tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post4145786961779847042..comments2023-05-21T15:20:58.352+01:00Comments on The Untrusted: 29/07/10Montana Wildhackhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11409705185204787671noreply@blogger.comBlogger177125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-31304275234923733522010-07-30T05:57:32.703+01:002010-07-30T05:57:32.703+01:00Amen!Amen!Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11865148437450521947noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-2324319441723791612010-07-30T05:17:08.999+01:002010-07-30T05:17:08.999+01:00Complicit in a purge? Kiz and Bru left of their o...Complicit in a purge? Kiz and Bru left of their own volition. How could I be complicit in something that never happened?<br /><br />And I don't see any little terriers here, myself. But maybe that's because the view is being blocked by a couple of massive egos that seem to believe that the place couldn't carry on without their antagonism.Montana Wildhackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11409705185204787671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-75981784701122536092010-07-30T04:21:52.917+01:002010-07-30T04:21:52.917+01:00PeterBracken: "Government, by definition, res...PeterBracken: "Government, by definition, restricts our actions..."<br /><br />Stupid. How the hell was the right to vote gradually extended other than by government? Whose actions did those government measures restrict? If nobody's, then explain your reasoning, Bracken Minor.<br /><br />PeterBracken: "Name me a freedom extant 800 years ago that does not prevail today."<br /><br />The rule of thumb. A freedom for wife-beating husbands.<br /><br />Not to mention serfdom, or droit-de-seigneur. Both of which were freedoms of the rich and powerful to exploit the poor and weak.<br /><br />You're an idiot, Bracken. A privately-educated New Labour idiot who would struggle to find a street corner to beg on if you had to live by the dogma you preach.HankScorpiohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13220200282805558779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-8297203399467124892010-07-30T03:40:33.026+01:002010-07-30T03:40:33.026+01:00Paul
Yes there is a discussion there - however as...Paul<br /><br />Yes there is a discussion there - however as Britain slowly sinks below the waves and jobs disappear there will be fewer people wanting to come here and more wanting to leave. <br /><br />Already the move tostop nonEU immigrants has been condemned by employers as we are not producing enough people educated and able to work in the desired aeas.<br />It is a very complex debate. Not just about numbers - it is about education, drection we are taking socially and politically, how much food we can produce and a myriad other things. <br /><br />Anyway - it's past my bed time. <br /><br />Nightynight xLenihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01755748505260253288noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-37454541315307947852010-07-30T03:40:15.845+01:002010-07-30T03:40:15.845+01:00@Montana
"Does there have to be a point?&quo...@Montana<br /><br />"Does there have to be a point?"<br /><br />Well, yeh, I always thought that there was a point to this place initially. We might disagree about what the point was, and I know that you set it up as a place where you could carry on conversations which were cut short by Cif when you wanted those debates to carry on.<br /><br />That's a point, isn't it?<br /><br />If you thought that this was just a place to "enjoy each other's company", why were you complicit in purging this site of those who were happy to enjoy your company talking about shopping and opera and had no interest in left-liberal politics?<br /><br />FWIW, I like this site. I like what it's become. But part of the reason why it's a worthwhile site is because the likes of scherfig, and MF, and me, have challenged people from time to time, have asked what this site was meant to be for, have chased away the airheads and have attracted the more interesting posters.<br /><br />There's a bone for the little terriers to gnaw on.HankScorpiohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13220200282805558779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-2420536055024658372010-07-30T03:35:54.711+01:002010-07-30T03:35:54.711+01:00Hank and Leni
I'd really like to respond to y...Hank and Leni<br /><br />I'd really like to respond to your comments in more detail than an iPod/fat fingers/dodgy wireless combination will allow, so if it's ok, I'll do so tomorrow when I'm on a proper computer.<br /><br />Apologies, but it would literally take me hours using this....<br /><br />Goodnight (all)...James Dixonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16299357339538257569noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-16012928474515345912010-07-30T03:29:56.397+01:002010-07-30T03:29:56.397+01:00Leni
