it is in Yorkshire.

  76. Hey MsChin

    Beautiful evening here too!

    Friday night is my favourite night of the week - I always have my head full of plans for the weekend that hardly ever come to fruition, but it is nice to sit back, feet up, and relax for a bit.

  77. Evening all

    Dunno whether people have heard but Pen has been
    allowed home-with some restrictions it would seem.
    Hopefully the worst is over for him.

    Apparently some shithead on Cif has been trying to
    give him a hard time.Talk about kicking a man when
    he,s down.Where are those fucking mods when you need

  78. Goods news on Pen.

    Right, weekend time, its been a busy week.

  79. Yep, good to hear pen's outta there.

  80. Quote of the year (decade?) from the BNP thread:


    16 Apr 2010, 7:00PM


    it all went wrong when women got the vote ,

  81. Paul - pleased for Pen. Thanks for the update. Whoever is giving him a kicking is a git, though.

    MsChin - LOL!

  82. Hi guys,

    Don't worry about me, my plans are so schemey and long term, I'm a games theorist (amongst my many expertises and guises duh). I'm not bothered by good old Vince, give em enough rope is what I say, tis amazing what social pressure can do.

    I like a dark, Chimay's ok(brings back memories of a french damselle) but I drink Hobgoblin too more now, it's the (ch)imp in me.

    Anyone worked out my metafiction, my hypermeme, my mindfuck, yet? No?

    It's informational sequestration of identity space haha

    Will try to post more this pm. Thanks guys, I so appreciate the support from the bottom to the top of my heart.

    Love Pen

  83. Evening pen, good to see you around in presumably good humour (presumably as I, for one, haven't figured out your hypermeme; I didn't even realize you had one; for frank's sahe, what exactly *is* a hypermeme?)

    But, as I wrote, good to see you around again.

  84. Pen

    You've lost me on the informational sequestration thingy, I'm afraid, but I am glad to see you back as a free man.

  85. Very good to hear from you, pen
    Glad you've made it back here too: not sure everyone on Waddya was understanding (with some notable, very decent exceptions).

  86. Hi All

    pen--Good to hear you're out, and posting here. Take care.

    BB--We get Hobgoblin here too. Good beer. That Chamay can hurt you unless limited to one or two. My wife is the manager of the government liquor store here, so I am lucky enough to sample beers and ales from all over the world. No discounts though. Bugger.

    Hi Paul, don't count on the mods to equitable, the fuckers seem to have their own protectorate.

  87. Everybody knows that the Plague is coming
    Everybody knows that it's moving fast
    Everybody knows that the naked man and woman - just a shining artifact of the past . Everybody knows it's coming apart: take one look at this Scared heart before it blows
    And Everybody knows

  88. Christina - have you started on the vodka early tonight? :p

  89. Hehehehe - nah, you're alright. The sun is well and truly over the yard-arm. :o)

    Is that lyric on waddya from Wham?

  90. BB
    You don't recognise Leonard Cohen

    This waltz, this waltz, this waltz, this waltz, with it's very own breath of Brandy and death. Dragging its tail in the sea

  91. Christina my love, I have to confess to loathing Leonard Cohen. Sorry. I can't help it...

  92. BB:

    Don't know Cohen's music much, but Jeff Buckley's rendition of Hallelujah is something special:


  93. PeterB

    Yes! Lovely rendition and one of those rare occasions when a cover is better than the original.

    I am just about to slaughter another sacred cow by saying that could be said about most of Dylan's music too... :p

  94. Peter Bracken

    Leonard Cohen's Hallelujah is even more special

  95. '...The fourth, the fifth, the minor fall the major lift, the baffled king composing Hallelujah...'

    What a fabulous line that is.

    Not sufficiently informed to dispute your assessment, Christina.

    (I know, I know - that lack doesn't normally stop me:-))

  96. Yoo hoo Pen!
    MsRobinson - You're not banned. It's easy to check if anybody's banned because when you click on the profile all that comes up is 'profile unavailable'.. Your's is there. If you were in blasted pre-mod whenever you clicked the post button you'd have a message in red at the top of your post box saying 'sent for premoderation' or something along those lines...

  97. Ray! Pen's out! Welcome back, petal.

    peterb - love that song - weird that so much of his stuff veered between the massively beautiful - not just cohen but the britten stuff - and the strangely MOR - have a horrible feeling he was troubled by frustration, not being as good (originally) as he thought he should be...whatever, a f-ing sad loss for music.

    does this mean I get to start posting Sisters' tunes again? hehehehehehehe

  98. incidentally - whatever tab is out there of hallejuah is way off. nothing sounds quite like that...

