After last night's discussion, I coincidentally read this in an Orwell column from Tribune on Christmas Eve 1943:
"From Philip Jordan’s Tunis Diary:
We discussed the future of Germany; and John [Strachey] said to an American present, ‘You surely don’t want a Carthaginian peace, do you?’ Our American friend with great slowness but solemnity said, ‘I don’t recollect we’ve ever had much trouble from the Carthaginians since.’ Which delighted me.
It doesn’t delight me. One answer to the American might have been, ‘No, but we’ve had a lot of trouble from the Romans’, But there is more to it than that. What the people who talk about a Carthaginian peace don’t realize is that in our day such things are simply not practicable. Having defeated your enemy you have to choose (unless you want another war within a generation) between exterminating him and treating him generously. Conceivably the first alternative is desirable, but it isn’t possible. It is quite true that Carthage was utterly destroyed, its buildings levelled to the ground, its inhabitants put to the sword. Such things were happening all the time in antiquity. But the populations involved were tiny. I wonder if that American knew how many people were found within the walls of Carthage when it was finally sacked? According to the nearest authority I can lay hands on, five thousand! What is the best way of killing off seventy million Germans? Rat poison? We might keep this in mind when ‘Make Germany Pay’ becomes a battle-cry again."
Vae victis, as Brennus once said. They started it, they lost it, they paid for it.
It’s a complicated story though, as you say.
That Orwell quotation is interesting - he was ahead of his time. Even Hoover, reporting back from Germany in 1947, came to realise it, albeit later than our Mr Eric Blair...
"...There is the illusion that the New Germany left after the annexations can be reduced to a 'pastoral state'. It cannot be done unless we exterminate or move 25,000,000 people out of it..."
"Give very careful consideration to how you travel to the medical, because you will be asked about how you did so and enormous assumptions may be made on the basis of your being able to use public transport on your own, for example.
This may be the case even if you had no choice but to use public transport or even though you found it painful or distressing to do so.
In relation to mental health it may be assumed that you can motivate yourself to get up and dress, go out alone, communicate with other people, deal with changes in routine, motivate yourself and so on. These assumptions are likely to be made without asking you how you coped with the journey.
In relation to physical health it may be assumed that you can walk to and from bus stops without pain, that you can stand to wait for buses, rise from sitting to standing, handle coins, get up and down steps, sit for long periods and so on. Again, you may well not be asked about any difficulties you experienced or any pain you suffered throughout the journey
So, if you don’t normally use public transport, then try not to do so to travel to your medical. If you do have to use public transport and it is painful or traumatic for you, make sure you explain this to the doctor who assesses you.
Our guides to the personal capability assessment (PCA) – the name for the incapacity benefit medical assessment process - contain lots more information about incapacity for work questionnaires, medical examinations and appeals. Here’s what one member had to say about them:
“I went for my PCA two weeks ago, (having downloaded all your info, including your list of 60 questions I might be asked), the doctor virtually asked me word for word most of the questions on your list! I received the good news that I wont have to go for another PCA for 18 months and have now been able to put in a claim for Income Support to pay my mortgage interest (after having to sell my car and borrowing money to keep up the payments)...."..."
"Even if you don’t score enough points under the personal capability assessment – the medical test to decide if you’re incapable of work – you may still have a chance of being found incapable of work either at claim or appeal stage. This is because of the little known ‘exceptional circumstances’ rules.
There are a number of these, but probably the most important is regulation 27(b), which states that you will be found incapable of work if:
‘there would be a substantial risk to the mental or physical health of any person if he were found capable of work’’
This regulation could apply to you on physical health or on mental health grounds.
For example, if you experience severe anxiety attacks and might harm yourself or somebody else if placed in a situation you find threatening, then this might be grounds for applying regulation 27(b).
Or you may have a lung condition which is made much worse by stress and, in the past, such situations have led to a serious deterioration in your health and perhaps hospitalisation. If you would find being found capable of work, having to sign on for Jobseekers Allowance and take part in training or work experience very stressful, then that may be grounds for declaring you incapable of work under the exceptional circumstances regulations.
However, neither doctors nor decision makers are quick to identify people who might be covered by these clauses. And very few claimants even know they exist.
So make sure you’re properly informed about all the regulations that might apply to you by using our detailed, downloadable guides to the personal capability assessment on physical and mental health grounds.
That way, you’ll have the opportunity to give evidence about them in your questionnaire, at your medical and, if necessary, at your appeal.
Question of reparations raises interesting supplementary questions.............never seems to bother the uber rich that seeking reparations from the poor might trigger civil discord.
Could be that gated communities give a false sense of security. Perhaps they need to understand that they can get locked in just as easily as locking the unwashed out.
I'm a charitable chap and all for sending in supplies......starting with petrol in bottles to fire up the central heating if there is a cold spell.
”…Question of reparations raises interesting supplementary questions…”
Indeed it does. Front of my mind is the notion of collective responsibility, if I can put it that way. Were the citizens of the erstwhile Third Reich who froze to death for lack of fuel in the winter of 46/47 paying for the decisions of their dead leaders? Can a whole nation be punished for the decisions of a few?
