I was going to do a standard Daily Chat thread. Had it written up. Had a completely unrelated image chosen, since none of today's events and birthdays readily suggested one. But as I typed up the information about what was supposed to have been today's last item, it felt wrong to do it as just another item.
Today is the 25th anniversary of the Bhopal disaster. Disaster doesn't seem like the right word, somehow. Approximately 3800 people died in the immediate aftermath of the leak. Somewhere between 8000 to 10,000 were dead within 72 hours and estimates of injuries range from 150 to 600 thousand. In the 25 years since the disaster, it is estimated that 25,000 have died from injuries and illness resulting from the disaster.
Warren Anderson, who was the CEO of Union Carbide in 1984, was arrested at that time but released on bail. He fled the country and has not been extradited by the United States. The company paid $470 million in damages and less than $200 million of that had been paid out to victims and survivors as of 2002. By contrast, Exxon was fined $5,000,000,000 for the Exxon Valdez oil spill, which resulted in no human deaths. Apparently American wildlife is more valuable than Indian humans?
Evening Montana. You're right to focus on this disaster/crime. Corporate culpability and governmental complicity (U.S. and Indian)have been overlooked and covered up for years. Not a pleasant opener for your readership, but one that needs remembering. Bummer then as it is now.---Anyway, goodnight all,it was a pisscutter(sunny cloudless day) today and welcome too, after weeks of rain.Later.B.
ReplyDeleteWell put Montana. High up on Obama's to-do list should be an overhaul in Govt to make the USA's reprehensibly one-sided attitude to extradition more equitable (in respect of this the UK govt should be less f-ing craven).
ReplyDeleteMorning all,
ReplyDeletehad a squiff at the Ciffy's this morning.
IS.IT.JUST.ME.OR.IS.MY.FINGER.NOT.ON.THE.PULSE.OF.CIF?!
Has anyone else seen the amount of nominations MaM has? Jesus.
Alisdair, you got it spot on regarding MaM last night.
13th duke and Alisdair, good to see some other early birds have joined the fray, the usual mob seem to stroll in gone noon....
ReplyDeleteMaM has got masses of nominations, yes, a little surprising, think the whole threads been quite good natured though, regardless of who wins (AllyF) its good to look back on the year and lay down arms for a few hours...
MaM has a certain 'talent', I'll grant him that: it's an ability to have a rhino skin, be impervious to social and human norms (y'know like ever showing sympathy, empathy or decency) and to practice sophistry of the highest calibre. However, it's not an ability that should be recognised by an award, but more by ostracism.
ReplyDeleteYes well done Montana. There was an item on Bhopal on last night's news and we were shocked that so little has been done. The item included an interview with an oleaginous Indian politician (with a portrait of Mahatma Gandhi in the background) who explained that there was not really a problem. Politicans like that - and their relations with the US - are clearly a major part of the problem.
ReplyDeleteAs for Alisdair's point about extradition, much is currently being made about the post-2003 extradition reciprocity between the US and the UK, but that's only because we are no longer asking for IRA men to be sent here; if the IRA start killing again, the US will return to its policy of not responding to British requests for IRA suspects to be extradited.
Good nomination by colinthestoat for best commenter. I already considered doing that myself; glad someone else did before me so I don't have to.
ReplyDeleteJay/Alisdair,
ReplyDelete13th duke and Alisdair, good to see some other early birds have joined the fray, the usual mob seem to stroll in gone noon....
That's because the rest of them on here are fast asleep living off the fat of our taxes through benefit scrounging.
They normally get up after noon, switch on their ultraplasma 647'' uber screen tv and watch Jermey Kyle which they've recorded on sky plus. All paid for by yourself, Alasdair and me.
BeautifulBurnout is the worst, she doesn't get up to way past 6pm.
Honestly, flogging's too good for them. I hope when the Tories get into power they send all the poor and scroungers to Madagascar or something, along with the immigrants.
Jeez, see how easy it is to batter out an ill thought out, right wing rant? So THAT's how you come out at the top of the CiF nominations. God it's easier than I thought.
I was going to say, Duke, they mostly work public sector, we should be lucky they log on before dinner time to be honest.
ReplyDeleteThe US, as i understand it, refused to even categorise the IRA as a terrorist organisation until after 9/11. Blowing up civilians is ok until it happens to Yanks. Then it is the world number one evil and multiple wars must be launched.
Been up since 5 and I must admit curiosity got the better of me and I looked at the Ciffies.
