10 January 2011


If you think of yourselves as helpless and ineffectual, it is certain that you will create a despotic government to be your master.  The wise despot, therefore, maintains among his subjects a popular sense that they are helpless and ineffectual.
-Frank Herbert


  1. I've put the Intense Debate commenting system back up on UT2. Please play with it, make comments, etc. to see if it's reliable. Maybe paste a large comment that you might make here over there, too, so we can see if we lose fewer comments.

    I didn't enable the YouTube embedding for now, but you can embed photos from Flickr, Picasa, etc.


    Don't tempt me. If I could figure out a way of getting permission to be there legally, I'd be gone in a heartbeat.

  2. Hi All

    Montana, if you sneak in to the UK illegally the benefits are better. According to some. (-:

    BTH--Some fine music you offered this AM. Had heard Travis before but not the others. Thanks.

    MsChin--Have to agree with Bitey re visiting/seeing the US. A huge spectacular country with many interesting areas. I do not agree with many of their government's policies ( domestic or foreign ) but wouldn't write off the whole place.

  3. Wampeters, foma and granfalloons.

  4. morning all - Montana, my contribution to the intense debate is slightly hamstrung by the fact that I don't get a comment box appearing over there. Have clicked on the headline and everything. Not sure if that's 'me' or 'it' causing the problem...

  5. ooh, hang on, it works if i 'open in new window', but not 'open in new tab'. will try again...

  6. Happy Birthday Philippa! (Almost forgot.)

  7. Is it your birthday Philippa? Have a wonderful day!

  8. Thank you! Had a lovely weekend but need to work today (bleah) but am getting dinner out of it this evening, and have had nice presents, so all good...

    plus, anyone who watched Leicester v Man City yesterday - we finished up in a 5-2-2-1 formation, yes? FFS, etc...

  9. Does anyone know anything about privacy and data collection? If I haven't had a response to my emails to the mod team at Guardian central by the end of play tomorrow, I want to ask them to delete my account completely. However, I've heard tell that others have had difficulty convincing them to do this. Does anyone know whether I have the 'right' to get them to delete the account?

  10. My inability to rant freely on the monarchy thread is really starting to chafe.

  11. Meerkat - yes you do, but they are useless at doing it (surprise surprise). Swifty struggled for ages, only when he CCd in Natalie was anything done.

    Seems the iron law of CiF - emailing the mods, about anything, is a waste of time. I dont know how much they get paid, or whose kids, nieces and nephews they are, but it still staggers me that you could work for a company and simply refuse to respond to emails. I have never worked anywhere where this would be tolerated.

  12. 9 visitors from Hong Kong? How many Bitey's are there???

    Morning all..... fell briefly (but not spectacularly) off the wagon on Saturday but got back on right away. Feeling much more, ermmm... level now. That first week of not drinking is hideous.


    Was curious about the orchestra.....


    Did you have a champagne breakfast?

  14. larit - have to go to work in about half an hour, so that would have been a foolish idea...coffee and cigarettes, as per...

    meerkatjie - think that while you can get them to delete the account, you can't get them to delete comments (other than those already zapped by the mods team) as the T&C of the site give ownership of the comments to the G. So your comments would still appear in threads but if people click on you 'handle', they get 'no account'. this could explain why they are a bit tardy on deleting accounts, as it doesn't actually remove the underlying comments, so they might think 'what's the point?'

  15. Did anyone see the Groin on Sat?

    They've dragged up that revolting, interminable self-publicist and all-round, over-privileged, twit Emma Forrest out of the cupboard. I actually wanted to vomit when I read the article.... it reads.... "at 16 she was a top music journalist" no she wasn't, she was a public-school educated, Hampstead, toff who ingratiated herself into parts of the music biz by attaching herself to various bands in the early 90's and ligging for all she was worth.

    JayR: if you think Laurie Penny's bad.... DON'T read the article.