”…starting with petrol in bottles to fire up the central heating if there is a cold spell…”
LOL. I’d wager you’d be more likely to set yourself on fire with a Molotov cocktail than do any lasting harm to the “Establishment”, mate.
You are probably right Swifty but I was toying with idea of adding a deano special advisory number 11 at the end of the above series of postings on Incap Benefit.
Something to the effect...
"If all else fails take fire eating lessons.......tell the ATOS medic you suffer from a sore throat and have to constantly gargle......
....take a gargle from your flask invite him/her to examine your throat....
......and flame grill the bastard"
BTW anon (yesterday) Your comment @ 19:49 baffled me at first but I did write:
"... ten tips that have been sent to me in daily emails as part of marketing exercise promoting a professionally produced guide to claiming Incapacity Benefit. the guide is very good and costs £18.95 the top tips are free and worth sharing")
Perhaps I should have said:
"...ten tips that have been sent to me in daily emails as part of marketing exercise promoting a professionally produced guide to claiming Incapacity Benefit. The guide is a very good source of basic information if you are completely in the dark about the mechanics of the system. It costs £18.95 to acess. It does not appear to have an ISBN and thus may be difficult to get from your library and in truth a lot of the information is already 'out there' (but spread around) on the net . That said the top tips are free and worth sharing and I have already posted links to a very informative free site (see and press the Resources Tab at the top of the page)"
I do not especially endorse the charged for product or claim it is good or fair value. Bit like hemorrhoid remedies really - if you ain't got any ice around and your arse is paining you.... you probably ain't got much to loose by sticking a suppository or your finger up it.
As for an endorsement of Capitalism - well I wouldn't put a pension on it.
"... Were the citizens of the erstwhile Third Reich who froze to death for lack of fuel in the winter of 46/47 paying for the decisions of their dead leaders? ...."
Or the decsions of their loosing soliders, or the superior strength of others.. or their own careless inaction and lack of foresight a decade before?
The unresolved questions of history....
"Can a whole nation be punished for the decisions of a few?
Cameron and Clegg would think so but then so too did Blair and Bush...?
Fuck. The bastard three year leak in my roof (which I thought I'd fixed last friday) has returned.
So if all these countries have such large defiects (sp) where have they borrowed the dosh from? Why is a globaly resourced post scarcity civilisation beyond reach?
Didn't see that from Scherf. I dare say there's much better analysis out there... can't do much while at work - here's some sunny positive-gloss stuff about Nordic economies though...
It would be an interesting experiment to take the substance of GIYUS's posts, reformat them and post them under a more sensible user name with a serious-looking avatar to see how many, if any, would be sucked into the great mod void...
Re: post-war reparations. Blood money. Not good.
I wonder how much our kids will have to pay in reparations to Iraq and Afghanistan in decades to come, when the good ole USA is no longer the Master of the Universe but a mere Chinese protectorate!?! :p
The bastards have even bought our Jaffa Cakes! There is no hope!
“” For example, our tax dollars are being used to convince kids that Gulf seafood is safe, because oil "floats", dispersants are harmless and wildlife is hearty: “”
He also did some on Disability . maybe as a result of ‘prompting' hehe .
BW Spain raising higher tax rates, Greece scrapping public sector bonuses, many countries attempting to cut tax evasion, those are fair enough.
In france Sarko is not touching his tax give-away (bouclier fiscal) to the rich, and civil servants such as Prefets and police chiefs get massive cash bonuses , while in the UK they are cutting staff at HMRC I believe ?
Thought you might be interested in reading this article from the Torygraph about this country's increasing dependence on food imports. Agriculture in this country has,like manufacturing,been largely neglected by successive governments and many farmers are going out of business at a time that demand for food is increasing.I know the EU/CAP complicates things but something ain't right when the British agricultural sector-long renowned as being one of the most efficient in the world-is taking a battering whilst less efficient agricultural sectors in other EU countries are being subsidised.And it's not the large landowners who are suffering here but the small farmers-like the Welsh hill farmers that you've talked about before.
There is also the power of the Supermarkets to be considered as well .For they too are screwing British farmers on the prices they'll pay for they know they can import food more cheaply elsewhere.Something is clearly wrong here and i'm not comfortable with this country's food supply being so dependant on imports.
btw Did once try and raise this on CIF but got no response.
Monkeyfish
Finally got around to reading your link about Islam in Britian.Really interesting so cheers for that.
On another subject, I just had a wee rant on facebook about how it is that the rest of europe is on strike and we, here in the UK, are still bowing and scraping and tugging our forelocks
One of my friends posted this,from The Secret People by GK Chesterton which I hadn't seen before, to my shame: "We hear men speaking for us of new laws strong and sweet, Yet is there no man speaketh as we speak in the street. It may be we shall rise the last as Frenchmen rose the first, Our wrath come after Russia's wrath and our wrath be the worst. It may be we are meant to mark with our riot and our rest God's scorn for all men governing. It may be beer is best. But we are the people of England; and we have not spoken yet. Smile at us, pay us, pass us. But do not quite forget."
the different retirement ages across EU are interesting - we Brits will all be going to work on our zimmer frames for minimum wage - that or the workhouse.
