08 April 2010

08/04/10

Winchester Cathedral was dedicated in 1093.  The Venus de Milo was discovered on the island of Melos in 1820.  Liaquat Ali Khan and Jawaharlal Nehru signed the Liaquat-Nehru Pact in 1950, intended to guarantee minority rights in Pakistan and India and avert a war between them.  Jomo Kenyatta was sentenced to 7 years of hard labour and indefinite detention thereafter for alleged involvement in the Mau Mau Rebellion in 1952.

Born today:  Mary Pickford (1892-1979), Sonja Henie (1912-1969), Jacques Brel (1929-1978), Kofi Annan (1938), Vivienne Westwood (1941) and Julian Lennon (1963).

Japan is celebrating Hanamatsuri today.

181 comments:

  1. Morning all!

    Concerning Ms Bell mentioned yesterday, she was the woman who found out how to compute the distance of stars *really* far away using pulsar stars, wasn't she? Great work. (By the way, IIRC she was one of very very many women working for some astronomer doing astronomy the "American way", i.e. using lots and lots of people (here, women) to do small parts of a huge project, so it wasn't that exotic to find a woman in this field at that time.)

    I'm somewhat sad BeautifulBurnout handed her "feminist" badge in; one feminist less I agree with most of the time (I also like the fact you once wrote annoyed about "the lunatic fringe of men's rights activists" - for most people MRAs *are* the lunatic fringe, so it was nice to see you make that distinction even when angry.) That should be worth a CIF article, too, shouldn't it - "Why I'm no longer a feminist." The claim non-feminist women who oppose sexism are only mislead by mainstream media presentation of feminists would ring extremely hollow in such a case.

    Philippa: Your mishap of yesterday makes one fall in love with you just a little bit more, you're aware of that?

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  4. Morning. Cif appears to be having technical gremlins so I will post here.

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  5. Right. Date? Check. Time-stamp? Check. Other people posting? Check.

    Good. Ahem. Will attempt not to get lost again...

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  6. Morning all,

    BB, regarding our discussion on the Lib Dems yesterday.

    I have to disagree with you that Cable is relatively of the left. On 'Any Questions' last week, he said he wanted to bring in "new measures" to curb Union activity to stop the rail workers going on strike. So for Vince, the Union destroying measures already in place in the corporatocracy known as the UK don't go far enough.

    And of course Cable was forced into an embarassing apology when it was revealed that rather than the Treasury calling him for economic advice with a view to a Chancellorship in a hung Parliament, it was the other way around.

    Additionally, it was notable that Clegg a couple of weeks ago went out his way to compare Lord Ashcroft's tax dodging with the Unite unions activities. Hardly the utterances of a leader trying to make friends with those charged with fighting for workers rights and conditions.

    Clegg is your classic career politician, moving directly into politics after his graduation from University. He was deeply involved in the G24, EU and WTO before his parliamentary career. Hardly the left wing alternative.

    It's indicative of how far right the socio-economic consensus of the mainstream parties has gone when the lib dems are seen as some form of left wing alternative. In my opinion, a vote for the lib dems is a vote for the continuation of the same consensus that has got the UK into the mess it is in.

    thauma, I know it's brave quoting Foucault around here but that's not to say there isn't an importnat kernel of truth underneath the post modernist obscurantism!

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  7. 'S'all right, Duke, I won't tell Jay.

    Re Lib Dems - I keep thinking I'm going to vote for them and then they do something stoooopid. Most recently it was Clegg praising Thatcher. How can you vote for that?

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  9. thauma,

    Re Lib Dems - I keep thinking I'm going to vote for them and then they do something stoooopid. Most recently it was Clegg praising Thatcher. How can you vote for that?

    Exactly. All of the main parties subscribe to the neo-liberal consensus.

    The electorate is asked to choose between Public service Cuts, Public service cuts or Public service cuts.

    The electorate will be given the choice of continuing the war in Afghanistan, continuing the war in Afghanistan or continuing the war in Afghanistan.

    The electorate will be given the choice of no fundamental democratic reform, no fundamental democratic reform or no fundamental democratic reform.

    The electorate will be given the choice of choosing between allowing the hegemony of the Banks to continue, allowing the hegemony of the Banks to continue or allowing the hegemony of the Banks to continue.

    The electorate will be allowed to choose between overseeing the expansion of the biggest gap between rich and poor for generations, overseeing the expansion of the biggest gap between rich and poor for generations or overseeing the expansion of the biggest gap between rich and poor for generations.