  99. @BB
    see me fave cyber QC,s on a roll on the Frank Furedi
    thread.Got me steel helmet on just in case!:)

  100. Well, here's an 'inspired by' rather than cover of Suzanne.

    I have more of this stuff. Be afraid.

  101. More of this stuff? Erm, NO, philippa.

  102. Hi Kiz nice to see you here

    Hi PhilippaB

    Hi Christina, yeah love Cohen, indeed they call me traitor to my face, must be my traitor's heart (weeps).

  103. Ah, Blogger's playing up for me tonight.

  104. will arm-wrestle you, mschin.

    heh heh.

    just sip past, that'll be safest.

  105. I've got a soft spot for leonard.. sweetest misogynist 'ever'...

  106. Hello All


    What's this with the 'she's Welsh @ thing on the Winthorpe thread ?

    Were you referring to the melifluous Melissa ? Is s/he Welsh ?

  107. Hi Vince, Pen, good to see you guys back here again.

  108. LOL Paul - I will never be a QC. Didn't go to the right school! :p

  109. @Leni
    I was referring to Melissa who had made a snide dig
    at Sarka.The Welsh reference was to a poem that a few
    of us had joked about a few weeks ago.Certainly wasn,t meant to offend the Welsh people which is why i asked the mods to scrap it.It was a case of submitting a post before thinking it mightcause offence.Really sorry if it offended you.Cos you,re Welsh aren,t you.Shit!
    Big apology!

  110. I/m not really into football but is Liverpool about to collapse ? I can think of several people who will be very upset if they are bankrupt.

    I never qiute understand how a sports club can be a business.

  111. Leni - they up for sale, so that suggests (ironically) not too fucked up. not an unexpected sale either, understand. sales are a blip, rather than a chaos. unless the DD turns up badness - but that seems unlikely here.

    still more bewilderereed by the MUFC finances....

    they've mortgaged the club. basically. and few people seem to care....

  112. It's crying time again...


  113. Paul

    I wasn't offended - more curious about why you thought Melissa is Welsh.

    Dim problem ( as we are supposed to say ) x

  114. Leni

    Just so you know it was one of those harmless
    English/Irish/Scots/Welsh ditties.But as i know
    to my cost people can/do take things the wrong
    way sometimes if they,re stressed/unhappy etc
    which is why i asked for it to be removed.

  115. Philippa

    Football club finances always amaze me .

    I imagine if either L'pool or ManU went bankrupt the resulting riots would outshine the polltax riots.

  116. Just been looking At Philippa's spread sheet - the democratic deficit an' all that.

    Recd. leaflet from local MP today (Labour) - out of 5 areas of interest only one is descibed as achieved. He apparently failed to even get better access to local railway station - although he ' worked for it '.

  117. Damn! A Leonard Cohen and Sisters night and I missed it. Here's another Cohen track, covered by James.

  118. Welcome back, Pen!!! Missed you.

  119. I'd forgotten about James .

  120. The WHO has warned that anyone with a chest complaint
    may have to remain indoors once the ash from the
    Icelandic volcano starts falling from the sky.Apparently if even small particles of the ash get into your lungs it could prove extremely dangerous-ie you might snuff it!


  121. THE END IS NIGH !

    What - again ?

    I have been wondering about the content of the cloud - fire and brimstone obviously but what else. Bits of singed devil ?

  122. Where's Vince ? I like Vince. Cough once if you know him...


    Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit smoking... Gold star to anyone who names the rather apt film.

  124. Any chance vince is chagall?

  125. Hi All

    Can't stomach Cohen's singing but he is a brilliant writer.

    Bitterweed--Don't know him, but his posts are interesting if a little contentious.

    Re the MUFC and Liverpool debts. Have they not been caused by dodgy purchasing deals rather than operational policies? Maybe Philippa (resident accountant and numbers whiz) could explain the situation in a better way.

  126. Hi kiz--Could be chagall, don't recall seeing many posts from him lately.

    Has the economic mess in Greece affected you at all?

  127. Hi Habib, how you doing? Is it 'Up in Smoke'?

  128. Yeah that Vince is a great bloke,real laugh Bitterweed.
    I,m no saint but i,d stop short of knowingly putting
    the boot in with a guy whose down on his luck.That,s
    of course if we,re talking about the same Vince.
    But if you like that sort of thing you,re in good
    company mate!!

  129. You won't have seen any posts from chagall... he's been banned

  130. Funny you should mention that Paul coz a few months ago some posters over at 'whatever' did the same thing to a 'once' regular poster on here. Just saying..

  131. Paul ? "i,d stop short of knowingly putting
    the boot in with a guy whose down on his luck."

    What did Vinnie ever do to you ?

    Not that I know anything. Seems he's struck a nerve among the cuddly cogniscenti over on another blog. One I don't bother with. Explain.