Thanks Paul - will read. My farmer friend M has a nice turn of phrase for the supermarkets.
i read article few years ago about CAP - paid per head of sheep - farmers in Spain and Portugal put model sheep out to confuse helicopter spys. True ? Dunno.
it's a reasonable bet, to be fair. If it's good enough for TB, it's good enough for the clone.
(Plus he's probably earned enough favours from the neo-con lot to cash 'em in for a particularly sweet little gig in academia/consultancy/thinktank land!!)
Given that TB got to lecture in 'morality and ethics', or some equally ironic shite, my money's on 'Socialism, political integrity and the evils of nepotism' by D. Miliband esq.
Just back from deepest Oxfordshire. Talking about British agriculture - the farms i visit - all kinds of fruit and veg mainly, are completely dependent upon temporary migrant labour to do their harvesting as local people are no longer interested in the work. There are lots of reasons for this, not just because it's relatively low paid.
For example, the way unemployment and housing benefits work doesn't help, as it doesn'tt allow people to take temporary work without cutting them off completely. Housing ben can take months to re-apply for and landlords won't wait. If it could be suspended for the period of temporary work, and then slotted back into when it finished, a lot more people would be interested.
This part of the agri economy is worth about £2.5bn to the economy at farm gate prices - lots more if you add on retail values and has been built up on the back of regular, reliable temporary migrant workers supplied through government contracted operators since about 1947.
Working and living conditions for the workers is one of the things I check (rigorously) as part of my job and all the employers who source their labour through this scheme have to comply with all employment law and regs and generally have pretty high standards.
People keep coming back, year after year and now there are workers from all over Eastern Europe working in permanent full time jobs on farms all over the country. Was just talking to a Bulgarian guy today who first came as a temporary worker and now manages a fruit farm near Abingdon.
Ah, OK. My own bugbears in that department - Blunkett, Clarke, Straw, Reid, Blears, Flint, Purnell - have all either gone or are in the process of cutting their own throats under the new regime. So I don't mind the Milibands too much by comparison.
And on a similar subject, there's a nice piece here by Kirk Elder, the estimable Senior Citizen from Peebles, on the art of political oratory in the modern age.
Sheff - know a bloke locally who does some seasonal farm work (harvesting). However, the rest of the year he does gardening/handyman/whatever-he-can-find work through his own business. A hard worker and an honest one but I think things are always pretty close to the bone.
A few months ago, his van broke down and he tried to get a loan to either fix it or replace it but had a lot of trouble.
His partner is equally hard-working: full-time work (including night shifts) in a care home and pub shifts for some extra money whenever she can fit them in.
They would like to run their own pub one day, but what bastard bank is going to give two hard-working people a loan to let them do it?
To complicate matters, she is preggers and has had to give up the care work for now.
Re the Milibandi: meh. The only reason Ed gets to position himself leftwards is that he never had a chance to vote on the Iraq war. No doubt he'd have enthusastically done so had he been an MP at the time, judging by his subsequent voting record.
Sheff - the thing that pisses me off is that these are exactly the sort of people that the govt (this and the last) pretend they want to encourage. Well, they're bloody doing all that is humanly possible and not getting much fucking encouragement.
If anybody wants to say anything nasty to anyone on CiF, I'll do it for you - just wasted most of the evening arguing pointlessly with people against mixed race marriages.
Honestly, anything you want to say to anyone, I'll say it - I need to get banned! (Obviously, don't make it racist, sexist, or homophobic)
aye, Thauma, Sarfraz's thread, very nice article, very moving, I thought. Don't bother with the comments - least of all mine, they just make you look for a fight with idiots. No point in that.
I didn't read or see the E milipede speech, was it a bit like this :
" 'But let's face facts. We had bad recommendations We had very bad recommendations And we are out of conversation And let me tell you, there is nothing good about talking about nothing all day long Every day out of power, another day when this Troll can wreak damage on our communities, another day when we cannot change our Thread for the better. And let us resolve today that this will be a one-post Troll. That is the purpose of my leadership of the SPAM But to achieve that we must go on our own journey. And that is why the most important word in politics for us is hypocrisy We need to learn some painful truths about where we went wrong and how we lost touch. We must not blame the community for ending up with a mud aerator we don't like, we should blame ourselves. We have to understand why posters felt they couldn't support us. We have to show we understand the problems posters face today. This will require strong leadership. It won't always be easy. You might not always like what I have to say. But you've elected me leader and lead I will. This community faces some tough choices. And so do we. And we need to change.
The letter of protest stresses that the actions of those who have organised the strikes in Greece and are violating the fundamental rights of other EU citizens are completely unacceptable.
The Bulgarian Foreign Ministry is demanding that Greek authorities take immediate action to prevent any further attacks on Bulgarian nations in the country.