    The electorate will be allowed to choose between a Party beholden to Business interests and Donors, a Party beholden to Business interests and Donors or a Party beholden to Business interests and Donors.

    If the post above is repetitive and boring to the point of sleep, it is meant to be. This is the "democratic" choice the electorate of the UK have.

    Exacerbating this is FPTP which actively works against representation at the ballot box and against the smaller parties who do offer an alternative, concentrating all electoral power in 2010 in the hands of 40,000 hinge votes.

    No choice.

    No representative power in your vote.

    No democracy.

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  10. Duke
    It's all so bloody marginal. Whether you view it throught the ghastly lens of personality or actually look at policies. It depends what interview, what politician, what party, what day, what news programme. I loathe what new labour stand for - Mandleson's arrogant epitomy of centralisation, the party's replacing trident, PFI, privatisation... yet the tories are *so* fucking rubbish it's beyond belief, and the Lib Dems still keep failing to deliver. If I was in the Lib Dems I'd top myself they're so shit at scoring in front of an open goal. I swear I'm going to end up voting Green. I just hope it's a hung parliament you know...

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  11. "'S'all right, Duke, I won't tell Jay."

    I saw it Thauma, dont worry. Funnily enough, i read the exact passage Duke quoted only about a fortnight ago as it was part of the materials for an OU essay. It was horrendous, the first, and only, identity politics assisgnment of the module.

    "How have changing understandings of what is natural affected the relationships between certain groups and the policy making process?"

    It was brimming with identity twaddle. And whats worse, i had to engage in identity twadddle myself, the horror of it. Though i did enjoy it in the end, i can see its attraction. Makes you feel all noble and decent, writing strident critiques of the inhuman way the womenz and disabled and blacks have been treated etc, i was full of righteous indignation and smug disdain.

    I also took the opportunity to employ certain choice phrases and words i thought would resonate with the tutor, like "privileging of the masculine", "subservience", "reinforcing social constructs", etc, etc.

    It was painful. First time in the course i have had pen smashing incidents of frustration/irritation. Astonishingly managed a 2.1 for it, so wasnt too bad in the end...

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  12. Your grace - I fear the LibDem equation of "Tory Big Business" with "Labour Big Unions" is nothing more than a populist approach to attract people pissed off at not being able to fly / post letters / use trains / break down in their cars...

    Playing both ends to the middle, which might imply 'centrism', but to me indicates that they're more interested in popularity than principle, whcih is f-ing annoying, as they're the party I usually vote for, and I am cross with them.

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  13. Jay - so in other words, you've sold out to The Man. Compromised all your principles. The shame of it.

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  14. "Makes you feel all noble and decent, writing strident critiques of the inhuman way the womenz and disabled and blacks have been treated etc..."

    Homophobe.

    heheheheh.

    Where's my earlier post?

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  15. Jay, I too know the joys of a righteous feminist rant. Definitely can see how you can get addicted to using that kind of rhetoric.

    I said it once and I'll say it again: Half of the internet's rad fems are moi .

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  16. Jay,

    I'm hearing you, I'm hearing you. I came across his theories on Biopower and Biopolitics via Zizek.

    Foucalt's theories on Biopower and Biopolitics enshrine both the astuteness of analysis and the fundamental failure of postmodernism.

    "Biopower and Biopolitics" is uncanny in it's analysis of state control in 21st Century Britain. The fundamental failure being that it is so wrapped up in postmodernist jargon that the message is lost.

    Bitterweed,

    the last couple of elections I spoilt my ballot paper. To make the point that I made the effort to go to the polling station and to show I cared not a jot for the choice on my ballot paper.

    I know it is the equivalent of trying to create change through the internet for all the good it wll do but at least I made my own miniscule point.

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  17. "The electorate is asked to choose between Public service Cuts, Public service cuts or Public service cuts.

    The electorate will be given the choice of continuing the war in Afghanistan, continuing the war in Afghanistan or continuing the war in Afghanistan......."


    Exactly. And thats why the Graun, Tele and the rest wont be interviewing the party leaders and asking them to defend their support for PFI, privatisation, foreign wars, bank hegemony (going back to my waddya request), despite widespread public opposition to all.

    Firstly, it would be uncomfortable questioning as most people can see quite plainly the venality that underpins it, and secondly it would highlight the absurd situation whereby on huge issues of public interest all 3 parties are united in opposition to the majority public view.