  16. Phillippa:

    Awww.... thought you might have had the day off to lounge around like Lady Betram ;0

  17. I've tried emailing Ms Hanman now, Jay. Thanks, I hadn't considered that before. I've pasted my correspondence with them to date below - none of it has been responded to. And on that note, I'll stop whining about it! I'm just finding the rude lack of response to a query about what was clearly a very petty act a bit frustrating. I'm sure I'll get over it soon!
    Dear Ms Hanman

    I'm sorry to trouble you with this, as I'm sure you have more important things to deal with, but I don't seem to be getting any kind of response from your moderation team, and with Jessica being off ill, I'm not sure who else to speak to.

    I wondered if you could perhaps explain why I've been placed in premod, which rules I've broken (how am I supposed to avoid it in future, given that I didn't actually violate any rules in the first place, if no-one explains to me exactly why I'm in premod?), and how long this state is likely to persist?

    Kind regards


    (The deleted post that resulted in me being placed in premod was a comment on the usefulness of premod as a tool of moderation per se. It was measured and polite, and I remain convinced it did not break any rules whatsoever.)

    ----- Forwarded Message ----
    From: Meer Katjie
    To: cif.moderation@guardian.co.uk; jessica.reed@guardian.co.uk
    Sent: Fri, 7 January, 2011 22:32:25
    Subject: Re: Premod?

    Dear mods

    I see you're taking a little while getting back to me on this one, so to help you along I've pasted the community guidelines below. Could you please indicate which of the guidelines below I infringed. I don't think suggesting that premod is an unhelpful tool of moderation, and that it's easy enough to simply remove an offensive post, in fact contravenes your guidelines.

    In the post you removed, prior to placing me in premod, I did not engage in personal attack, I did not misrepresent your journalists. I did not engage in an offensive post. I did not flame. I did not engage in hate speech. I did not place you in legal jeopardy. I did not spam. My post was on topic and in keeping with the spirit of the thread (one might even say it was a recommendation of sorts!). The post was constructive.

    I would appreciate some kind of response. As it stands, I'm afraid this particular act of moderation looks just a little bit like it's a petty kind of one-upmanship - that I have been placed in premod simply for suggesting that premod is an unhelpful tool. Surely this isn't the case? Perhaps someone simply accidentally put me in premod, a slip of the edit finger, perhaps?

    Interestingly, you'll find that the whaddya regulars are rather baffled by this action too.


    From: Meer Katjie
    To: cif.moderation@guardian.co.uk; jessica reed
    Sent: Fri, 7 January, 2011 20:43:08
    Subject: Premod?

    I would very much appreciate a coherent explanation as to why I am now in premod.

    To my knowledge I have not violated the terms and conditions. If you have placed me in premod simply for pointing out that I thought premod was an unnecessary aspect of moderation, then I believe this decision is beyond childish.

    Incidentally, I've had next to no posts removed since joining the site, so to accelarate straight to premod for something so ridiculously trivial is, I believe, quite preposterous.


  18. Bitey -

    my 'Labour Party' socialism ??????

    Don't think the party would agree, as i have said LP isn't socialist but has always had socialists in it.

    The influence of socialists in the party varies - not very significant at the mo I've got to admit. The people who really wrecked the party in the 80's are the politically correct identity politics brigade, the influence of Militant was exaggerated and I should know ;)

    But a lot of the members at grass roots level are working class and here in Wales its actually increasing...

  19. @La Rit - I don't think I've seen the word 'ligging' used since I gave up reading the Melody Maker in about 1996. What is it about the Guardian and giving talentless teenage music journalists a chance to redeem their writing careers?

    Just in case anyone has low blood pressure today, Tebbit's written an article for CiF and Diane Abbott's gone BTL. Almost a perfect hypertensive storm chez Benulek.

  20. @LaRit

    I thought I should help protect Jay by reading the Emma Forrest piece and giving my considered verdict.

    Holy shit.