Greek lorry drivers who are striking for the third week running because they are opposed to the government plans to liberalise their sector and open it to foreign competitors meanwhile failed to reach agreement in their negotiations with traders' representatives on September 28
Unionists representing the lorry drivers could not agree on a compromise with traders who have suffered millions of euro in losses due to the truckers’ industrial action.
The meeting on September 28 was supposed to decide whether to break off their industrial action for a week to allow stores across the country to be supplied with essentials, but no such agreement was reached.
According to Greek daily Kathimerini, the heads of the unions representing truck owners and fuel truck drivers decided to meet again later on September 29 for another round of talks.
Hundred of lorries have been parked along major interchanges and key junctions around Athens and the northern city of Thessaloniki. According to Greek daily Kathimerini, there are about 10 000 containers of goods stranded and stacked up at Piraeus and Thessaloniki ports.
---------- this story has not had any coverage here. Attacks on Bulgarian lorry drivers have been going on for several weeks.
Can EU unions work together or will hard times further seperate us ?
After last night's discussion, I coincidentally read this in an Orwell column from Tribune on Christmas Eve 1943:
ReplyDelete"From Philip Jordan’s Tunis Diary:
We discussed the future of Germany; and John [Strachey] said to an American present, ‘You surely don’t want a Carthaginian peace, do you?’ Our American friend with great slowness but solemnity said, ‘I don’t recollect we’ve ever had much trouble from the Carthaginians since.’ Which delighted me.
It doesn’t delight me. One answer to the American might have been, ‘No, but we’ve had a lot of trouble from the Romans’, But there is more to it than that. What the people who talk about a Carthaginian peace don’t realize is that in our day such things are simply not practicable. Having defeated your enemy you have to choose (unless you want another war within a generation) between exterminating him and treating him generously. Conceivably the first alternative is desirable, but it isn’t possible. It is quite true that Carthage was utterly destroyed, its buildings levelled to the ground, its inhabitants put to the sword. Such things were happening all the time in antiquity. But the populations involved were tiny. I wonder if that American knew how many people were found within the walls of Carthage when it was finally sacked? According to the nearest authority I can lay hands on, five thousand! What is the best way of killing off seventy million Germans? Rat poison? We might keep this in mind when ‘Make Germany Pay’ becomes a battle-cry again."
@PeterJ:
ReplyDeleteVae victis, as Brennus once said. They started it, they lost it, they paid for it.
It’s a complicated story though, as you say.
That Orwell quotation is interesting - he was ahead of his time. Even Hoover, reporting back from Germany in 1947, came to realise it, albeit later than our Mr Eric Blair...
"...There is the illusion that the New Germany left after the annexations can be reduced to a 'pastoral state'. It cannot be done unless we exterminate or move 25,000,000 people out of it..."
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteIncapacity Benefit - Advisory 3 of 10
ReplyDelete"Give very careful consideration to how you travel to the medical, because you will be asked about how you did so and enormous assumptions may be made on the basis of your being able to use public transport on your own, for example.
This may be the case even if you had no choice but to use public transport or even though you found it painful or distressing to do so.
In relation to mental health it may be assumed that you can motivate yourself to get up and dress, go out alone, communicate with other people, deal with changes in routine, motivate yourself and so on. These assumptions are likely to be made without asking you how you coped with the journey.
In relation to physical health it may be assumed that you can walk to and from bus stops without pain, that you can stand to wait for buses, rise from sitting to standing, handle coins, get up and down steps, sit for long periods and so on. Again, you may well not be asked about any difficulties you experienced or any pain you suffered throughout the journey
So, if you don’t normally use public transport, then try not to do so to travel to your medical. If you do have to use public transport and it is painful or traumatic for you, make sure you explain this to the doctor who assesses you.
Our guides to the personal capability assessment (PCA) – the name for the incapacity benefit medical assessment process - contain lots more information about incapacity for work questionnaires, medical examinations and appeals. Here’s what one member had to say about them:
“I went for my PCA two weeks ago, (having downloaded all your info, including your list of 60 questions I might be asked), the doctor virtually asked me word for word most of the questions on your list! I received the good news that I wont have to go for another PCA for 18 months and have now been able to put in a claim for Income Support to pay my mortgage interest (after having to sell my car and borrowing money to keep up the payments)...."..."
Incapacity Benefit - Advisory 4 of 10
ReplyDelete"Even if you don’t score enough points under the personal capability assessment – the medical test to decide if you’re incapable of work – you may still have a chance of being found incapable of work either at claim or appeal stage. This is because of the little known ‘exceptional circumstances’ rules.
There are a number of these, but probably the most important is regulation 27(b), which states that you will be found incapable of work if:
‘there would be a substantial risk to the mental or physical health of any person if he were found capable of work’’
This regulation could apply to you on physical health or on mental health grounds.
For example, if you experience severe anxiety attacks and might harm yourself or somebody else if placed in a situation you find threatening, then this might be grounds for applying regulation 27(b).
Or you may have a lung condition which is made much worse by stress and, in the past, such situations have led to a serious deterioration in your health and perhaps hospitalisation. If you would find being found capable of work, having to sign on for Jobseekers Allowance and take part in training or work experience very stressful, then that may be grounds for declaring you incapable of work under the exceptional circumstances regulations.