    "So, Dave, lets move on from NI taxes for a moment. Privatisation, PFI, Faith schools, religious exemptions to hate laws - polls show the public overwhelmingly opposes all these things, yet you, Brown and Clegg support all of them wholeheartedly. Could you explain that, firstly, and secondly just explain the democratic choice available to those people who oppose these things (which is actually the majority of the public)?

    They couldnt deny this is the reality, nor its implications for our democratic health, so I'd be really fascinated to hear their responses.

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  18. So Philippa doesnt mind that i left out transpeople, just homosexuals. Hater.

    I did sell out, Thaum, i did indeed. I turned my back on years of resistance to get a reasonable mark. Worked a treat.

    The Foucalt did have some interesting points, yep, but as you say largely buried beneath mountains of the most ostentatious waffle imaginable. So frustrating to work from.

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  19. Duke
    I am very much for ballot papers including the option "None of the above parties represent my interests sufficiently for me to vote for them"

    I'd reckon on a return of 30-40% of the vote given the current outlook.

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  20. The official anthem for the 2010 general election has just been anounced as Peggy Lee's Is that all there is? with an extra fifth verse and chorus:

    (Spoken)
    And then the 2010 election came along. There was Gordon and Dave and Nick and other pepole not being given the chance to speak.
    And they talked about empowerment, and choice, and the economy and change, and all these other nice words.
    But when I looked closely at their words and at their manifestos, I said to myself, "Is that all there is to British democracy?" Is that all there is?"


    (Sung)

    Is that all there is?
    If that's all there is my friends, then let's keep dancing
    Let's break out the booze and have a ball
    If that's all there is.

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  21. "So Philippa doesnt mind that i left out transpeople, just homosexuals. Hater"

    Damnit.

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  22. Ha! But you left out bisexuals!
    (and intersex, asexuals, mosaicism, erm, ...I'll get back to you with more)

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  23. Philippa/Jay

    What about aliens of the 17th gender??!?!?!

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  24. @JayReilly

    For what it,s worth i did the same as you when i was studying for my degree.My marks improved greatly when i
    wrote what i thought they wanted to hear as opposed
    to what i really thought.Ended up with a 2.1 as well.
    Sometimes needs must!

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  25. "Ha! But you left out bisexuals! "

    I thought sex with bison is illegal...

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  26. BW

    "I thought sex with bison is illegal..."

    No, that's buffalo, sex in a basin is ok, but a little uncomfortable.....

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  27. They outlawed buffalo romping??!? When? Thats my summer holiday ruined...

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  28. Jay, where were you when the buffalo rights lot marched on parliament*?


    *Well, 25 miles away actually due to protest and livestock movement regulations.....

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  29. But watch out Jay - seriously, this time - I got great marks for my radfem essays in college because my tutor was, erm, a radfem.

    Sadly the people marking the exams were from a markedly different theoretical persuausion. Cue - Desmond.

    Anyway - does this mean 'Buffalo Stance' was actually a LibDem policy position statement that just got recorded by Neneh Cherry by mistake?

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  30. Your grace some good posts there! TBH I don't think I'll visit the Graun site over the next month - it'll be appalling!

    Agree about a 'none of the above option' - should be there, but I'm torn - do I write that on the ballot paper or do I vote Labour on the grounds that they are (marginally) better than the Tories?

    In one way I want Labour to loose so that there can be some real change in the party see here. In another I am concerned that the Tories will really put the boot in and people will suffer even more.

    Changes in the party that would allow the Labour Representation Committee to actually campaign within the party as we all could in the past would be an important catalyst I think.

    Jay awful how we can be forced to bullshit the bullshitters init?

    Well done for doing it so well though :D !!

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  31. @ annetan, I'd vote for a party that stood by the LRC positions, but and this is an almighty huge fuck-off of a but, there's nobody even that way inclined ever likely to stand in my constituency. What's more, even if one were standing,Well, yeah, but the trouble is that you vote for MPs as individuals, but the national party (which is still predominantly New Lab, overwhelmingly so higher up) will trumpet that as some kind of bleeding mandate or endorsement for them, so you are also shoring up the traitorous New Lab crew.

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  32. Dotterel:

    What about aliens of the 17th gender??!?!?!

    I have just read a book that makes a very convincing case for the notion that there are about 6 000 000 000 human genders.

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  33. medve,

    What book's that?

    The 17 genders thing came out of some CiF related silliness: speculation on my gender when I refused to give it (brief synopsis on my CiF profile page)

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  34. Alisdair -
    'shoring up new lab@

    Thats the problem isn't it? Long term its possibly better to see Labour loose because the party at the grass roots is (which is way to the left of New Lab) more likely to kick the New lab leadership out and begin reforms that turn Labour into a more Socialist party.