    Jay, don't read that article.

  21. Benulek:

    Ahhh.... 'liggers' how we hated them! Me and my younger sister and our school mate, spent many years on and off, from our teenage years, hitching around the country with little money, following various bands around, because we loved them, not because we were trying to launch our 'writing careers'.

    I have and have had many mates in the music biz over the years and I had the misfortune to have to suffer the irritating presence of Ms (no talent except for self-promotion) Forrest, when she muscled her way into the Manic's inner sanctum in the early 90's. She was an annoying little prig then and judging by her self-indulgent diatribe dropping huge hints about her 'film-star' boyfriend and her 'mental health' issues, she's not changed one jot. And the Guardian indulges this woman?

    It's beyond parody.

  22. PeterJ:

    Yes. Don't let Jay read it - he'll bust a blood vessel ;)

    I think the last time she wrote an 'article' for the Guardian was I think about 10 years ago. Vacuous trash about the pressure of being a Jewish woman and feeling compelled to dye ones hair blonde.

    Not really the on the same scale as applying dangerous skin bleaches if you're Black and desperately trying to be more 'acceptable' to White Society.

    I seem to remember that there was absolute outrage in the letters about giving space to such utter tripe in a 'serious' newspaper. They must think we've got short memories....

  23. I wasnt going to read it, PeterJ, but having seen your reaction - I'm going to have to have a read of it on my lunch.

  24. Shall I cover the walls in plastic sheeting, Jay?

  25. @LaRit - someone once associated with the Manics who drops heavy hints about 'mental health issues' and poses unsmilingly for the camera...it's almost as if there's a behavioural template.

  26. No need, Benulek, i am finding it hard to get too worked up about CiF these days, other than gasping at the sheer inadequacy of the place and their utter failure to engage seriously with what is happening in the country right now. They seem to be trying to cling to their pre-crash model of endless identity nonsense peddled by halfwitted, cretinous liberals.

  27. Wasn't Emma Forrest also Julie Burchill,s 'new best friend' at one stage?.

    @Happy Birthday Philippa!

  28. Anyone got a link for this offending article?

  29. @LaRit

    I fear Ms Forrest's oeuvre is more extensive than you imply. Full listing here.

  30. It's the top one in that link I just gave, Jay.

  31. Thanks for the suggestion of mailing Ms Hanman, Jay. That seems to have done the trick.

  32. Beneluk:

    It's all a 'pose'. Even the descriptions of 'mental health' problems don't ring true. She alludes to being: bullimic, anorexic, suicidal (from the age of 9?) a self-harmer, bi-polar.... etc.etc. I don't think she'd know a mental health problem if it smacked her in the face.

    Seems like 10 years navel-gazing in LA and New York with a very expensive therapist failed to point out the fact the reasons for all her 'ills' (real and imaginary) are that she's just not that clever or talented and the only reason she's published at all is because Mummy and Daddy have friends in high places.


    Yes, she was La Burchill's NBF, it was a relationship of mutual sychophancy, where we, the poor reader, were subjected to yet more vacuous articles licking each others' arses in public. Bleeeuuuchhhh...

  33. peterJ:

    Ahhhh... that means I've successfully avoided her for quite some time then!

  34. Its just typical vacuous nonsense. Probably only slightly notable by the extreme narcissism on display, but other than that seemed fairly standard Graun drivel to me.

  35. @PeterJ

    Thanks for the link to the EF article.I think 'Holy Shit' is just about the right response to it!

  36. Happy Birthday Philippa!

    Jesus Haploid Christ! I'm almost certain there are many people out there for whom a swift kick up the backside and to be told "pull yourself together" would work a 1000 times better than being validated by "therapy"*. I almost as certain that Emma Forrest is one of them.

    *I'm also sure there are many who genuinely need it.

  37. Happy Birthday to The Pipster!!!

    Hope it's a really, really good one. With lots of, erm, cake!?