Fair enough.But if we agree that any substan...Leni<br /><br />Fair enough.But if we agree that any substantial increase in population is likely to have more negative than positive effects then don,t we need to face up to that.And don,t we need to have a debate as to what the optimum population of this country should be.And of course how we achieve and maintain it at that optimum level.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11865148437450521947noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-3312350031616899792010-07-30T03:25:35.183+01:002010-07-30T03:25:35.183+01:00James
if a fairer and more distributive system ca...James<br /><br />if a fairer and more distributive system can take hold it may reach a position where it can challenge the older , more deeply ingrained power systems. If the economic initiative falls to them they have the same choices the powerful nations have always had.<br /><br />They can either be supportive of all nations or develope their economies to their own advantage by exploiting others.Lenihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01755748505260253288noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-62466441734744533642010-07-30T03:18:13.427+01:002010-07-30T03:18:13.427+01:00James
The change will come as a result of a shift...James<br /><br />The change will come as a result of a shift in control of energy resources. Let's be honest, that's been at the heart of every single international crisis since the fall of Saigon.<br /><br />In the early 70s, and especially after the "oil shock" arising from the Yom Kippur War and the muscle-flexing of OPEC, Kissinger and Brzezinski realised that the great threat to the hegemony of American capitalism wasn't communism so much as the dependence of the Western way of life on oil, which is why the theatre of war shifted to the Middle East.<br /><br />That explains in part why we are no longer at war with Eastasia and have never been at war with Eastasia. Eurasia is our enemy and has always been our enemy.<br /><br />More pertinently, as far as your point is concerned, there is a real chance that the likes of Chavez and Morales can exploit their mineral wealth for all it's worth. <br /><br />And, let's hope, they can exploit it for the good of the people they represent, rather than, as the Arab sheikhs did, use it for the enrichment of a tiny elite in both the Gulf and in Texas.<br /><br />So, globally, there's a good chance that your optimistic outlook will be borne out.<br /><br />As for the UK, the time has passed, the money has been offshored, the communities have been gated, and there are no credible and legal vehicles to protest against that or to redress the position.<br /><br />The damage has been done here, and I think it's pretty much irretrievable unless something extraordinary happens.HankScorpiohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13220200282805558779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-9330135539124017842010-07-30T03:13:57.616+01:002010-07-30T03:13:57.616+01:00This comment has been removed by the author.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11865148437450521947noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-71730459745194372182010-07-30T03:10:35.794+01:002010-07-30T03:10:35.794+01:00Montana
Chatting to people, discussing all sorts ...Montana<br /><br />Chatting to people, discussing all sorts and everything, music and silliness. All part of life. Thee is nothing wrong with the site. I/m happy here.<br /><br />I don't think anybody really expected to change th world. That would be somewhat arrogant I think.Lenihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01755748505260253288noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-80438428310474926882010-07-30T03:06:46.128+01:002010-07-30T03:06:46.128+01:00Paul
I have seen varius population forecasts. I a...Paul<br /><br />I have seen varius population forecasts. I am always reluctant to get into the Malthusian argument because it inevitably gets into the reproduction rates of various groups deemed unworthy. <br /><br />It becomes like Crufts or bloodline discussions around what constitutes a full Arabian horse. SElective breeding for worthwhile characteristics. We call it eugenics.<br /><br />There is a discussion around the human carrying capacity of Britain - I see it more in terms of how we provide for people rather than how can we stop people having more children.Lenihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01755748505260253288noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-15454465704541067932010-07-30T03:00:36.221+01:002010-07-30T03:00:36.221+01:00Does there have to be a point? What's wrong w...Does there have to be a point? What's wrong with people just enjoying each other's company -- even if it is online rather than face-to-face? <br /><br />Anyone who doesn't like the site is free to stop reading & posting here. If it turns out that everyone stops reading & posting after awhile, them's the breaks. The place has already had a decent run, as far as I'm concerned. I'd miss people. I'd hope that I'd maintain friendships with at least some of the people here -- but I couldn't possibly feel disappointed that the place somehow didn't fulfill an important role in my life at exactly the time when I needed it.<br /><br />What's wrong with that? Why isn't that enough?Montana Wildhackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11409705185204787671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-55914004144929096252010-07-30T03:00:23.474+01:002010-07-30T03:00:23.474+01:00Hank