    We accept however that a Cameron administration will be very bad for the class (but of course New Lab won't be much better)

    WE need a return to a politics based on principles which are argued for and debated about, not endless spin and policy forums.

    The point is not just getting power, its what you do with it when you get it.

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  35. Your Grace

    You're on good form at the moment - and keeping my spirits up in these gloomy times.

    Being gloomy decided to re-read Rousseau's Social Contract (Penguin 68 edition, trans Maurice Cranston) to cheer myself up. Had forgotten how wonderfully he describes things. Loved this, and it's so apposite:

    What do people gain if their very condition of civil tranquility is one of their hardships? There is peace in dungeons, but is that enough to make dungeons desirable? The Greeks lived in peace in the cave of the Cyclops awaiting their turn to be devoured

    The social Contract also has the virtue of being quite short - don't think I'm up to heavy tomes right now.

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  37. Annetan

    I agree. I sort of decided a while ago that 'the desire for power' corrupts as much as, if not more than, actual 'power'.

    A while back, I sort of half-heartedly/humorously applied for a job with the Lib Dems, and was asked to write how I thought it best for them to proceed as a party.

    I firstly pointed out that, even though I'd googled him twice already while writing, I'd already forgotten what Clegg looked like, you know, just to set the tone and that.

    I also argued that they should provide a legitimate choice/option, not 'peg themselves' to the other two parties.

    i.e, Pick stuff and stick to it, extreme stuff if necessary, not water things down after 'consultation'/market research for fear of alienating some people.

    And more generally, come out all guns blazing.

    Needless to say, didn't get the job!!

    And on the principals issue, in my dissertation, I explored the much derided 'multi-party democracy' thing, specifically here in Latin America, and, guess what, in a system with many smaller, distinct parties sticking to their guns and principals, the overall effect is a lot better than most of us are led to believe.

    So yeah, I think I too would like to see a bit more of that.....

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  38. Paul,

    Sorry you feel that way, but weren't we all talking about the Bidisha thing t'other day, primarily because you brought it up?

    I know I was!!

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  39. Paul

    Like James, I'm sorry you feel that way too - although not aware I've been ignoring you. I sometimes put posts up here that don't get a response - I just assume that people don't want to engage with that particular topic at that time.

    James
    Needless to say, didn't get the job!! Nice try though.

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  40. Paul - what James and Sheff said.

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  41. Paul - thirded.

    sometimes there's politics, sometimes there's tunes, and sometimes there's something in between. much like life.

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  42. Philippa had a sad recent experience herself of posting lots with no response whatsoever, apparently. So it happens to the best of us.

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  43. Thauma, and the worst of us: about 50% of my posts are ignored ;-)

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  45. If you do depart, Paul, I'll be sorry to see you go,because you make many good points (that on hierarchies yesterday was very good, and your warning in that post I think were both wise, and your prognosis sadly true). Neo-liberalism, allied with its outriders consumerism, and divide and rule identity politics have atomised society and I can't see any real attainable remedies.

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  46. p.s. I enjoyed (just to pick a random example) the one the other day about teaching your nephew (?) about Pastafarianism. However I didn't read it until a day or two later, so there didn't seem much point in responding!

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  47. Now even Blogger's ignoring me: where'd my comment go?

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  48. Ah there it is!

    Thauma, I forgot to mention then that not only is he my second cousin, but also my godson!

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  49. Hehehe, that's brilliant! Glad that you are fulfilling your godparently duty.

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  50. Harrumph! - everyone's ignoring my Rousseau post....barbarians the lot of you!

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  51. Sheff, didn't you hear me nodding as I read it?

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  52. thauma

    Shucks, must have missed that....had my nose in the book.

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  53. Yep, the topic arose because his older brother wanted to know what the Darwin fish on the back of my car was!

    Maybe we need a "recommend this comment" feature, so we can massage each others egos without bothering to think of anything to say ;-)

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  54. @ Paul - some guys are posting from work they don't always get time to read every post and respond between keeping an eye open for the boss.

    I doubt it's anything personal, at times we all have posts that get 'overlooked' but by and large it's very friendly here.

    Best W.

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  55. Has anyone else noticed that people with non-Darwin fish on the back of their cars tend to be exceptionally bad drivers? Inattentive and sloooooow.