    (If you like cake, obviously. If not, hope there's lots of whatever it is you do like! (But surely everyone likes cake though, right...??))

    Anyways, all the best,


  38. Oh and Phillipa have you heard the rumours about the possibility of Beckham being loaned to Spurs? Dunno whether to laugh or cry!

  39. Thanks Bitterweed for the Marshall-kicking clip - excellent. Bad Moon Rising projection? Nope - I find it's more a bad reception misalignment: as Eric once told us

    And thanks BTH for for tord gustavsen trio - now that's serious nut-scratchimg music - although having said that I've had 'where breathing starts' playing in the background all day without once scratching.

  40. Ah, Dott :)

    You know, having had close experience with people with real, serious and devastating mental health problems and having suffered myself, the article made me very angry indeed.

    The premise behind it being, "anything to make a buck". Like Kerry Katona appearing on Dancing on Ice.

    btw - what's your take on all the birds dropping out of the skies? It made me so sad.

  41. Beckham on loan to Spurs; oh dear, me thinks Harry has lost the plot!

    BTW: happy birthday Phillipa

  42. now having lulled you into a false sense of security ...

    can I ask how music works for you both (B&B) - is it the immediacy of being there? (BTH you mention going to these jazz gigs, and I know Bitters that you are a performer)

    It's interesting because we're communicating via music as a shorthand for understanding - so how does this work as both a solitary and collective way of communicating?

    which begs the next question about collective action and solitary blogging

    ok - I'll leave you with that and this

  43. Another one bites the dust on "Wadya"!

    And here is some more from STC

    You should be thoroughly ashamed of yourselves. Why don't you lot just collectively write a letter to Jessica and tell her which posters you want on CIF and then you can have your own little happy-clappy club.

    Honestly, it really is a new low for this thread.

  44. La Rit,

    Agree it's sad, other than that I reserve judgement on what caused it until/unless there's some peer reviewed stuff out (i.e. scientific papers). I know how the rumour mill works: scientist speculates "Y might be linked to X", media shouts "X causes Y", happens all the time!

  45. At the risk of over-reaching, I'm officially extending my 'works as a punchline to nearly every joke' rule to also cover any and all unexplained phenomena!!

    So, why are birds falling out of the sky?

    Because Tony Blair's a cunt!!

    I think you'll find, that until modern science catches up, that's as good an explanation as any......

  46. Who bit the dust, Chekhov?

    Torieboy's just trying to get a few people to say 'come back, STC, we love you', and have an unwarranted dig at lefties, all while trying to convince us that Conservatives are a victimised minority.

    It's kind of funny, if you look at it the right way. I was amused when he identified Ally as a ringleader in the 'being rude to tories' thing. Ally??? Seriously???

  47. "So, why are birds falling out of the sky?

    Because Tony Blair's a cunt!!"

    I think the logic is indisputable. Mind you, I think there's perhaps a list of twats to add the formula for a truly scientific explanation.

  48. Fair, and I've left room for other people to be involved too, as and when appropriate.

    (I was really going for one of those 'grand, unifying theory of everything' type whatsits that sciencey people are always after!

    In that respect, I don't think it can be beaten!!)

  49. @Meerkatjie: I dunno who it was. Does it matter? It was the general feeling of resigned despair I identified with.

    BTW: I thought you were attempting to get yourself "excommunicated" from "wadya", or were you just asking to be let off the naughty step?

  50. afternoon all...

    tanti auguri a te philippa!!!!

    blimey I think i want to be sick....that trite of Emma Forest is one of the worst pieces of "prose" i've seen in a long time.......jesus wept.....

  51. {Slaps self on forehead}

    Happy birthday, Philippa!!!

    I wasn't intending to slight you -- just half asleep when I put up the thread, I guess.