No small discussion group - IRLr on line - w...Hank<br /><br />No small discussion group - IRLr on line - will change the world. Very few realise the challenge faced by millions. They are unaware of let alone comprehend the forces that control us. Most settle for the best they can manage within the existing system. <br /><br />we all settle for it to some extent simply because we have to go on living. We may see the flaws, the narrowing horizons but we can do little other than vent our ange and frustration. <br /><br />Power structures develop and transmute, social and economic analyses which are pertinent in one age are irrelevant in the next.<br /><br />apart from recognising that top down power structurs have always existed - and complaining about them - nothing in terms of real change has ever happened. We no longer burn people on bonfires but we still kill them slowly - all their - and our own - hopes and ambitions. <br /><br />Different system have been attempted but always the few have risen to the top dragging wealth and power with them. <br /><br />The most we can do is try to stop the worst excesses damaging the most vulnerable and helping those we can see and touch. The rest is theory.<br /><br />Within our work areas, where we may have a little influence, we can try to change some things from within. Even there we may be but passing influences or fail completely.<br /><br />Waste of time or otherwise - i feel the need to at least speak out - even when I know it is shouting into the abyss. My own humanity and sense of my own frailty and that of others demands it of me.<br /><br />Perhaps I am a fool - who knows ?<br /><br />xxLenihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01755748505260253288noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-74184322682866855602010-07-30T02:50:49.598+01:002010-07-30T02:50:49.598+01:00Hank,
I do sometimes, maybe, get the impression t...Hank,<br /><br />I do sometimes, maybe, get the impression that things are, perhaps, changing.<br />Possibly!?<br /><br />There seems to be more and more people willing to stand up against the 'consensus' or conventional wisdom, and, importantly, they're reaching a wider, more receptive audience.<br /><br />Neo-liberal, Chicago school, Washington consensus type shitethink has been effectively and eloquently rebuked by an increasingly vocal and prominent group of scholars, authors and, sometimes, journalists.<br /><br />Obviously, it's not nearly enough, but it's arguably a better start.<br /><br />Also, the political and economic left here in Latin America is, at least to some extent, providing a potential point of hope/optimism....<br /><br />Maybe....James Dixonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16299357339538257569noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-25926889856713698302010-07-30T02:40:59.250+01:002010-07-30T02:40:59.250+01:00Good point Hank: there must be millions of website...Good point Hank: there must be millions of websites all over the world just like this one whose participants think they can take over the World because they have access to the Internet.<br />TBh none of us knows how the Internet will pan out!chekhovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12579841013364541334noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-36983213505958164942010-07-30T02:20:20.399+01:002010-07-30T02:20:20.399+01:00"I guess I've just never understood how t..."I guess I've just never understood how they manage to make anyone else believe that it could possibly work."<br /><br />You think "anyone else" spends much time thinking about how it could possibly work? How many people care enough to think about it?<br /><br />That's the key to their ongoing success, and why the 0.01% of us who care enough to speak our brains on here or on Cif are wasting our fucking time.<br /><br />As I said, we're just letting off steam. None of this is ever gonna change anything.<br /><br />The best I ever hoped for was changing the minds of a few idiot trolls on Cif or exposing the hypocrisy of the middle class liberals above the line posing as radicals.<br /><br />As you're well aware, I got banned for exposing the hypocrisy of Cif. And as for changing the minds of the idiot trolls, I haven't bothered with a new alias since Election Day.<br /><br />The question scherfig posed was, in a nutshell, what's the point of the Untrusted.<br /><br />The bigger question is, what's the point of any online discussion anymore?HankScorpiohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13220200282805558779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-56625244010088348632010-07-30T02:19:30.479+01:002010-07-30T02:19:30.479+01:00Leni