However, neither doctors nor decision makers are quick to identify people who might be covered by these clauses. And very few claimants even know they exist.
So make sure you’re properly informed about all the regulations that might apply to you by using our detailed, downloadable guides to the personal capability assessment on physical and mental health grounds.
That way, you’ll have the opportunity to give evidence about them in your questionnaire, at your medical and, if necessary, at your appeal.
Tomorrow: It’s all about the evidence...."
Morning all - if a double posting of one of the above 'advisory' posts suddenly appears I'll delete it later.
ReplyDelete(Spam problems again - I've removed the 'link' content and that seems to have overcome the spam trigger, touch wood)
Question of reparations raises interesting supplementary questions.............never seems to bother the uber rich that seeking reparations from the poor might trigger civil discord.
ReplyDeleteCould be that gated communities give a false sense of security. Perhaps they need to understand that they can get locked in just as easily as locking the unwashed out.
I'm a charitable chap and all for sending in supplies......starting with petrol in bottles to fire up the central heating if there is a cold spell.
Shit miserable cleggy wet day here in the North
laters all.
@deano:
ReplyDelete”…Question of reparations raises interesting supplementary questions…”
Indeed it does. Front of my mind is the notion of collective responsibility, if I can put it that way. Were the citizens of the erstwhile Third Reich who froze to death for lack of fuel in the winter of 46/47 paying for the decisions of their dead leaders? Can a whole nation be punished for the decisions of a few?
”…starting with petrol in bottles to fire up the central heating if there is a cold spell…”
LOL. I’d wager you’d be more likely to set yourself on fire with a Molotov cocktail than do any lasting harm to the “Establishment”, mate.
You are probably right Swifty but I was toying with idea of adding a deano special advisory number 11 at the end of the above series of postings on Incap Benefit.
ReplyDeleteSomething to the effect...
"If all else fails take fire eating lessons.......tell the ATOS medic you suffer from a sore throat and have to constantly gargle......
....take a gargle from your flask invite him/her to examine your throat....
......and flame grill the bastard"
BTW anon (yesterday) Your comment @ 19:49 baffled me at first but I did write:
"... ten tips that have been sent to me in daily emails as part of marketing exercise promoting a professionally produced guide to claiming Incapacity Benefit. the guide is very good and costs £18.95 the top tips are free and worth sharing")
Perhaps I should have said:
"...ten tips that have been sent to me in daily emails as part of marketing exercise promoting a professionally produced guide to claiming Incapacity Benefit. The guide is a very good source of basic information if you are completely in the dark about the mechanics of the system. It costs £18.95 to acess. It does not appear to have an ISBN and thus may be difficult to get from your library and in truth a lot of the information is already 'out there' (but spread around) on the net . That said the top tips are free and worth sharing and I have already posted links to a very informative free site (see and press the Resources Tab at the top of the page)"
I do not especially endorse the charged for product or claim it is good or fair value. Bit like hemorrhoid remedies really - if you ain't got any ice around and your arse is paining you.... you probably ain't got much to loose by sticking a suppository or your finger up it.
As for an endorsement of Capitalism - well I wouldn't put a pension on it.
Hope that makes my position a little clearer.
"... Were the citizens of the erstwhile Third Reich who froze to death for lack of fuel in the winter of 46/47 paying for the decisions of their dead leaders? ...."
ReplyDeleteOr the decsions of their loosing soliders, or the superior strength of others.. or their own careless inaction and lack of foresight a decade before?
The unresolved questions of history....
"Can a whole nation be punished for the decisions of a few?
Cameron and Clegg would think so but then so too did Blair and Bush...?
Fuck. The bastard three year leak in my roof (which I thought I'd fixed last friday) has returned.
Something I posted before the 11:13 above has now gone to Spam!
ReplyDeleteActually upon careful examination and mature reflection ...it's a different fucking roof leak.
ReplyDeleteI feel half better aleady. At least me Friday efforts were not a total waste.
Right that's me away for the rest of the day.
Ref European strikes / austerity action.
ReplyDeleteAnyone else feel like apologising to GIYUS for calling him a fantasist a couple of years back ???
Perhaps he's a modern Cassandra BW? He can see the future, it's Death Ray Panda, New World Order, Murdoch & the Masons... but no one belives him...
ReplyDeleteI know... I used to scoff at the comic book presentation. Not any more. I am going to work for him in the new rebel HQ under a mexican volcano.
ReplyDeleteEU - Austerity measures by country here
ReplyDelete@BW:
ReplyDeleteNo mention of Scandiwegia in that lot, oddly. Was scherf saying similar was on the menu in Denmark?
So if all these countries have such large defiects (sp) where have they borrowed the dosh from? Why is a globaly resourced post scarcity civilisation beyond reach?
ReplyDeleteDidn't see that from Scherf. I dare say there's much better analysis out there... can't do much while at work - here's some sunny positive-gloss stuff about Nordic economies though...