ReplyDeleteLeaving personal likes and dislikes aside, the political perspective on the nominations is odd : ellis writes so well and often so passionately for the left, yet I can only see a couple of menshes for him, while Berchmans - who writes from a similar perspective but who seems to derail every thread he's on and is in effect the house troll - gets loads.
Maybe it's entertainment value that counts; but then on the non-lefty side PIkey only gets a couple of nods, so that view is flawed. And it's not a matter of politics either as MAM (whom I secretly enjoy very much) has had loads of nominations.
Marina Hyde gets quite a few nods, yet I chiefly remember her joy over some hapless PR guy which for me was one of the most unpleasant pieces on Cif this year. (PR people in the media often get sneered at by editorial - when it's safe to do so and they don't have connections that can harm the sneerer.)
Have socialistmike and halgeel gone from Cif? I always thought Mike was a Spectator staffer having a laff and there was always something oddly programmatic about halgeel.
In fact loads have gone whom I liked, exarmy and so on. Oh dear!
Edwin,
ReplyDeleteexarmy is still kicking about. He posted quite heavily on a recent article on torture. I like him. I'm sure I saw SocialistMike post recently as well but I may be wrong.
I'm also mystified about the lack of nominations for ellis (I was one who did nominate him).
And this is an apology in bold for the delightful princesschipchops just to emphasis the importance of what I'm about to say:
princess, so, so, so, so sorry about not putting you in my nomination, you were supposed to be there, I don't know what happened! REST ASSURED I'M YOUR BIGGEST FAN, SIGNED DUKE...
...''my tea's gone cold, I'm wondering why, got out of bed at all, the morning rain falls down my window and I can't see at all...''
Thank you your Grace, now I have Dido and the A33 in the dark in my head.....
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone here remember the Ciffies fiasco a couple of years back ?
ReplyDeleteA load of newbies showed up posting almost identical nominations for "Seumas Milne and Soumaya Ghanoush."
It was hilarious, about as safe as an Afghani regional poll. The whole thing was abandoned in the end. Not CiF's finest hour...
Thanks Your Grace, am glad he is still about (exarmy not SM!)
ReplyDeleteOne for Alisdair from this sterling site -
http://benlocker.co.uk/the-top-10-political-spelling-and-grammar-failures/
In case my link doesn;t work, they say:
'A sterling effort this one. Only this month, it transpired that someone had incorrectly carved the name of one of Scotland’s greatest living authors, Alasdair Gray, into the Scottish Parliament at Holyrood. It will cost £3,000 to correct the name from ‘Alisdair’, but that money will also pay for a brand new quote. Alasdair Gray also pointed out that the original, ‘Work as if you live in the early days of a better nation’ was not written by him, but by a Canadian poet.'
And just to add the the gaiety of nations, here is a Chinese news channel on Tiger Woods -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7i5FlC1MpkE&feature=player_embedded
Delia's holding a 'turkey clinic' on woman's hour. ye gods.
ReplyDeleteAnd Boudican - bless you for your comment last night. "Question and Challenge" is something of a parenting motto for my dears...
ReplyDeleteCheers Philippa, my mate Meleagris gallopavo's broken her leg, I'll get her to give Delia a call.....
ReplyDeleteMy housemate was watching Delia while I was making mince pies the other night, I ignored all her instructions, they still turned out alright!
Dot - for legs, she seems to be recommending a casserole. But fortunately George Lamb has been punted off the mid morning slot on 6Music, so I am now listening to Lauren Laverne.
ReplyDelete13th Duke - I am beginning to get a complex :)
ReplyDeleteAnd as for this: ''That's because the rest of them on here are fast asleep living off the fat of our taxes through benefit scrounging.
They normally get up after noon, switch on their ultraplasma 647'' uber screen tv and watch Jermey Kyle which they've recorded on sky plus. All paid for by yourself, Alasdair and me.''
How did you so eerily and accurately depict my day? Just finished watching Jezza (golfball licker) and it was a good one. Actually I am more of a Matthew Wright girl myself. The political incisiveness is a thing to behold!
Ellis! Knew I would forget someone good! Will have to add them even though seconds don't count!
Re Bhopal, it is truly horrific what is happening still to the people there. Children born with tumors where there eyes should be - truly heartbreaking stuff. I was shocked to read the difference in payouts - it shows high low we hold the value of human life.
PhilippaB said: Delia's holding a 'turkey clinic' on woman's hour. ye gods.