    Yes, there's not much point in posting "brilliant comment, agree completely". And it's often hard (for me) to think of anything worthwhile to add.

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  56. Thauma:

    brilliant comment, agree completely

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  57. Laters, evil ones - am away on my broomstick.

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  58. Dot

    First I've heard of the Darwin fish but like the idea. not having a car I could stick one on my front door.

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  59. Paul,

    I'll echo the calls for you to stay. I've found myself nodding in agreement with much of what you say, I think we should invent an emoticon which shows us nodding in agreement. I've come up with:

    @(*&()&&**^%$#%@!___"__?***!!

    Admittedly, it's a bit rough round the edges, but if anyone would like to polish it up feel free.

    Please stick around.

    Sheff,

    glad to be of service. It's good to post my electoral frustration here as there's no-one here to discuss it with.

    As for old Jean Jacques, an absolute madman, but a madman with purpose in so many ways. One of his quotes is most apt for 2010 are:

    The English people believes itself to be free; it is gravely mistaken; it is free only during election of members of parliament; as soon as the members are elected, the people is enslaved; it is nothing. In the brief moment of its freedom, the English people makes such a use of that freedom that it deserves to lose it.

    but this one from Franklin D Roosevelt is a beauty:

    An election cannot give a country a firm sense of direction if it has two or more national parties which merely have different names, but are as alike in their principles and aims as two peas in the same pod

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  60. Sheff

    It's been a while since I read 'The Social Contract', and it's now in an attic six thousand miles away from me, but I seem to remember it saying something like (and I'm paraphrasing here):

    If our elected representatives cease to be representative, then it's OK to throw things at 'em, and get a bit revolutionary and that, until they stop being nob-heads, and remember what it is they're supposed to be doing!!

    I could definitely go for a bit of that right about now!!

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  61. Your Grace

    Great quotes - and how i agree. Rousseau may have been mad as a bat but a bit of original, creative madness like his would really liven things up right now and boy, do things need livening up.

    James

    Love the revolutionary fervour - would also love to be throwing a few cabbages at kings too!

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  62. Paul, I read and think about all of your posts. Just because I can think of nothing significant to say about them does not mean that I am ignoring you. Please 'stay' and continue to contribute!

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  63. Canny paraphrase there,James.
    overeignty, for the same reason as makes it inalienable, cannot be represented; it lies essentially in the general will, and will does not admit of representation: it is either the same, or other; there is no intermediate possibility. The deputies of the people, therefore, are not and cannot be its representatives: they are merely its stewards, and can carry through no definitive acts. Every law the people has not ratified in person is null and void -- is, in fact, not a law. The people of England regards itself as free; but it is grossly mistaken; it is free only during the election of members of parliament. As soon as they are elected, slavery overtakes it, and it is nothing. The use it makes of the short moments of liberty it enjoys shows indeed that it deserves to lose them

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  64. Paul - agree with the others I'm often 'ignored' people are just bent on discussing something else.

    And disagreeing, even disagreeing strongly is not an attack. Its just disagreement.

    Don't go - good to read a contrary view sometimes.

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  65. Thaumaturge - I saw my first 'Darwin fish' on the back of a car less than a month ago. I had never noticed anything about the speed of them in general though. I take your word for it.

    The fish is one of the earliest Christian symbols and derives from an acrostic of Ἰησοῦς Χριστὸς, Θεοῦ Υἱὸς, Σωτήρ - Jesus Christ, Son of God, Saviour - ichthus=fish.

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  66. Well spotted Alisdair

    I like this too:

    As soon as public service ceases to be the main concern of the citizens and they come to prefer to serve the state with their purse rather than their person, the state is already close to ruin. Are troops needed to march to war? they pay mercenaries and stay at home. Is it time to go to an assembly? They pay deputies and stay at home. Thanks to laziness and money they end up with soldiers to enslave the country and deputies to sell it.

    In fact you can open the book at virtually any page and find something worth noting.

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  67. Alisdair,

    haha - yeah, can sort of see why he got the book deal, and I didn't now!!

    But, I do remember that bit. I think I used it in an essay about 'direct democracy' or summat like that.

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  68. Also, I'm pretty sure there isn't, but does anybody know for definite, if there's a minimum voter turnout figure, below which the elections are rendered null and void.

    I've always thought that there should be, or at least a law that if it's below a certain point, the word mandate is prohibited from any victory speech.

    In the words of the great Gil Scott Heron:

    Mandate my ass

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  69. Don't think so, James...

    anything below 50% of the registered voters and you're banned from the 'M' word, for me...