ReplyDeletehttp://www.swedishwire.com/economy/6124-jumpstart-for-nordic-economic-recovery
Afternoon all
ReplyDeleteIt would be an interesting experiment to take the substance of GIYUS's posts, reformat them and post them under a more sensible user name with a serious-looking avatar to see how many, if any, would be sucked into the great mod void...
Re: post-war reparations. Blood money. Not good.
I wonder how much our kids will have to pay in reparations to Iraq and Afghanistan in decades to come, when the good ole USA is no longer the Master of the Universe but a mere Chinese protectorate!?! :p
The bastards have even bought our Jaffa Cakes! There is no hope!
Hi BB
ReplyDeleteSome of Giyus’es posts were linked to http://www.georgewashington2.blogspot.com/ on the Deepwater Horizon cover-up , today --
“” For example, our tax dollars are being used to convince kids that Gulf seafood is safe, because oil "floats", dispersants are harmless and wildlife is hearty: “”
He also did some on Disability . maybe as a result of ‘prompting' hehe .
"I wonder how much our kids will have to pay in reparations to Iraq and Afghanistan in decades to come"
ReplyDeleteI shouldn't worry, BB, they've been there before; they're sticking to the parking policy of "no return within 20 years", so no fine imposed.
BW
ReplyDeleteSpain raising higher tax rates, Greece scrapping public sector bonuses, many countries attempting to cut tax evasion, those are fair enough.
In france Sarko is not touching his tax give-away (bouclier fiscal) to the rich, and civil servants such as Prefets and police chiefs get massive cash bonuses , while in the UK they are cutting staff at HMRC I believe ?
Afternoon all
ReplyDeleteHi Leni
Thought you might be interested in reading this article from the Torygraph about this country's increasing dependence on food imports. Agriculture in this country has,like manufacturing,been largely neglected by successive governments and many farmers are going out of business at a time that demand for food is increasing.I know the EU/CAP complicates things but something ain't right when the British agricultural sector-long renowned as being one of the most efficient in the world-is taking a battering whilst less efficient agricultural sectors in other EU countries are being subsidised.And it's not the large landowners who are suffering here but the small farmers-like the Welsh hill farmers that you've talked about before.
There is also the power of the Supermarkets to be considered as well .For they too are screwing British farmers on the prices they'll pay for they know they can import food more cheaply elsewhere.Something is clearly wrong here and i'm not comfortable with this country's food supply being so dependant on imports.
btw Did once try and raise this on CIF but got no response.
Monkeyfish
Finally got around to reading your link about Islam in Britian.Really interesting so cheers for that.
LOL habib!
ReplyDeleteOn another subject, I just had a wee rant on facebook about how it is that the rest of europe is on strike and we, here in the UK, are still bowing and scraping and tugging our forelocks
One of my friends posted this,from The Secret People by GK Chesterton which I hadn't seen before, to my shame:
"We hear men speaking for us of new laws strong and sweet,
Yet is there no man speaketh as we speak in the street.
It may be we shall rise the last as Frenchmen rose the first,
Our wrath come after Russia's wrath and our wrath be the worst.
It may be we are meant to mark with our riot and our rest
God's scorn for all men governing. It may be beer is best.
But we are the people of England; and we have not spoken yet.
Smile at us, pay us, pass us. But do not quite forget."
Flying visit
ReplyDeletethe different retirement ages across EU are interesting - we Brits will all be going to work on our zimmer frames for minimum wage - that or the workhouse.
Thanks Paul - will read. My farmer friend M has a nice turn of phrase for the supermarkets.
i read article few years ago about CAP - paid per head of sheep - farmers in Spain and Portugal put model sheep out to confuse helicopter spys. True ? Dunno.
"farmers in Spain and Portugal put model sheep out to confuse helicopter spys."
ReplyDeleteBut they wouldn't be taking a gambol.
(sorry)
Bye, Dave. Don't come back.
ReplyDeleteI reckon Dave will have gone home to mash up Ed's train set.
ReplyDeleteA day or two ago Matthew Norman at the Indie reckoned D milipede would be crossing the Atlantic ...
ReplyDeleteDave:
ReplyDeleteit's a reasonable bet, to be fair. If it's good enough for TB, it's good enough for the clone.
(Plus he's probably earned enough favours from the neo-con lot to cash 'em in for a particularly sweet little gig in academia/consultancy/thinktank land!!)
Maybe he'll go and work for Hillary.
ReplyDeleteJust rescued 3 Deano posts from the spam bin....
Given that TB got to lecture in 'morality and ethics', or some equally ironic shite, my money's on 'Socialism, political integrity and the evils of nepotism' by D. Miliband esq.
ReplyDelete@James
ReplyDeleteCould you remind me why you hate the Milibands so much? I can't recall the reasons now.
Paul
ReplyDeleteJust back from deepest Oxfordshire. Talking about British agriculture - the farms i visit - all kinds of fruit and veg mainly, are completely dependent upon temporary migrant labour to do their harvesting as local people are no longer interested in the work. There are lots of reasons for this, not just because it's relatively low paid.