  132. He means because vince delighted in ripping Pen..

  133. Meanwhile, here's Lhasa in fine form... gorgeous.

  134. This comment has been removed by the author.

  135. Well I'm sure he can account for that if that's what he did.

    Meanwhile, he seems to have posted some terrific shit on other subjects over on the correctional threads lately. No bullying, just the truth :-)

  136. Boudican

    Liverpool have a 237 million pound debt - that sounds like 'bankrupt ' to me !

  137. delighted? Is that how you felt Vince felt Paul?

  138. Here's more Lhasa. She got caught in a storm.

  139. Up all night Kizbot? What time is in Greece, 3.25am?

    I'm going to bed. Goodnight.

  140. Hiya Boudican! Nice try, but no gold star. Next line on this leitmotif is "looks like I picked the wrong week to give up glue sniffing".

    Bitterweed, that brought back some memories, you make me want to...

    Hiya Kiz, long time no speak with...

  141. Sorry, BW, I was refering to the one before, but that one does, too. Superb.

  142. And here's the greatest anthem the Soviet Union never had. Talk about crimes against
    humanity ... stunning.

  143. She's good stuff BW. Before I forget


  144. Nice one navster

    This is good


  145. очень хорошо, BW (hope I got that right, it's been a while)

    navro that was moving, too.

    Are we getting too morose?

  146. Oh Well


  147. heyhabib
    Thanks, but I don't do cyril...

  148. heyhabib


    сейчас, я ложусь спать.
    до завтра!

  149. Hey, have this habib

    For once in my life...


  150. Sorry, Bitterweed, for some reason I thought you did. Who is it that speaks russian on here? I feel awful now, but that's some damn good music, sir.

  151. Thanks. Here's some truly fucking good music.... Mahler... 5... Adagietto.


    People who don't get this want shot.

  152. Why have The'Mac gone pink?

    Nuff said


  153. Napoleon, I'm definitely плохо at Russian, sorry!

  154. Wouldn't you just die without Mahler?

  155. I get the oxo bit what's the rest got to do with my gravy


  156. Hi All

    Good tunes guys! Some educational value for me, Hadn't heard some of that stuff.

    Leni--Sounds like bankrupt to me too.I think MUFC are 700 to 800 M in the red (No pun here either) but the banks or other creditors won't force the loans or declare bankruptcy because they may get less in a 'foreclosure' than allowing the clubs to stay afloat. Either way. it's a fiduciary fiasco.

    kiz--Yeah, figured that for chagall. A bit confrontational and negative for me, but, it's his choice to be that way and it does take all kinds, no?

  157. Here's to all us up-all-night UTters.. late... alone.. again.. naturally...

  158. Did anyone mention Leonard?

    No ?

    Well, here he is again anyway. Best love song ever.


  159. I was on about G&s track.

    LC can go fuck himself.

  160. Cheers... Leonard's one of the real ones... few and far between they are.

    Here's this from Jimi. Deserved a Grammy just for the outro alone...


  161. navro

    "LC can go fuck himself."

    Nice. Any particular reason me old mucker ?

  162. He wrote poems. Not songs or tunes. Caught in-between.

  163. I can only assume you're a brummie navro.

    In which case, here's some true class


    Hell yes...

  164. Have to step in here and defend Leonard - but can live very happily without Mahler.

  165. See you around yeah !


  166. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5pFgAtDXKw&feature=related

  167. Wot a riff. Not from Brumruff though.

    Aren't these guys from umfuckercentral-


  168. Hi Leni,heyhabib and any other night people

    Someone in Hong Kong has just asked me about this
    volcanic ash cloud.And then in all seriousness wished
    me Good Luck when we said goodbye.

    Is there something we haven,t been told?Is this it?
    Sure as hell don,t want to die in this shit hole so
    am tempted to go home.Only live 10 minutes away and
    i think the end of the world is a good enough excuse
    to leave early!!

  169. Sorry Leni, I meant why do you like him?

  170. navro

    Was just off to bed - but if you insist !

    Like his poetry, his word play and his humour - often black. His observations of human behaviour and interaction - like these too.

    His singing isn't upto much but he created lyrics and a musical simplicity which it is possible to embroider and stretch.

    Why don't you like him ?


    Are we all going to die in our beds - or at work in your case ? If we have only a day or 2 left I'd better think up ways of spending it - no need to save or worry - I shall borrow thousands tomorrow and go to - somewhere on the bus or train I supose .

    Night night all

  171. Or what do you liked of his?

  172. Leni

    Has been nice 'knowing' you -albeit briefly.

    Maybe we,ll meet on the 'other side'.


  173. Why dont I like him?

    His voice.

    Yeah that's it. Mainly his voice. He should have got Lou Reed to do his vocals.

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