    (40% for a womandate. we need the extra help. tee hee)

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  70. Yeah, I didn't think so.

    Should there be, though??

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  71. and what would be the alternative - run it again? could go on for ages.

    I still think the Queen telling them all to sod off and putting the civil service in charge, telling them just to run things, not to come up with any dumb ideas, could be the best approach. worked for belgium.

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  72. James / Philippa

    A curious and instructive word. A 'mandate' is more than a warrant to do things, it is a command to do them and so ought to be specific to make sense. The word has been devalued in recent years in political discourse.

    (Hence 'Maundy' Thursday BTW, from the Gospel for the day, 'Novum mandatum do vobis', 'I give you a new commandement, that you love one another' from John.)

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  74. Philippa

    Haha, yeah, it could go on for ages.

    I'm not really sure what should happen (I think the lack of turnout this year will break records though), but at the very least, it should be the catalyst for major electoral reform.

    Perhaps the civil service thing wouldn't be such a bad idea....

    There's a book (uh-oh, reading recommendation, Philippa), by Jose Saramago, called 'Seeing', where nearly everybody casts a blank ballot, and about all the fun that ensues.

    I read it a while ago, but seems like it might be a good one to re-read during the upcoming 'festivities'....

    Lavartis

    Absolutely. 'Devalued' might even be being a tad kind though....

    ;0)

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  75. Paul

    I'm sorry, but that, for me, is bang out of order!!

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  77. Evening all

    Was just scrolling down and just about to say how much I wanted Paul to stay - and then he goes and posts something as vile as that.

    WTF?!

    Seriously out of order and I for one would transgress the general rules and zap that comment into oblivion if there was a general consensus that it is the right thing to do.

    Re the LibDems - I have clearly not been paying attention because I didn't hear either Cable's or Clegg's diatribes about unions. Also WTF.

    But I still believe they are the least-worst option of the main three, and without a doubt the best option as far as civil rights are concerned.

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  78. Blimey, Paul. I was going to encourage you to stay but I won't bother now.

    Why is it whenever I decide to pop by here someone's going off on one?

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  79. Paul

    The tea here's not very good.

    And I'm no Knight in Armour, shining or otherwise, but I think you crossed a line.

    But yes, perhaps I was being a little presumptuous in thinking that you cared what I thought, so apologies for that.

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  80. Paul - you have completely misread thaum's comment. There was no snide little dig there.

    I seriously think you are having an "internet moment" - it happens from time to time. In other words, you don't trust anything you read or take it at face value.

    Maybe give it a rest for the evening, go and watch some telly and come back tomorrow and see how you feel about things. But you are so wrong about Thaum in so many ways it is not even worth trying to explain it to you.

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  81. Hi All

    WTF-Thirded

    Paul, what was the offending remark? I don't see much to get upset about. I don't often get involved in the dustups, but this one is baffling. Over the top and rude, for me.

    All--Looking like a hung parliament in the UK.Certainly hope it functions better than ours.

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  83. Paul, you are being very nasty and personal and if you have nothing constructive or positive to say then STFU.

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  86. Paul--Thank you for your kind response. Do enjoy the rest of your day.

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  87. Hi All,

    Haven't read through the thread yet since I departed earlier, but the Gil Scott Heron quote caught my eye.

    This is the mister's response (although it's the wrong time of year).

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  88. Boudican

    Haven't been keeping up with Canada of late - are you still in prorogation over there or has Harper deigned to allow parliament to function again?

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  89. Also--Where shall we fuck off to My Lord?

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  90. BB--Parliament resumed duties shortly after the Olympics. For which Harper patted himself on the back! Prick. Not much being done other than the Caneocons deflecting attention away from Afghan detainee torture issues. The other parties have the bit between their teeth, but I suspect very little will come of it. Shameful and embarrassing to many Canadians.

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  91. Sorry to laugh but I can't help it. My son - age 14 - behaves like this too. Seriously.

    "FUCK OFFFF!" at the top of his lungs when he is unhappy about something.

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  92. Well of course Harper is going to take credit for the olympics even if it had jack shit to do with anything he did. Moron.

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  93. I think that's the first time I've ever been called a cunt - even if it was collectively - oh well, at least I'm in good company...

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  94. I wonder what the collective noun is for "cunt". You have a murder of crows, a parliament of owls... any ideas?

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  95. I may be a 'pseudo intellectual neo marxist'

    But at least I am not an attention seeking four year old.