ReplyDeleteHopefully the clinic will be successful and the turkey will make a full recovery.
on this banking bonus / threatened resignation thing, Lord Miners seems happy to say that the proposed levels of payment are unreasonable but not to give any idea of what would be reasonable. sounds like somebody desperately trying to walk a fine line between populism and his darkest inner desires...
ReplyDeleteplus - is anybody else bewildered by talk of a 'banking community'? i'm just imagining their meetings in the local church hall...
princess: As the eminent commenter said on the nominations thread, where he nominated you (though possibly not in his first post, therefore effectively not nominating you):
ReplyDelete"She (princesschipchops) seems to have fallen in with a bit of a bad crowd."
I presume he means nous, the Untrusted. Therefore you should consider posting hardly ever here, or risk losing BTH's esteem.
Philippa,
ReplyDelete''community'' can be found in the New Labour bullshit, rhetorical, meaningless Nuspeak dictionary.
©Modernising Nihilsts Publishing House 1994
In amongst 'cohesion', 'pathfinder', 'incentivise', 'engagement', 'stakeholder'.....
Private eye has a 'communities' section in each edition.
Bankers, bout time they officially swapped the B for the W!
ReplyDeleteBunch of Parus majors the lot of them
Speaking of which, where's that no witted mustelid today?
Not in the door 10 minutes and already well into my first glass of wine. That's the sort of day it's been.
ReplyDeleteHave just found Jay's highly recommended post on the Sagar thread. A good 'un indeed.
ReplyDeleteElementary - well it is true that you have all led me astray. But I am having such problems getting online at the moment that my time here these days is limited. Therefore the effects may not be too toxic on my easily led brain!
ReplyDeleteWhy oh why is MAM getting so much support. Really weird.
Re the bankers - there have been a few unsavory ones turning up on the bonuses threads throwing their weight around and telling everyone they need the bonuses like, cause they're worth it. You know a bit like Cheryl Cole or some other Loreal babe!
Oh and that the rest of us are jealous, hate-filled garbage or as one nicely put it detritus - lovely. They are right about one thing I do hate em!
My rat-smelling nose thinks that many of the MAM recommenders are sock puppets. I've never seen most of them before.
ReplyDeleteThaumaturge,
ReplyDeleteDrinking already? you are not setting us a good example.
Thanks for the nomination, pity it had to be with that scruffy columba livia.
Yes indeed, Colin, it had to be done. Sorry for lumping you in with the bird-brained.
ReplyDeleteHey thauma, thanks for the big up for me "from the grave", haha. Now play nice ;-)
ReplyDeleteJust got round to the Sagar thread.
ReplyDelete''WHOOOOAAFF!'' (as legendary weetabix haired Scottish commenator Archie MacPherson used to shout) that was a hell of a post Jay. Generation Warfare!
Alasdair's post on the Fabians and cosied cliques that deign to rule us was also excellent.
Also enjoyed the postmodernist sparring on WADDYYA and don't worry Jay, I don't want fisticuffs, I'm just fuming that you 'outpostmodernificationalised' my postmodern jibber jabber ;)
Sheff, just saw you nominated me. Cheers. To say thanks, here's a compliment in Glaswegian, which, having lived there I'm sure you'll be able to translate:
''yuraweecrackersoyeurr!''
Awright, who is selfmademan? Anyone we know, perchance? Very droll, m'dear!
ReplyDeleteBW, play nice? There's one problem with that.
ReplyDeleteThauma you know selfmade I'm sure ;-)
ReplyDeleteAnyway, thanks for the tune - off for lasagne now, and catch up with last night's Spooks.
That show's just getting sillier.
Evening all.
ReplyDelete"Delia's holding a turkey clinic..."
Whereas Bindel is holding a turkey-baster clinic
*badumching*
God I'm tired. Long day and trains all fuxx0rd. Will potter about a bit and see what's happening on CiF
don't laugh, BB, Stonewall has a guide to 'home-insemination' for lesbians. I would try to find it for you, but we're about to eat...
ReplyDeleteBW - mon cher, pas devant les doméstiques: tu dis - er, slightly hints - que c'est toi, alors ? Ou bien quelqu'un d'autre que je connaisse ? Ah merde, Jessica pour une va tout entendre ! (Peut-être. Given the ropey French.) Et moi, je n'ai aucune idée si tu parles français!
ReplyDeleteMr Selfmade doesn't pop up very often but he's very funny when he does. Is he you then Mr Weed?.
ReplyDeleteRe: Spooks - Rupert Penry Jones got blown up a while back, right?