  52. Hi Chekhov, No, I wasn't seeking excommunication - I was asking someone over there to acknowledge that I shouldn't have been put on the naughty step to start with, given that I hadn't actually done anything other than query the value of premod. But nobody was replying to my email, so I was at that point thinking 'how rude' and toying with getting my account closed.

    I am struck by the contempt with which the editorial team seem to hold members of that community though. As if they are somehow doing us a favour by letting us post on their little site. One does have to wonder quite who they think pays their salaries...

  53. "I am struck by the contempt with which the editorial team seem to hold members of that community though."

    Yep, that just about sums it up.

    As I've mentioned before, that's the reason why this site exists!

  54. .
    parallaxview said...

    now having lulled you into a false sense of security ...

    can I ask how music works for you both (B&B) - is it the immediacy of being there? (BTH you mention going to these jazz gigs, and I know Bitters that you are a performer)

    Yes the immediacy and because the sound is so much different live however good the sound system you've got at home. Having said that my impression of much rock music is that it's performers try to get their live performances to sound identical to their recorded versions.

    You say:

    It's interesting because we're communicating via music as a shorthand for understanding - so how does this work as both a solitary and collective way of communicating?

    Not sure I understand this point but I'm often promted when people say they "don't like jazz", to prove they're wrong by finding something they like.

    Here for example is American saxophonist Chris Potter performing live. I think he is brilliant but I have friends who'd call this tuneless screeching and wailing. But then they're stuck in a late 50s early sixtes rock and roll and pop, time warp as far as music is concerned.

  55. I don't enjoy jazz recordings (except perhaps old style jazz). I do enjoy live jazz. I think that's the point of jazz really - to be there, to be taken in by the sound and energy and incredible skill and creativity of it.

  56. I'll endorse your theory James and I have a PhD in bird behaviour!

  57. Cheers Dott!!

    (is it ok if I leave you to sort out all the numbers, equations and squiggly line type stuff, then? (I'm more of an ideas man, me!)).

  58. Only if I can have first authorship on the paper,

    Dixon & Dott sounds a bit dodgy anyway....

  59. Also, for those of you using an actual computer, what's capable of doing more than one thing at once, and who are also looking at The Groan, how's that tresspass thingy going??

  60. Kushi Jumum-din PhilippaB!

    All the best flower : )

    TX xxx

  61. Well Dott, my publishing name's actually Cross, so yours then mine works quite well, I reckon!!


  62. Jazz is a great genre!

    and when mixed with funk properly like this .

  63. "opera is this horrible music with blokes and women singing in foreign"

    Can someone explain to me why I share a home with this man? He's also equating opera with hip hop....

    (Just accidentally stuck this on whaddya by mistake! It was supposed to follow on from Tim's jazz comment!)

  64. Ok JD how does this sound:

    Dott, C.M. and Cross, J. (2011) Dotting the Is and Crossing the Ts: demonstrating empirically that avian misfortune is caused by the similarity of former world leaders to female anatomy. Journal of the Bleedin' Obvious 10 213-255?

  65. I'm afraid, Meerkatjie, that pretty much sums up my opinion on opera too.

    I'd also probably add, that it's The Shakespeare of the music world too!!

  66. Haha Dot!!


    (For future reference, and to pre-empt the inevitable, roughly how long does a Nobel acceptance speech need to be??)

  67. JD

    X = (A x B)/C + 1


    X = Length of speech (in minutes)

    A = Size of your ego (in Blairs)

    B= Alcohol content of wine at presentation ceremony (in %)

    C = Number of sober people at the ceremony

  68. Sorry, that should be nanoBlairs, whoops, what a mistake!

  69. Right, I make that 186.4 minutes. Give or take (and assuming their idea of a classy table wine corresponds with my own views, i.e, Liebfraumilch)

    And, given that my 'thank yous' (Friends, family members who still talk to me, successful relationships etc) have taken up exactly 12 seconds, that's going to give me just about enough time for my 'fuck yous'.

    This science thing's brilliant, innit!?