    Paul - GROW UP! In the real world people can disagree without being abusive.

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  96. BB and Boudican,

    I was going to put a link to an online game where you can shoot tar at Harper, but it doesn't seem to working anymore.

    Still, it's the thought that counts, innit!?

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  97. oh, no, wait, it is now...

    http://www.tarsandswatch.org/tar-nation-play-game-now

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  99. He behaves a great deal better than you do, Paul.

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  100. Paul, you're haemorrhaging whatever shreds of cerdibility you had left. Go away.

    BB - a conclave of cunts?

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  101. Wouldn't a parliament of cunts be better....???

    Boom!!

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  102. Paul,

    you said earlier and I quote:

    This isn,t an attention seeking hissy fit on my part.It is after all a fact of life that some 'relationships' are just not meant to be.So i bid you all adieu and hope you find whatever it is you are all looking for.

    After which, every person gave you positive feedback, asking you to stay and genuinely appreciating your previous comments.

    With your torrent of abuse now you are either:

    1. Genuinely upset about something and are taking it out on undeserving people here

    or

    2. Deliberately trolling.

    If it is the first, I hope you'll feel better soon, but at the moment it is better that you take advice from your own quote from earlier and switch off from here, and I say that with the greatest respect.

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  103. Good point, James!

    How about a cauldron of cunts?

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  104. shaz--A 'crotch' of cunts?

    James, thanks for that. Some of us might like to shoot more harmful ammo at him.

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  105. Changing the subject completely now - I heard a trailer for a R4 programme that might be on tomorrow night - didn't take notice of the time - called Freed Radicals about how some of the first people to be convicted of terrorist offences are likely to be released on licence shortly.

    Just how are they going to be able to integrate anywhere at all after being banged up? I never even thought about it before until I heard the trailer.

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  106. Boudican - I'm going to stop after this one, but a 'clutch' of cunts?

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  107. BB - are these people who've been locked up in the UK?

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  108. Yes! Hang on, I will see if I can find a link to it...

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  109. Tuesday night, not tomorrow night. Worth listening to, I reckon.

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  110. Thanks for the link. Definitely worth listening to.

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  111. BB - Not sure what happened to my last post saying thanks for the link, so thanks for the link. Definitely worth listening to.

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  112. There is a definite Pluckiness about UT these days with comments disappearing and reappearing.... we are doomed! Doomed, I tells ya!

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  113. Hi all

    Not read comments yet - been thinking about Emily's project.

    Another nasty day on Cif - the Roma thread in particular.

    Several people on waddya suggesting spoiling ballot papers - protest. someone asked the minimum percentage vote needed to make election valid. Anyone here know the answer ?

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  114. Hi leni

    Haven't even looked at the roma thread yet... the immigration one is bad enough. Sigh.

    I have no idea what the minimum percentage would be, or indeed if there is one.

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  115. Leni,

    Funnily enough, I asked that earlier one.

    General consensus is that there isn't one!!

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  116. Well, I say general consensus - Philippa sed so!!

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  118. earlier on. not earlier one.

    (If anyone's ever wondered if bejeweled blitz on facebook makes you stupid, the answer, it seems, is yes!!)

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  119. Paul

    @James Dixon-you,re a wanker mate.

    Yes, you said that earlier on. Thanks.

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  120. So no point in joining the 'spoil the ballot ' campaign then.

    i am still waiting for some indication that there is anyone asking for our vote who has the least idea of what is going on let alone what to do about the mess we're in.

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  121. Paul - 'i ain,t got a clue who the fuck you are'
    Don't call me 'love' then, you patronising git.

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  122. James

    t may have been your comment on waddya I saw - did a quick flip through to catch up - the idea quite took my fancy. too few votes might have made them do some rethinks. I cannot decide what to do - our current mp is a waste of time. We have the additional option of Plaid here .

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  123. Leni,

    I doubt it, I'm not playing out on waddya anymore.
    I asked it upthread here a few hours ago, 'cause I was wondering about it too.

    Last time I voted, I wrote something like 'you all suck bum', or something equally mature, but obviously that wouldn't have been 'officially registered' (although I'd have loved it if that was written on the record somewhere...), and I would have just got lumped in with 'the numpties who can't draw a cross properly' statistics.

    I do really think we'll see a record low turnout this time, and I personally would like there to be a minimum voter turnout for the election to count!!