Can,t sleep.Actually feel better sitting up....Leni<br /><br />Can,t sleep.Actually feel better sitting up.When one of us is sick we tend to sleep apart so yours truly is confined to the spare room right now whilst partner and cat sleep.<br /><br />Anyway according to the latest population projections the UK population is now predicted to peak at 80 million compared to 62 million today.Making us the most populous country in Europe as the German population is projected to decline and French population growth is lower.Worst of all most of the population increase will take place in England which is already more densely population than the Netherlands.<br /><br />Can you imagine what the quality of life will be like here if these population projections turn out to be true.Plus of course the greater vulnerability of the population due to increased dependancy on food imports.At present we produce about 60% of our food but that % is declining as the population increases.<br /><br />When is there gonna be the political will to look at population control in this country.Or are we destined to become so fucking over-crowded we,ll burst.<br /><br />Methinks i,ll migrate to Ireland.As i have an Irish -born mother i automatically qualify for citizenship there.And despite their economic problems one thing the Irish Republic doesn,t lack is space.<br /><br />This country is well and truly fucked!Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11865148437450521947noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-85766215240120354612010-07-30T02:14:58.843+01:002010-07-30T02:14:58.843+01:00@Hank: nowt to argue about there. I don't disa...@Hank: nowt to argue about there. I don't disagree with you!chekhovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12579841013364541334noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-89223605776148038342010-07-30T02:05:25.021+01:002010-07-30T02:05:25.021+01:00Fairness is only ever likely to happen, chekhov, w...Fairness is only ever likely to happen, chekhov, when people are better informed about the extent to which society is unfair. <br /><br />Unfortunately, there are very few media outlets concerned with fairness.<br /><br />And as a result, very little light is shone on the issues which might make people angry.<br /><br />For as long as Cif can run threads on the emergence of "ugly people" in the media, and fail to run discussion pieces on "nepotism" or "ugly middle class blandness and hypocrisy" in the media, comment will never be free, nor will the discussion about our future ever be truly informed and open.HankScorpiohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13220200282805558779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-4227464670142356612010-07-30T01:59:15.191+01:002010-07-30T01:59:15.191+01:00...the privatisation of public services is the mos...<i>...the privatisation of public services is the most useful conduit by which to legally redistribute wealth upwards.</i><br /><br />Oh, I know that that's the ultimate aim. I guess I've just never understood how they manage to make anyone else believe that it could possibly work.Montana Wildhackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11409705185204787671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-66772406374268373432010-07-30T01:58:35.232+01:002010-07-30T01:58:35.232+01:00Anyway, I am going to bed.Anyway, I am going to bed.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-42158819457428554752010-07-30T01:57:43.979+01:002010-07-30T01:57:43.979+01:00You'd be surprised Hank. Scotland has an amazi...You'd be surprised Hank. Scotland has an amazing tradition of granting education to all regardless of family background, and this is why Scotland has such an illustrious history of inventors and inventions (even if many had already left Scotland)and why you will find many Scottish proffesionals in England and of course all round the globe.<br /><br />Scotland may not have the resources, but it certainly has the human capital.<br /><br />frankly I agree about tax havens. Fucking bastards. Especially the channel islands. Jumped up twats. Is it the Barclay brothers that own Sark? There was an amusing story in private eye recently, I recall.<br />Paying tax is a social duty. If ever (ie almost never) I got the privelige of getting a high income, of course I would pay tax.<br /><br />The proffessor plums'es and Happhazards of the world talk personally about it as if one person at the dole queue is personally robbing him of money. Jumped up twats.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-68379248768901247422010-07-30T01:53:16.321+01:002010-07-30T01:53:16.321+01:00@Hank:"fairness" as if that is ever goin...@Hank:"fairness" as if that is ever going to happen!chekhovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12579841013364541334noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141707904735688626.post-30769715475523104352010-07-30T01:44:00.174+01:002010-07-30T01:44:00.174+01:00Leni
Jeez i really didn,t know that.Makes it even...Leni<br /><br />Jeez i really didn,t know that.Makes it even worse.Whatever happened to medical professionals putting the needs of their patients first?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11865148437450521947noreply@blogger.com