ReplyDeleteOnly reason I used to watch it.
[sigh]
[more prolonged sigh]
God, Philippa, my biggest nightmare is insemination. (Not the *possibility* of insemination, you understand - far from it.) Really can't get my head around people actively seeking it.
ReplyDeleteI understand this makes me something of a weirdo. But I work in IT, so I'm used to that.
my biggest nightmare is insemination?
ReplyDeleteOh dear. Nightmare visions now of thauma fighting off a giant turkey baster which shouts 'incoming' ...
You asked for it - "Pregnant Pause: A guide for lesbians on how to get pregnant"
ReplyDeletehttp://www.stonewall.org.uk/at_home/parenting/3463.asp
Brace! Brace!
PhilippaB
ReplyDeleteBrace! Brace!
Isn't that what they say when they've got your immobilised with your legs in those stirrup thingys ...
Oh lordy. Not sure I want to look at that link.
ReplyDeleteI will change the subject - heard some really juicy goss at lunch time about two police officers in the East End who have been disciplined for charging a bloke they brought in as a drunk and disorderly with assaulting a police officer. The drunk had injuries himself that he is alleged to have sustained at the time of arrest.
Complaint made - CPS keep asking for a copy of the CCTV of the cell and eventually someone finds it for them after swearing blind there isn't any.
Turns out the two officers went into the cell of the bloke while he was asleep, put a blanket over his head and beat the shit out of him.
So apparently the disciplinary involved the panel showing the CCTV and then picking up the officers' statements one by one and saying "So you say in your statement that he punched you five or six times - would you like to indicate to us on the CCTV footage which punches you mean?"
Bastards. I hope they get the sack.
MsChin - big belly laugh there! (Pun intended of couse.)
ReplyDeleteWeird dream the other night: massive cyclone or something that was tossing cars around like bubbles, including one car right through the wall of the house, and then I found a baby in the house (which I think I'd forgotten about but luckily it was all right), but it was all OK because I could log into the servers and they were all up and running smoothly.
Make of that what you will.
BB - the sack? Yes, that and a bit of GBH that no-one can find a culprit for.
ReplyDeleteselfmademan is truly excellent. The identity was blown once, when a selfmademan post went out under another username, but I won't spill the beans (not me).
ReplyDeleteBtw Montana - forgot to say - excellent post at the top.
ReplyDeleteNytol, off to bed now....
Sweet dreams, thauma.
ReplyDeleteAnd should your dreams be less than sweet tonight, use a giant diaphragm. That'll stop the blighters if they get loose.
Alisdair
ReplyDeleteOh please do spill the beans - I'm dying to know....
sheff
ReplyDeleteYes, let's press for the sordid details. I like a good grass, as you know.
selfmademan is very amusing. A fitting tribute to the late William Donaldson.
ReplyDeleteThe Complete Henry Root Letters
I wonder if BTH was born with that stair-rod up his arse, or whether it has been inserted in later life?
ReplyDeletescherfig
ReplyDelete£13 for a well-thumbed copy? Can I borrow yours?
mschin, sadly out of print now. A child of his times, Henry Root. If I recall correctly, he wrote an adoring letter to General Zia, President of Pakistan, praising martial law and capital punishment - and got an autographed photo back!
ReplyDeleteDoes nobody here remember 'Henry Root' - selfmademan certainly does.
Does anyone have any idea why Leni aka afanncdogge can't post on here at the moment? She has mentioned it a coupla times on Waddya. Any ideas?
ReplyDeleteBB
ReplyDeleteDidn't fence say something along similar lines recently?
i always get an error message that says my post will not work,,i ignore it and repeat the "post comment" click and the second time (usually) it works,,
ReplyDeleteDid he? I didn't see it.
ReplyDeleteNasty side-swipe at princesschipchops on the nominations thread - something about "hanging around with the wrong sort" meaning us.
The man's a weasel. I don't know why I still get annoyed by him, really.
except that time when it worked normal,,first time ever
ReplyDelete3p4
ReplyDeleteMaybe that's it. Or maybe her log-in isn't working. Or she needs to clear her caches out or something...
3p4 - I find the same thing happens, usually when I first log in, I just ignore it and keep posting, it gets through after a couple of tries.
ReplyDeleteBB - bth is beyond all understanding - there is something creepy about him that I really don't like, he gives me the heebie jeebies.
Scerfig, William Donaldson was a very fine writer but an appalling man.