  70. This comment has been removed by the author.

  71. It's good of Jack Straw to give a nice veneer of respectability to enable this kind of repulsive race hate from the BNP

    Our children are not halaal meat

    This has made me feel physically sick.

  72. Meerkatjie

    Are you able to give a brief synopsis for those of us worried about clicking on BNP links at work?

  73. @MK

    Fuck me, that is foul!


    It's basically a long outpouring saying how Nick Griffin was right all along about gangs of Muslim paedophiles all over the country grooming 12-year-old white girls and gangbanging them. The key buzz-phrase is "Muslim Paedophile Gangs" (with proper-noun capitals).

  74. Dott, it's basically just repeating the view that Muslim men are forming predatory gangs to prey on young white girls. It's claiming 'thousands of girls' have been affected.

    The halaal meat thing was the bit that really turned my stomach.

    It's very icky.

  75. The BNP - the party who's readers I most associate with the Daily Sport, producing a leaflet like that.... incredible.

  76. I expect it of the BNP. But they produced that leaflet almost on the same day that Jack Straw legitimated their point of view with his own particular form of anti-islamic prejudice.

  77. @Meerkatjie

    I disagree that what Straw said was anti-Islamic prejudice. The use that the BNP makes of it is its own sordid problem.

  78. I see the world continues to turn in own inimitable way

    Mass shooting in US..

    Jack Straw raises a legitimate subject - then manages to de-legitimise in one easy sentence...

    Undercover plod exposed amongst environmental activists -CPS fail to reveal evidence - trial collapses...

    BNP produces revolting leaflet...

    Hardly worth getting out of bed...except of course it's Phillipa's birthday. Happy b'day Phillipa!

  79. How was it not, Peter? There's no real evidence that the high profile gang was specifically seeking out white girls - which is essentially what Straw's claimed. If you look at the racial profiles of the victims, they almost perfectly match the demographics of the UK population.

    These men preyed on young girls, on vulnerable girls. But to suggest this is an issue of Pakistani men preying on white girls seems profoundly ill advised.

    "But there is a specific problem which involves Pakistani heritage men...who target vulnerable young white girls."

    "We need to get the Pakistani community to think much more clearly about why this is going on and to be more open about the problems that are leading to a number of Pakistani heritage men thinking it is OK to target white girls in this way."

    He acknowledges at the beginning of his comments that actually Pakistani men are not overrepresented in the prison population. An analysis of female victims suggests white girls aren't overrepresented.

    How is this unproblemmatic?

    You're right though, his comments are about Pakistani men, so I guess they should be labelled as racist, rather than anti-Islamic?

  80. Just thought I'd draw attention to this article.... about the library cuts. Lots of really good links in the comments. Just fucked up and lost my comment.... so posting the link here if anyone is interested.

    Libraries seen as easy touch when it comes to balancing the books

  81. Oh, in the unlikely event anyone's still interested, I just got an email from the mods at Guardian Central, apologising and indicating my account had been placed in premod 'in error'. So they accidentally deleted my completely unproblemmatic post, then placed me in premod for it all entirely accidentally. I guess at least they apologised.

  82. LaRit, gah, it makes depressing reading, the library thing.

    I can't seem to find out how these cuts will affect music libraries. Do you have any idea? Community choirs and orchestras are so reliant on them....

  83. LOL @Dot re speech length formula - but if

    C = Number of sober people at the ceremony

    Then the length of the speech would infinite! Given that infinity +1 is still infinity

    Have a heart!

  84. aw, bless you all!

    yes, james, there was cake. lots of cake. remaining cake has been taken into work and that was very successful. ggoingg out for dinner soon. moim moim. heheheheh.

    larit's mention of 'ligging' also reminded me of melody make, who had, I'm pretty sure, a column written by the 'gig leopard' who could lig with the best of them and took the piss mercilessly out of the whole new-wave-of-new-mod scene...

    i did once step over a member of menswear lying prone on the floor to reach the pool table in the mixer. believe he now works in IT. ah well.