For example, the way unemployment and housing benefits work doesn't help, as it doesn'tt allow people to take temporary work without cutting them off completely. Housing ben can take months to re-apply for and landlords won't wait. If it could be suspended for the period of temporary work, and then slotted back into when it finished, a lot more people would be interested.
This part of the agri economy is worth about £2.5bn to the economy at farm gate prices - lots more if you add on retail values and has been built up on the back of regular, reliable temporary migrant workers supplied through government contracted operators since about 1947.
Working and living conditions for the workers is one of the things I check (rigorously) as part of my job and all the employers who source their labour through this scheme have to comply with all employment law and regs and generally have pretty high standards.
People keep coming back, year after year and now there are workers from all over Eastern Europe working in permanent full time jobs on farms all over the country. Was just talking to a Bulgarian guy today who first came as a temporary worker and now manages a fruit farm near Abingdon.
Peter,
ReplyDeleteWell, for me, they epitomise everything that's gone wrong with Labour, Politics, and the country!!
And also, there's something not quite right about 'em, in a 'V' kind of way!!
@James
ReplyDeleteAh, OK. My own bugbears in that department - Blunkett, Clarke, Straw, Reid, Blears, Flint, Purnell - have all either gone or are in the process of cutting their own throats under the new regime. So I don't mind the Milibands too much by comparison.
As you were.
And on a similar subject, there's a nice piece here by Kirk Elder, the estimable Senior Citizen from Peebles, on the art of political oratory in the modern age.
ReplyDeleteHaha - 'there'll be no Balloons at the Christmas party, and no party either!!'
ReplyDeleteSheff - know a bloke locally who does some seasonal farm work (harvesting). However, the rest of the year he does gardening/handyman/whatever-he-can-find work through his own business. A hard worker and an honest one but I think things are always pretty close to the bone.
ReplyDeleteA few months ago, his van broke down and he tried to get a loan to either fix it or replace it but had a lot of trouble.
His partner is equally hard-working: full-time work (including night shifts) in a care home and pub shifts for some extra money whenever she can fit them in.
They would like to run their own pub one day, but what bastard bank is going to give two hard-working people a loan to let them do it?
To complicate matters, she is preggers and has had to give up the care work for now.
Thauma
ReplyDeleteGod knows how many people there are juggling their lives in similar ways. I know loads. Its going to get a lot tougher for them as things worsen.
Anybody seen Gandolfo recently??
ReplyDelete... must ... control ... fist ... of death ....
ReplyDeleteThat sexpats eejit spouts nothing but clichés.
Re the Milibandi: meh. The only reason Ed gets to position himself leftwards is that he never had a chance to vote on the Iraq war. No doubt he'd have enthusastically done so had he been an MP at the time, judging by his subsequent voting record.
Sheff - the thing that pisses me off is that these are exactly the sort of people that the govt (this and the last) pretend they want to encourage. Well, they're bloody doing all that is humanly possible and not getting much fucking encouragement.
ReplyDeleteJust saw the 'why are you clapping' thing for the first time!!
ReplyDeleteSchadenfreude?? Hells yeah!!
For some strange reason, this has just popped into my mind.
ReplyDeleteApologies in advance.
Unless it's Really bad, then...
ReplyDeleteClever iPod, obviously!!
James, yer iPod is prob doing you a favour ... except I found myself quite enjoying it! (Don't tell anyone.)
ReplyDeleteThat's a blinder of a song!
ReplyDeleteIf anybody wants to say anything nasty to anyone on CiF, I'll do it for you - just wasted most of the evening arguing pointlessly with people against mixed race marriages.
ReplyDeleteHonestly, anything you want to say to anyone, I'll say it - I need to get banned! (Obviously, don't make it racist, sexist, or homophobic)
Oh, but I do unambiguously love this one ... two harmonising bass guitars ... even if it does have a weird religious theme.
ReplyDeleteHabib - well, it's a good driving song.
ReplyDeleteWherezat you are arguing against mixed-race marriage foes? Sarfraz's thread, perhaps, which I haven't read but meant to?
Cannot for the life of me work out why some people are so interested in other people's relationships and try to prescribe what they should be like.
Nunna ya fuckin business!
thauma --
ReplyDeleteThe MSM as Weapon of Mass Distraction "
said the cynic .
Giyus is on fire tonight. Parking this one:
ReplyDeleteNew House Spam Foundation
FenceWonkers's Speech 2 SPAM
'But let's face facts.
We had bad recommendations
We had very bad recommendations
And we are out of conversation
And let me tell you, there is nothing good about talking about nothing all day long
Every day out of power, another day when this Troll can wreak damage on our communities, another day when we cannot change our Thread for the better.
And let us resolve today that this will be a one-post Troll That is the purpose of my leadership of the SPAM
But to achieve that we must go on our own journey.
And that is why the most important word in politics for us is hypocrisy
We need to learn some painful truths about where we went wrong and how we lost touch.
We must not blame the community for ending up with a mud aerator we don't like, we should blame ourselves.
We have to understand why posters felt they couldn't support us.
We have to show we understand the problems posters face today.