ReplyDeleteOne of his delights was inventing snippets of information in 'toilet books'. One of my favourite of such snippets was that Lee van Cleef was a noted collector of modern art - a monstrous fib I have seen quoted as fact.
I remember a couple of years ago Any Amount of Books had the dedication copy of the Henry Root Letters for sale at about forty quid.
So this is it. Nice.
ReplyDeleteAnd just when I thought my self-esteem couldn't sink any lower, I've done something quite horrible and disgusting today.
ReplyDeleteI did a "find on this page" search for my name on the stiffie awards thread. Nice words from some very nice people, but I have cheapened myself. Oh well, never mind... I still know me.
a very fine writer but an appalling man Yeah, Edwin, that's my recollection of him. Amusing stuff, all the same.
ReplyDeleteHello luke.
ReplyDeleteNo, selfmade is not moi, unfortunately.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, *Roz* is the only reason to watch Spooks
Cor. She's one hard bitch. Yummy.
As for the "can't post here" thing - re Leni - you have to have a blogger id - takes about forty seconds to sort out...
Unless people are kept from fully accessing blogging sites by their work firewall ??
Thauma - you got the answers sweetcheeks ?
PS princesschipchops "hanging out with the wrong types". lol. That has actually made me titter.
Night all, hurly start fe me agin.
Yo luke.
ReplyDeleteI only had a couple of posts devoured, not a general *Comment ist verboten*.
ReplyDeleteThauma: IT & fear of insemination. Have you been watching Demon Seed?
I've never been a "wrong crowd" before. Do I get a Vespa?
ReplyDeleteBB,,i think there is probably a strong conection
ReplyDeletebetween the police incident you detail above and the 'dramafied' list of paperwork detailed in the times story mentioned by you and chancetheg
over at 'the otherplace',,(waddya)
(this is 'the' place,,they are the 'other' place
inspectorgadgets blog is one of my everyday must reads,,and i occasionally have left links to relevant guardian threads
that time i got the error message,,
ReplyDeleteI think bitey has finally lost it on the Ciffie thread. Very weird.
ReplyDeleteFence - deffo a Vespa and a parka, mate.
ReplyDeleteEvening Luke.
Bitterweed - did you find the plug-in you needed for those mp3s? I wonder if it is cos one of them is in flac format...
heyhabib
ReplyDeleteI would never do a search on the page! How could you!
(I just spent hours scrolling through all the posts instead...) xx
scherf - that last comment about Stephen Gately was bizarro in the extreme.
ReplyDeleteIs this on the Ciffie contributor thread? I didn't see it?
ReplyDeleteNot sure I can carry off a parka, but I will listen to Liquidator instead.
Bizarre, yes, but KillingTime came up with a cracker in response:
ReplyDelete'It's funny because it's true. My freezer's absolutely bursting with tramps. One more and I'm going to have to start taking them down to Iceland'.
Ah is it thread of the year? [footsteps trailing away...]
ReplyDeleteSorry, fence - tendency to forget that the psychic waves between UTers don't work so well at times ... the thread of the year thread is where it's at.
ReplyDeleteok possums - time for bed for me xx
ReplyDeleteMe too, BB.
ReplyDeleteHappy days - it's Friday tomorrow!
Then unfortunately I nipped back to the Ciffies thread. Now it's definitely time to read a nice book in my nice warm bed. Night y'all.
Gawd. Is he pissed? That's a bit off, even for him.
ReplyDeleteread a nice book in my nice warm bed I agree. Strangely, at the moment I'm re-reading A S Byatt's 'Posession'. Uncomfortably apposite.
ReplyDeleteDoes OldBagpuss still post? I don't recall seeing him for a while.
ReplyDeleteFencewalker, you should ask Edwin about that.
ReplyDeleteJust read the thread-of-the-year thread. I have no idea what Bitey's on about and I'm pretty sure he doesn't either.
ReplyDeleteAhhh, thankee. It's like being at a Venetian masque sometimes.
ReplyDeleteWell, that's all to the good. OldBagpuss was always worth reading.
Bitey does seem to be going through his "Herbert Lom" period at the mo.
ReplyDeleteFence,
ReplyDeleteHerbert Lom as Inspector Dreyfuss with the twitching eye and homicidal tendencies, forever missing his target? Or Herbert Lom as the arab who gets run over by El Cid's horse?
hmmm...
Christ, he's still at it and the mods have taken to deleting as fast as he can spit, phlegm and hoik them out.
ReplyDeleteI'm beginning to think that the graveyard shift is the one that sends the cold shiver down the spine of CiF mods.