  85. Evening all

    Joyeux Anniversaire, Philippa! Lots of hugs xx

    Just got in so I am off to browse...

  86. Montana

    I think it's really disgusting the way Thaumaturge is always bringing that poor dog of hers into things here to play the victim card. I only hope that Saoirse isn't too traumatised by it.

    Watch it, Wildhack; that's now a shiny new entry in my database. In three years' time it will be used against you to devastating effect.

  87. Merrkatjie:

    I couldn't believe that article had been up since 7 Jan and only had 8 comments. Completely troll free though ;)

    I think re: the Music Libraries in London.... Barbican is in City of London and probably protected by close association with the GSMD, Westminster Music Library too is in Tory Heartland .... naturally, they have all the money in the world to lavish on their libraries.

  88. james

    what a jaffa? or a bit of battenburg???

  89. Jaffa??, it's a fucking bisc.......

    Hang on a minute..... I know your game, you're trying to waddyafication me aren't you, you cheeky monkey!! Ain't falling for that one!!

    (I'd proper go for a slice of Jamaican Ginger though, if you're offering...)

  90. James, make a choice - you can have cake or a song... but you can't have your cake and Edith.

    Happy Birthday, Philibee x

  91. Haha, well played young padawan!!

    (Funnily enough, I was listening to that earlier on!!)

  92. jamaican ginger..........mmmmmm.........now we're talking.......

  93. Star Wars references are still cool, like with the kidz and that, right....??

  94. Yeah, I did bring one back once, Gandolfo, but, it didn't do too well with the humidity.

    Still, a big sticky ball of Jamaican Ginger cake is better than nothing, I suppose!!

  95. jamaican ginger with hot ambrosia custard on it... mmmmmmmm....

  96. Custard?? Fucking Custard!!??

    I'm going to pretend you didn't just say that, BB!!


    Right, I'm declaring a moratorium on cake type talk now!! Not least because it's making me want to cry!!

  97. Soz James. Heartless of me. I remember how I used to pine for a tin of Birds custard powder when I lived in France...

  98. Evening all.

    *Look away James*
    Just having a slice of Xmas cake here, home-made one, a pressie from my friend's daughter.

  99. I'm rather fond of Jelly and Ice Cream and or cream for Birthdays... in fact, I had a craving to make a Knickerbocker Glory t'other day... good job it stayed as a craving only!

    As for sponge and custard - at school we used to have choc sponge with choc custard, or choc spnge with... mint custard, think I was the only kid who enjoyed it!

  100. James,
    "Star Wars references are still cool, like with the kidz and that, right....??"
    I have no idea, I'm afraid.

    Padawalla would roughly translate in Punjabi as fart maker, though.

    Also, sorry to lower myself further in your estimation, but I, too was thinking of Jamaican ginger cake with hot custard. What do you go for, syrup, rum, brandy cream?

  101. I eat my Jamaican Ginger cake, au naturale, Habib.

    And I put cream on it!!


    (Again, I'm here all week folks!!)

  102. james

    steamed sponge pudding with golden syrup....yum.......

    all week.....!!!!??????

    everyone get the valium out........it's not looking good.......

  103. jeeze the graun is really going down the tabloid trail.......

    "Interactive illustration: Gabrielle Giffords's injury explained"

  104. Ouch!!

    You'd do well to remember, Gandolfo, that I know people in your neck of the woods!!

    (*Best Joe Pesci voice*: "You think I'm not funny!? Not funny how..?".)


  105. (My above in reply to the 20:53 post)!!

  106. he he james be nice i know people here who know people there in big B......

    only joking...well sort of! I'm just jealous of your nobel nomination with dot....

  107. Awww bollocks, my above was in reply to the 20:49 one. (Probably time to eat something!)

    Gandolfo, them's the breaks!! Some of us, we're just good with all the brainy, sciencey-thingummies and that, innit!?


    right, off to re-adjust blood sugar levels. In a bit folks...