This will require strong leadership. It won't always be easy. You might not always like what I have to say.
But you've elected me leader and lead I will.
This community faces some tough choices. And so do we. And we need to change.
(..... now what happened to that lone maritime patrol aircraft in the North Sea region?)
aye, Thauma, Sarfraz's thread, very nice article, very moving, I thought. Don't bother with the comments - least of all mine, they just make you look for a fight with idiots. No point in that.
ReplyDeleteI didn't read or see the E milipede speech, was it a bit like this :
ReplyDelete"
'But let's face facts.
We had bad recommendations
We had very bad recommendations
And we are out of conversation
And let me tell you, there is nothing good about talking about nothing all day long
Every day out of power, another day when this Troll can wreak damage on our communities, another day when we cannot change our Thread for the better.
And let us resolve today that this will be a one-post Troll. That is the purpose of my leadership of the SPAM
But to achieve that we must go on our own journey.
And that is why the most important word in politics for us is hypocrisy
We need to learn some painful truths about where we went wrong and how we lost touch.
We must not blame the community for ending up with a mud aerator we don't like, we should blame ourselves.
We have to understand why posters felt they couldn't support us.
We have to show we understand the problems posters face today.
This will require strong leadership. It won't always be easy. You might not always like what I have to say.
But you've elected me leader and lead I will.
This community faces some tough choices. And so do we. And we need to change.
I can hear a Dylan riff behind Giyus' words.
ReplyDeleteheehee !
ReplyDeleteGetting snoozy now, Habib, but may have a look mañana. Wanted to read it today but v busy.
ReplyDeleteAhh, Dylan!
ReplyDelete(Fear not, Dylan-haters, 'tis a cover version.)
Another beautiful wistful-bitter Dylan song covered by someone who sings much better than the original.
ReplyDeleteAnd with that, I'm off. I think.
Some wag who shall remain nameless for the time being just e-mailed this:
ReplyDeleteQuinlan and Murphy fancied a pint or two but didn't have a lot of money;
between them, they could only raise the staggering sum of one Euro.
Murphy said "Hang on, I have an idea." He went next door to the
butcher's shop and came out with one large sausage.
Quinlan said "Are you crazy? Now we don't have any money left at all!"
Murphy replied "Don't worry - just follow me."
He went into the pub where he immediately ordered two pints of Guinness
and two glasses of Jameson Whisky.
Quinlan said "Now you've lost it. Do you know how much trouble we will
be in? We haven't got any money!!"
Murphy replied, with a smile "Don't worry; I have a plan, Cheers!"
They downed their drinks. Murphy said "OK, I'll stick the sausage
through my zipper and you go on your knees and put it in your mouth."
The barman noticed them, went berserk, and threw them out. They
continued this, pub after pub, getting more and more drunk, all for free.
At the tenth pub Quinlan said "Murphy - I don't think I can do any more
o'this, I'm drunk and me knees are killin' me!"
Murphy said "How do you think I feel? I lost the sausage in the third pub."
Mj
xx
Ha ha ha Chekhov!
ReplyDeleteThe letter of protest stresses that the actions of those who have organised the strikes in Greece and are violating the fundamental rights of other EU citizens are completely unacceptable.
ReplyDeleteThe Bulgarian Foreign Ministry is demanding that Greek authorities take immediate action to prevent any further attacks on Bulgarian nations in the country.
Greek lorry drivers who are striking for the third week running because they are opposed to the government plans to liberalise their sector and open it to foreign competitors meanwhile failed to reach agreement in their negotiations with traders' representatives on September 28
Unionists representing the lorry drivers could not agree on a compromise with traders who have suffered millions of euro in losses due to the truckers’ industrial action.
The meeting on September 28 was supposed to decide whether to break off their industrial action for a week to allow stores across the country to be supplied with essentials, but no such agreement was reached.
According to Greek daily Kathimerini, the heads of the unions representing truck owners and fuel truck drivers decided to meet again later on September 29 for another round of talks.
Hundred of lorries have been parked along major interchanges and key junctions around Athens and the northern city of Thessaloniki. According to Greek daily Kathimerini, there are about 10 000 containers of goods stranded and stacked up at Piraeus and Thessaloniki ports.
----------
this story has not had any coverage here. Attacks on Bulgarian lorry drivers have been going on for several weeks.
Can EU unions work together or will hard times further seperate us ?
HeHeHe - Chek - that made I chuckle !!
ReplyDeleteLeni
ReplyDeleteYou should be the Guards correspondent in Greece... Instead they got ......
You are right, have not seen a thing about Greece over here. Seems our news has become introverted, with Headlines only for the cliche king election.
Hello Leni, thanks for the mail. Not had time to read it properly yet but will repsond to your comments soon.
ReplyDeleteOr "respond" even, if I could learn how to type properly!
ReplyDeletechekhov
ReplyDeleteNot to worry - just a few notes. When you have time let me know which bits - if any - you would like me to expand.
Via Open Culture, here's some classic radio - the Adventures of Philip Marlowe, from a series starting in 1948.
ReplyDelete