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  124. Dave Cameron thread up - and it isn't premodded! \o/

    Just had a little pop myself, but now I need to get to bed. Nighty night everyone xx

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  125. I don't think I can face Cameron - there is something so 'nothing ' about him. I can't quite put my finger on it - it is something deeper than lacking in personality. I suspect he is afraid to say what he really thinks so basically says nothing. Perhaps I misjudge him ?

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  126. Leni,

    it's the banality of evil.Pure and simple.And I would put my house on the fact that article is written by a central office twonk and no him.

    Paul,

    what admission? The only reason I never got involved the other night is because I was in the pub. I posted the following day after having read the thread. So 'fuckwit' yes, 'hypocrite' not guilty.

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  127. Hi Again All--I feel honored to be included in the UT fuckwits/wankers club, Western hemisphere subsection. May have to get the T-shirt.

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  128. Hi Boudican

    The ebb and flow of membership is rather odd. Can't quite get my head around it.

    I'm a splinterposophist - I don't attach to any one group exclusively - my problem seems to be I like people in all their diversity. Not to say I would accompany a sack and pillage expedition obviosly but differing views interest me - even if I disagree with them.

    Heyho - we're a funny lot aren't we ?

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  129. Hiya very nearly all,
    Boudican:
    "Also--Where shall we fuck off to My Lord?"
    Made me laugh when I was getting more and more angry. Thank you, pal!

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  130. Hi Habib and Leni--It's in my nature to make light of uncomfortable situations. Levity can help get us to dialogue and friendship. Doesn't always work, but it's better than a stream of vitriol.

    Back in the salt mine tonight Habib?

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  131. No, just waking up at home, very slowly. Liverpool won, United lost, so am happy. Sorry if you're a United fan...

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  133. Evening

    Am I the only one Paul hasn't slagged off tonight, oh and Habib of course. Where on earth did that tantrum hail from? and he promised no hissy fits too. Hey ho, thank you and goodnight Paul.

    Boudican

    I like 'crotch of cunts' - happy to be party to that.

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  135. oops, my turn now, lucky old me, wouldn't want to be left out.

    You really are going to have to do better than this Paul. My 2 year old grandaughter has more interesting tantrums and a more creative grasp of the language.

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  138. Paul

    Water off a ducks back Paul...there is nothing you can say that will offend me as i don't choose to take you seriously. Rant away all night if you feel like it...it makes absolutely no difference to me.

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  140. Habib--Must admit I am a United fan, (met Denis Law when I was a boy, his brother Charlie worked with my dad.) and don't much like Liverpool, though not as religious about it as some. Can you forgive me? (-: --My real religion is the Boston Red Sox.

    Paul, I don't give a shit what colour you are. Carry on with your diatrebe.

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  141. Oh and hi sheff, you're in it with the rest of us. Congrats, your card and badge are in the mail.

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  143. Oops, Boudican - sorry about the anti United thing. Pretty much all of my family are United fans, I just stuck with the team I grew up with when we lived in Liverpool. A matter of honour, for me.

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  145. No sweat Habib, some of my best friends are for the Pool. We get along well despite that. What is your take on Rafa?

    Paul--Thanks for your kind words.

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  146. Boudican, Rafa has done more in five years than United's manager did in his first five. I stand by him, as most Liverpool fans do.

    Anyway time for a song? Dedicated to angry people.

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  149. True Habib, but are you happy with him?

    Paul--Don't do carnivals, but I do certainly do spliffs. Some of the finest Ganja in the world is grown here. As for PC, I don't subscribe to that shit, I'll say what I think. What's wrong with Bob Marley in this context? Went to see his last performance in Vancouver. Didn't agree with some of his views, but so what, the man could move you.

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  153. Paul--Pay attention, I live on the west coast of Canada. That would make it sunset. That is if the fucker was out today.

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  155. morning / evening all,

    just checking in after and between a load of work and i can see that i must answer Dotterel from hundreds of earlier posts:


    What about aliens of the 17th gender??!?!?!

    I have just read a book that makes a very convincing case for the notion that there are about 6 000 000 000 human genders.

    medve,

    What book's that?



    The book is

    sperm are from men
    eggs are from women

    The Real Reason Men and Women are Different

    by Joe Quirk

    he stated that he has a website in the book off to look into it.

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  157. Boudican - Yeah I'm happy with Rafa, I just plain like him.

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  159. Dotterel:

    Joe Quirk's website

    He says somewhere in the book that he is 73 years old, but at least that bit does not make sense (also judging by his picture).

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  160. Sad times for some. My heart goes out to them. I hope they stop feeling anger and find something more worthwhile in themselves. The same goes for me.

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