  108. James
    "I eat my Jamaican Ginger cake, au naturale, Habib.
    And I put cream on it!!"

    Stage dir left: Runs, screaming.

  109. You lot are in for some serious cyber 'licks' from our Mr Scorpio when he sees the 'cake theme' of tonights thread.

    Don't say you haven't been warned!


  110. Forget your rasclaat ginger cake, tiramisu is the king of desserts.

  111. well, I've just had a dessert made up of 'chocolate nut samosas', 'lemon and chocolate wontons', and 'chocolate cassis nems' (what les francais call spring rolls), so I'll have anyone in a cake debate right now....

    was lovely...

  112. Surely that's stretching the definition of 'cake' a bit though, isn't it!?

  113. That's stretching the limits of my imagination...

  114. Hmmph.

    Where I'm from cake is, well...

    ...it's just cake.

  115. james - when it tastes that good, who cares what it's called...

    right - birthday well and truly successful. am calling it a night.


  116. Read Waddya for the first time in ages today. Didn't intend to post, but Pairubu pissed me off so much with a comment about the political climate in the US being the fault of rhetoric on both sides, that I just had to respond.

  117. Night Philippa, glad it was a good one!!


    See, that's why I don't even read it, anymore. Or CiF in general, really!!

    I have to say, my blood pressure's never been this good.

  118. All this talk of cake... I'm off to break into the Christmas cake. Night all.

  119. Right, I seem to have gone and 'done a MsChin', so I'll bow out for the evening!!


  120. Just watching Newsnight and their coverage of the Arizona shooting.

    "Fox News" didn't even get a mention!

  121. couple of links from both sides of the "pond"


  122. Happy Birthday, PhilippaB!
    No cake here.No biscuits.Just milk,which seems to be in demand every 37 seconds or so.

  123. All these recipes and culinary discussions, after my disque dur died twelve days ago, Is this UT or Waddya ?

    Happy BD to Philippa and all others missed.

    Hope Ma and baby well to where it applies .

    Condolences on loss of job to some ! Welcome to the New Silent Majority...?

    PS for Meerkat -- I was in pre-mod for 8 days, lifted without any contact........I couldn't be bothered, so very pissed off with 'em.

  124. Quiet here!

    Got nothing to add to the 'cake debate' so here's a track from Beverley Craven

  125. "Chekhov -- html?"

    Err,,, sorry, don't know what you mean by that. Could you clarify?

  126. googlespam strikes, I posted html link to chekhov's No 2 link, and now it's gone !

    Check it out ! trying again -- 2nd TRY!

  127. This is just a gut reaction and therefore I can't provide any proof one way or the other but it seems to me there is a propaganda war going on and the most disturbing part of it is not what we are being told (which most of us know are blatant lies) but the shit that never even breaks the surface.

  128. Oh, sorry did I make a pigs ear of the linkeys?

    I'm working on doing them properly....honest!

  129. HI chekhov -- two excellent links there on the US side, both showing an incitement to murder.

    That shit did break the surface, but was allowed to pass...

    There is plenty of proof around that the Propaganda War has been in full swing since the start of the 'Cold War'.

  130. Just watching Newsnight and their coverage of the Arizona shooting.

    "Fox News" didn't even get a mention!

    And the BBC are supposed to be impartial!

    Do me a favour..the BBC are a propaganda machine which trots out "tractor productivity" in the same style as Soviet Russia.
    All in the name of "democracy" which is a complete scam....there is nothing democratic about this wheeze!

  131. Thanks for the Chris Potter clip BTH - interesting - especially liked the elephant trumpet mimicry at 4.09 :). No, I have to admit that's was a l o n g ten minutes worth of listening - I think I'd have to work at acquiring a taste for his music. Although 'being there' would definitely be a better experience.